Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

danglybanger

ReelItInologist
Yes. This aims for the vault ;)

Not that even 10% of the guitar owning population has even HEARD of these things or seen a real one, but IMO there are more untruths and general inexperience concerning this guitar and its setup than any other, so hopefully someday, even after I'm gone (;)), people can point to this thread and be directed on how to get a stable guitar that stays in tune, lol. Guitars from the Jag and Mustang branches typically sound and feel very different from each other, but as they're often lumped into the same category and DO have similarities, they'll be considered together.

Starting with the most initially bewildering part of encountering these guitars...

JAG/JM SWITCHING

-On a jag, the 3 switches on the lower bout control pickups. the two closer to the neck control neck and bridge pickup (pup is on when switch is flipped up), while the switch nearest the bridge is a bright switch. On a JM, you get a big dumb 3 way toggle and no bright switch ;)

-The rhythm presets (neck pickup with individual volume and tone controls, with lower pot values) can be selected by flipping the switch on the top bout up. When in this mode, the bottom 3 switches have no effect.

MUSTANG SWITCHING

-each pickup is off when its respective switch is centered. Flipping the switch either way, left or right, turns that pickup on. When both switches are facing the same direction (both left or both right), the pickups are in phase with each other. Flipping the switches in opposite (that is both out or both in) gets you the out of phase tone.

Bridges and trems are typically the second place where people encounter problems with these guitars...

BRIDGES

-the bridge, first of all SHOULD NOT have the posts taped, and should be the stock bridge or a roller bridge if you want the guitar to stay in tune at all. (with trem use)

-The bridge's intonation should be set with the bridge centered, with equal distance between the front and back of the cups. When the trem is used, the bridge should move forwards and backwards slightly, and come back to center. On an RI bridge, the posts are adjustable with tiny allen wrenches, on vintage axes you have to take it off and twist the poles.

-This setup is best achieved (on Jag and JM bridges) by putting the bridge as low to the body as possible, 2mm maybe, enough that it can rock (may be a bit more difficult and require shimming of the neck if the original mute is in use), and adjusting the SADDLES up for the action. Un/Shimming the neck may be necessary to make this happen.

-On a Mustang bridge, make sure the neck is shimmed properly to allow for the above to happen once again.

-Jag/JM bridges won't rattle at all when the saddles are "locked" in the high up position that should be necessary with the above setup. If you find that strings are slipping out under heavy pick attack, just file the grooves in the threads down, take it to a tech if you don't trust yourself with doing this smoothly. Also, Jap bridges have screws that are entirely too long and may need to be cut to prevent them interfering with the strings. The threaded saddles are nice as they allow adjustable spacing...

-DO NOT use a buzzstop if you want to use the trem. They typically push the bridge forward with use, not allowing it to rock, and give another point of resistance for the strings to catch on. A proper, good jag should resonate fine, and stay in tune as well as a locking trem (though don't expect as much range :laugh2:)

-DON'T remove the string that someone shoved between the bridge cups and control plate :laugh2:
 
Last edited:
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

JAG/JM TREM

-The big screw in the center controls where you want it to float. To use the tremlock button, it should be set so that when the button is on, it slides smoothly in and won't allow any upbend. If a string breaks, you can put this button on and retain proper tuning.

-There are VAST differences between the Jap and US trems. The US will lock the arm in, Japs won't (alleviate this by either replacing the bushing on a Jap, or tightening the tabs with pliars). The biggest fault in the Jap bridge is that the arms are often cut too long and bottom out on the trem cavity. cut the arm as necessary.

-On many trems the string winds can rub against the screws directly in front of them on the trem, usually this isn't an issue, but make sure there aren't any burrs on this screw. Also, because of the straight string pull, put a dab of solder on high e string wraps BEFORE you put them on to prevent them from unwinding.

MUSTANG TREM


-Float is set by two means- the springs can be placed on the outer holes or inner holes when you remove the trem, placing them on the outer holes sets the trem for downbend only, on the inner holes it is set to float.

-Fine adjustment for any setting inbetween can be achieved with an allen wrench on the two post holes at the top of the tailpiece bar.

