Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

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dynaflux

New member
This is my first (desperate) post. I've done lots of wiring also pretty complicated but now I'm totally stuck and lost. A customer asked me to do a Jimmy Page wiring and first I used a random schematic I found on the web, it didn't work - I checked and did some alterations but I supposed there was a fault so I decided to start all over again with the Seymour Duncan schematics but I'm stuck again. I have checked, checked and checked, measured, excluded components etc. I have searched all applicable forums including this - but no one mentions my symptoms.

What happen is following:

- When all knobs are pushed in neck pickup is working with the switch in neck and middle position. When I flip the pickup switch to bridge all is quiet.
- With the switch in brigde position (no sound as mentioned) I do get sound from the bridge pickup if I pull the series/parallell knob out. And with the pickup selector in the middle both pickups are engaged. So that's sort of good news - the basic parts are working. And I don't have any hum what so ever.

Components used:
4x CTS 500K push/pull pots
2x TAD .022mfd Sprague Orange Drops
Switchcraft pickup selector switch
Switchcraft output jack

The CTS are those new ones:

500p.jpg

http://www.stewmac.com/Pickups_and_...s/Potentiometers/CTS_Push_pull_Pots_DPDT.html

So they needed "transcription" from the traditional layout but after checking it more than twice I'm pretty sure I got it right. I should also point out the tone controls are in 50's wiring style.

I have checked, tested and measured:

Grounding (all pots grounded)
Switch with cables (no break, no short circuit)
Pickups
Pots, including switches

I have tried to follow the signal from bridge pickup with multimeter in different switching modes on the push/pulls and it seems to be fine. As mentioned I have measured the switches so I'm almost sure they're ok. I have also hooked up wires to a cord leading to an amp. I can follow the signal a bit on the way but I can't really draw any conclusions.

The best thing would be to have a schematic with the new CTS push/pulls. I have searched the net with no result.

I have been spending too many hours on this and I'm frustrated. So any help, input, idea and schematic would be helpful.
 
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Re: Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

Been there, done that- from my POV-

1. Breathe, hang in there and don't feel bad if you have to push back delivery date- Haste really does make waste, and unless this was a high pressure fast turn gig, I find that most customers are willing to wait for quality.

2. When I get really stuck, I literally print out multiple copies of the schematic (one for each switch setting), I highlight signal flow from one end to the other, and then I multi-meter- Most of the time, this is enough- just comparing what I see often reveals a switched wire, etc

3. And when that doesn't work, I start taking the non-working circuit apart to look for bad parts and read values that aren't possible when the parts are in situ.

As far as your build, a schematic would be nice, but immediate thoughts-
1. With all switches in, you should have nothing but 50s wiring, so confirm that first.

2. Sounds like your 3 way is fine if it can isolate all 3 pup combos in various configurations, so I would start tracing series and then OOP configs- either one could easily randomize pup selection if they are wired wrong.
 
Re: Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

Thanks for the support.

1. Breathing.... the guitar was a very special custom project and the customer became really [omitted] cause it took one year to accomplish. Nothing was easy with this build. Afterwards he requested the Jimmy Page wiring. Now he sends a mail once a day, really [omitted] off.

2. Printed, marked out.

3. I've done that but I'm going to exclude more parts.

4. With all pushed in there isn't the plain regular function.

5. Yepp, I'm into that OOP or S/P are messing things up. Can't just conclude what it is doing that.
 
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Re: Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

Number 4 tells you everything. When you get the base wiring working, it's very likely that you will have found the problem with the modification wiring. I hope this is back access as opposed to pick gaurd. There's something comforting about fixing a mistake and immediately strumming to confirm happy face.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
 
Re: Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

dynaflux said:
This is my first (desperate) post. I've done lots of wiring also pretty complicated but now I'm totally stuck and lost. A customer asked me to do a Jimmy Page wiring and first I used a random schematic I found on the web, it didn't work - I checked and did some alterations but I supposed there was a fault so I decided to start all over again with the Seymour Duncan schematics but I'm stuck again. I have checked, checked and checked, measured, excluded components etc. I have searched all applicable forums including this - but no one mentions my symptoms.