-the strings load from the FRONT and wrap BENEATH the bar :laugh2: Also, if you encounter a guitar with the trem set to "float" but the bar WAY up an inch in the air, likely someone has attempted to float the trem without reallizing they could move the springs. This setup can create problems, correct it because you know how to now. The Mustang trem should stay in tune as well or better than a well set up Strat trem.

NECKS (Jag, Mustang)

-It's best to use high guage strings as these guitars are shorter scale than typical (barely), high guage strings help keep the bridges in place, and say 11s should feel no different than 9s or 10s would on most other axes.

-If the neck has 22 frets, it's 24" scale, 21 frets are 22.5" scale (found on some mustangs, duos, and musicmasters). These necks are interchangable on any axe with a 24 scale.

-Don't use too many wraps on the tuners (cut strings "2 tuners back" before inserting them into the klusons) and have a well filed nut.

BODIES

-Vintage Jag/JM bodies are all alder. The same goes for all USAV bodies.

-Vintage Mustang bodies are mostly poplar, except for some surprises in mahogany, and a few 70s things in ash where they wanted to show plenty of grain...

-Jap Jag/JM bodies were all basswood until about 1996, when the switch was made to alder on MOST finishes (antigua, J Mascis sigs, a few other odder varieties remained basswood). Sunbursts were always however done in alder. Note that while this is around the MIJ/CIJ switch, don't believe anyone who says that this is a clear indicator of anything, while it's true that all CIJs (special finishes excepted) are alder, SOME MIJs are indeed alder. Also, there's no difference between MIJ/CIJ/import/export guitar quality, don't believe anyone who says there is, aside from select finishes only being offered in japan, as well as optional blocked and bound necks. In general, don't care about this. Copper shielding stopped being used around 1997.

-Jap Mustangs (the only sort now made) with contours are MG69s and are all basswood, with the exception of a few rendered in ash as 70s RIs. Without contours, these bodies are MG65s and poplar, and have copper shielding.

Pickguards aren't interchangeable between US/Jap axes.

PICKUPS

-Jag pickups have always been about equivalent to strat pickups, but with the claw for shielding, and different base. The tonal difference in Jags is because of the pots and hardware, not the pickups. USAV pickups seem to have been wound mellower to get a more "acceptable" tone by most players ears, but who cares, you can EQ them out. Jap pickups are NOT potted and will like to squeal under high gain. US pickups are. Jap jags have standard wiring, US Jags utilize cloth.

-Jap JM pickups are NOT wound like vintage or AV pickups (which sound mellower). They're more like strat pickups with diff covers. Not a bad thing, but if you want the JM tone, upgrade.

-Mustang pickups are strat pickups really, but they need flat polepieces to fit under the covers. Cloth wiring is standard on MG65s.

ALSO


-A 90s, MIM duo sonic is basically just a whole other beast, don't even TRY interchanging necks with it. Same goes for Squier Jagmasters, and Musicmasters (only Squier MMs that is)

-the headstock should always match the body color. Tone. Except on early Mustangs, where this difference is negligible ;)

Anyone got anything to add? :D Let's let this float around a bit and we'll vault it, add feedback or other suggestions, I don't think pics are really necessary but hell I might just add them anyway
 
Last edited:
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

Dangly I was thinking of you this weekend. I was going through some old photos and found a picture of my '63 Jag. This was my first good guitar that I bought sometime around 65 or 66. I can't remember. It was eventually stolen. It had been stripped to its natural wood before I got it. I will try to post a Pic of it. I'll have to scan it and see what I can do to get it up here. It was a very cool guitar and out of all the guitars I have owned (most I still do:D) I would really like to have this one back.
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

I want that J Mascis Jazzmaster big time.
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

Thank you for the thread, Slade.

I'm going to assume you thought of us original Duo-sonic owners as well when you thought of this thread, right? ;)

Not much to add, except that on a Duo or Musicmaster, the Warmoth compensated brass saddles work very well to fine tune intonation. The strings might move around a bit, due to them being top loaded instead of string thru like on a tele, but it's nothing one can't solve by carefully nothsing the saddles enough so that the string stays put.
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

MUSTANG TREM

-Float is set by two means- the springs can be placed on the outer holes or inner holes when you remove the trem, placing them on the outer holes sets the trem for downbend only, on the inner holes it is set to float.

Have to see a picture of that!
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

hah, that was the ONE thing I know that everyone really misses on the Mustang trem, and I'm pissed because I can't find the pics I took of mine before I installed it, so I might just take it off again :laugh2:

And aside from the switching on Duo 2s, a Duo is a simple beast ;)

On top of that, Guitarpartsresources.com has 6 saddle bridges for Duos/MMs, a Toronado bridge which has threaded saddles, and a Squier MM bridge which has strat saddles and is stringthrough.

I'd love to see pics, maybe this thread needs Jagporn too :D
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

This is definitely a vault candidate. I learned a lot. Are you dying or something?
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

haha, nooo, but I'm very arrogant, and worried about getting banned at some point or accidentally getting carried away and committing forum suicide over something stupid :D
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

Nice thread! Good info. I learned a lot. VAULT WORTHY!
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

ya know slade, i was thinking of you this weekend too.... :wink:
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

I really want a Jazzmaster/Jag with a Floyd Rose one of these days. Maybe a Warmoth. It'd solve the whole bridge being stupid thing.
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

If Jazzmasters didn't cost absolutely ungodly amounts, I would own one in an instant.
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

I really want a Jazzmaster/Jag with a Floyd Rose one of these days. Maybe a Warmoth. It'd solve the whole bridge being stupid thing.

Bridge is not stupid. READ AGAIN :D

A strat bridge or floyd has just as many quirks and is just as difficult to set up, the issue with Jag/Stang bridges and trems is that no one knows how to do this properly, whereas everyone knows how to set up a strat bridge. Plus benefits come with setting them up correctly over strat bridges ;)
 
Last edited:
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

I really want a Jazzmaster/Jag with a Floyd Rose one of these days. Maybe a Warmoth. It'd solve the whole bridge being stupid thing.

boo! read the post again. lol

I would imagine a floyd rose is harder to set up than a jag bridge...
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

Bridge is not stupid. READ AGAIN :D

A strat bridge or floyd has just as many quirks and is just as difficult to set up, the issue with Jag/Stang bridges and trems is that no one knows how to do this properly, whereas everyone knows how to set up a strat bridge. Plus benefits come with setting them up correctly over strat bridges ;)

You have heard my Jaguar (YouTube) and commented on it's Jaggy tone.

My bridge setup is quite different than yours and was developed back in the late 60's with my first Jaguar. By mistake while changing all the strings on my guitars at the same time (I had just received a 12 pack of string) , I had switched my Mustang bridge with the Jaguar. I immediately found that I liked that setup better than the stock Jaguar bridge and then started looking for ways to keep that jangly tone that the Jaguar bridge gave verses the Mustang and also Stratocaster 6 screw bridge tone.

I had already changed the volume and tone for the lead pup to that used by a Stratocaster and found that the pups had a brighter tone because of the CLAW.

Anyway, getting back to the bridge setups - I use a brass plumbing ferrule to keep the bridge centered into the post, yet able to move as the vibrato arm is used. You will need to sand down the ferrule to the proper height to ensure that the string height on the neck is within tolerance.

IT WORKS much better than the buzzstop and maintains proper pitch always...

Give it a try.

PS: Use at least 11-52 strings. I use 13-56.
 
Re: Jazzmaster/Jag/Stang/JagStang tutorial!!!

I was looking forward to input and discussion in this thread ;) and your jag DOES sound great :D

The Mustang bridge is a decent mod IMO but unnecessary, I like being able to adjust the spacing and individual string height on the Jag bridge. Mustang bridges are easier, but after 10 mins more setup a Jag bridge is just as good for the rest of your life. I'd almost put a jag bridge on a mustang.

I know that the claw makes a difference in the tone, but personally I think that's a negligible difference... The 1 meg pots however definitely make the difference, and make up for the shorter scale of the guitar imo by brightening it up.

I'm genuinely really interested in your bridge setup, as I don't quite understand how it keeps the bridge centered while allowing it to move... Mine stay centered in any case, unless I get aggressive in palm muting and knock it back (and even that is rare..) the bridge is almost impossible to knock askew in the mustang because of increased string tension...

+1 on using 11s ;) but I've used 10s before without any problem.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top