What happen is following:

- When all knobs are pushed in neck pickup is working with the switch in neck and middle position. When I flip the pickup switch to bridge all is quiet.
- With the switch in brigde position (no sound as mentioned) I do get sound from the bridge pickup if I pull the series/parallell knob out. And with the pickup selector in the middle both pickups are engaged. So that's sort of good news - the basic parts are working. And I don't have any hum what so ever.

Components used:
4x CTS 500K push/pull pots
2x TAD .022mfd Sprague Orange Drops
Switchcraft pickup selector switch
Switchcraft output jack

The CTS are those new ones:



So they needed "transcription" from the traditional layout but after checking it more than twice I'm pretty sure I got it right. I should also point out the tone controls are in 50's wiring style.

I have checked, tested and measured:

Grounding (all pots grounded)
Switch with cables (no break, no short circuit)
Pickups
Pots, including switches

I have tried to follow the signal from bridge pickup with multimeter in different switching modes on the push/pulls and it seems to be fine. As mentioned I have measured the switches so I'm almost sure they're ok. I have also hooked up wires to a cord leading to an amp. I can follow the signal a bit on the way but I can't really draw any conclusions.

The best thing would be to have a schematic with the new CTS push/pulls. I have searched the net with no result.

I have been spending too many hours on this and I'm frustrated. So any help, input, idea and schematic would be helpful.
Click to expand...


It sounds to me like series and parallel operation are reversed on this push pull and you are getting the series operation in the 'down' mode. When putting two pickups in series, unless you bypass the pickup selector one of the pickup selections will not work. This is because with both pickups in series the ground from one pickup is feeding the hot signal of the other pickup 'in line'. It is possible to do a JP wiring which bypasses the pickup selector in series mode to get rid of this 'silent' mode.

I didn't draw this diagram and have not checked it for accuracy, but pulled it from this another forum, and I figured it might help you and provide another option for your client.


LesPaul-JP-PW-22sounds-bp-ok.JPG


there are also several more diagrams on the thread so I would read through and choose the one that would work best for you if you decide to proceed down that path

http://music-electronics-forum.com/t1079/



Hope this helps, let us know how this works out or if there's anything else you need to complete the project
 
Re: Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

Problem solved! I started follow the bridge pickup signal thru an amp and discovered it went wrong way in the OOP-switch. I discovered everything was backward (as Arwin suggested) and then realized why I had soldered it wrong. If you look at the Seymour Duncan schematics you can see two switches is flipped 180 degrees - but the connections shouldn't be flipped - rather connected "straight in".

Happy but still frustrated having lost work days. Moving on to other tasks and everything will be easy after this.
 
Re: Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

dynaflux said:
Problem solved! I started follow the bridge pickup signal thru an amp and discovered it went wrong way in the OOP-switch. I discovered everything was backward (as Arwin suggested) and then realized why I had soldered it wrong. If you look at the Seymour Duncan schematics you can see two switches is flipped 180 degrees - but the connections shouldn't be flipped - rather connected "straight in".

Happy but still frustrated having lost work days. Moving on to other tasks and everything will be easy after this.
Click to expand...
As I'm about to do the same wiring, could you elaborate more? Are you referring to the 2 pots that are flipped around (bridge & neck volume)? The wiring doesn't correlate to their orientation?

Seymour Duncan Jimmy Page Wiring
 
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Re: Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

Imperfect said:
As I'm about to do the same wiring, can you elaborate more? Are you referring to the 2 pots that are flipped around (bridge & neck volume)? The wiring doesn't correlate to their orientation?

https://docs.google.com/gview?embedded=true&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.seymourduncan.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2016%2F05%2FJP_wiring.pdf
Click to expand...

I'm hoping Dynaflux chimes in to confirm this correction, but this change of wiring would change the orientation of the series/parallel switching
jimmy page series flip.jpg
 
Re: Jimmy Page wiring - again but another symptom

The OOP should also be turned around. But it could be confusing to change it. I don't which way that is the best.
 
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