Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

[pedalinbob]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Wow, I agree with so many of these posts.

My favorite guitar (Malmsteen strat) uses extremely low output humbuckers: a pair of Dimarzio HS-3's, with a mere 93 millivolts of output, and DC resistance of 23.72.

The tones produced with a decent setup are simply fantastic.

The high output PUPs sound great too...but, they seem to color my sound too much, where the low output PUPs force me/allow me to color the sound myself.
The result is a far more expressive overall tone.
I find myself really working the strings, and being rewarded for my work.

Bob

 

[alanfc]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

............................One more thing- almost every non active high output humbucker I've heard in an alder body guitar sounded muddy JB's being an exeption.. the others probably do not have enough treble...

alas my Strat is Alder :banana:

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

The lower output pu's -- particularly if you're talking about the wind and not just a magnet swap -- give you a wider frequency response which will, as others have said, allow your playing personality to come through.

The high output pu's with coils above 14k tend to focus the tone on the mids at the expense of the highs and lows, which is why they often use ceramics to inject some top and bottom back into the tone.

I tend to like low-mid in the bridge, about 9.5k with a slug coil wound about 0.7k hotter than the screw coil. You get good punch but keep the vintage chime.

 

[modophoto]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

My kinda guy! :laugh2:

+1 to that!

 

[modophoto]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

noob

 

[PoorMan]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Joys? Pure powertube distortion without slamming the front end (BUZZZZZZZZZZZZ!!!) :laugh2: Requires a hotter amp (for my style) but yields much better tone--IMO.

Having said that, I still like the Custom series very much. :naughty:

Depends on your style of music though. And yes, a colder p'up won't sound as good split. Other downsides? None...for me anyway.

 

[alanfc]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

I'm back

Reconsidering my low/high output pickups,


I have been using a low output humbucker + an OD.
For a while now I'd found it to be good for clarity and all that. But its not as thrilling with live band as my high output JB Jr. was. The live sound is all that matters for me.

I have the Strat, 250k pots, Lil 59 at 1/16" distance, Maxon OD-9 into Rivera with master volume high, preamp volume low. The OD pedal is starting to bug me. Any OD pedal as a matter of fact.
It seems to be making my whole sound smaller. This was the reason for my resistance to OD's in the first place. Its almost like my amp is not fully blooming, at its full potential.

I have right here the JB JR. I took out for the Lil 59....
(is there a question Alan?)
Yes.
Is the diagnosis to skip the OD pedal and go back to high output humbucker?
Tell me what to do

/edit/ Jan 2007
I put the Hotrails back in and go straight into the amp with no OD pedals now

 

[papersoul]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

The lower output pu's -- particularly if you're talking about the wind and not just a magnet swap -- give you a wider frequency response which will, as others have said, allow your playing personality to come through.

The high output pu's with coils above 14k tend to focus the tone on the mids at the expense of the highs and lows, which is why they often use ceramics to inject some top and bottom back into the tone.

I tend to like low-mid in the bridge, about 9.5k with a slug coil wound about 0.7k hotter than the screw coil. You get good punch but keep the vintage chime.

BUt why do some pickups above 14-15k and an alnico V still have a huge botto mlike the Custom 5 and even my Wolfetone TimbreWolf.

I know some guys say lower output pickups are mushy or muddy under high gain but man........guys, listen to Jolly's clips. He uses low output p'ups for metal and sounds incredible. A few of my guitars have 9-9.4k bridge pickups and they sound great for modern heavy rock and even metal!

What about a Duncan CC? This is over 14k and alnico II....so does this mean it would have almost no bass?

 

[Butch Snyder]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

To weak is just a drag...

But generally, vintage output pickups make you work a little harder to shape the tone with your hands.

That's a good thing...puts more of your own personality into your playing and gives you a more unique tone.

High output pickups tend to make everyone who uses them sound more similar or the same, IMO.

Lew

I agree wholeheartedly.

 

[erikm5150]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Is it true that low output humbuckers = weak pinch harmonics??

 

[ErikH]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Is it true that low output humbuckers = weak pinch harmonics??

Nope. Weak pinch harmonics = weak technique. Keep practicing. :bigthumb:

 

[papersoul]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Nope. Weak pinch harmonics = weak technique. Keep practicing. :bigthumb:

Very true! Check out local forum member's Jolly's sounds. He uses low output pickups.

"Low output pickups tend to sound muddy with high gain amps"????

I don't find that true at all!

 

[ErikH]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

BUt why do some pickups above 14-15k and an alnico V still have a huge botto mlike the Custom 5 and even my Wolfetone TimbreWolf.

I know some guys say lower output pickups are mushy or muddy under high gain but man........guys, listen to Jolly's clips. He uses low output p'ups for metal and sounds incredible. A few of my guitars have 9-9.4k bridge pickups and they sound great for modern heavy rock and even metal!

What about a Duncan CC? This is over 14k and alnico II....so does this mean it would have almost no bass?

It's all in how it's wound, the wire used in addition to the magnet used. Just because the CC is over 14k (barely) and is alnico II doesn't mean it has no bass right off the bat. It just happens that it has less than others though it has a good amount of low mids to make up for it. Keep in mind the CC, C5 and Custom use the same coils, same windings, just a different magnet.

 

[Mephis]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Well I had a pearly gates and it seemed a bit weak. I.E. not as much sustain and you have to work your ass off to the point of breaking strings to maintain a regular hard rock tone. It did sound great though, but I like my guitars to play effortlessly.

I found the demon to be the perfect compromise for my tastes.

 

[ES350]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

i think i'm cracking up reading these posts. i'm sure that you all know what you're talking about, but why would anyone want a guitar to sound like a sax? pardon my ignorance.

Since 1939, people have been trying to make a guitar sound like a sax.

 

[stangme01]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Well I had a pearly gates and it seemed a bit weak. I.E. not as much sustain and you have to work your ass off to the point of breaking strings to maintain a regular hard rock tone. It did sound great though, but I like my guitars to play effortlessly.

I found the demon to be the perfect compromise for my tastes.

same here man i hated that pickup, and the custom is not hot IMO, took way more gain on my amp to get up to where the JB is.

There is only 1 lower output pup i want to try and that is the jazz bridge

 

[Bezmotivnik]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Since 1939, people have been trying to make a guitar sound like a sax.

Funny, I seem to be trying to get mine to sound like a piano. :scratchch

For my style of playing, and of course depending on the individual instrument, I find I don't have much use at all for hot pickups such as the JB, Fender "Atomic," etc. I find the greater the output, the more obvious the faults with the match of the pickup and instrument.

'59, Pearly Gates, Fender "Black Canyon," Höfner "Diamond" minis, etc., are much more useful to me. I play mainly on the neck pickups anyway.

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

BUt why do some pickups above 14-15k and an alnico V still have a huge botto mlike the Custom 5 and even my Wolfetone TimbreWolf.

This is a general rule -- there are other ways to coax big bottom out of a higher output pu.

I know some guys say lower output pickups are mushy or muddy under high gain but man........guys, listen to Jolly's clips. He uses low output p'ups for metal and sounds incredible. A few of my guitars have 9-9.4k bridge pickups and they sound great for modern heavy rock and even metal!

I like mid-9 bridge pu's myself. They can sound really huge while staying crystal clear if they're wound right with the right mags and a few other tricks.

What about a Duncan CC? This is over 14k and alnico II....so does this mean it would have almost no bass?

Compared to other 14k+ pickups, it is a little weak on the bottom but not debilitatingly so. The low mids are strong, which on a guitar is practically bass anyway. I'm a fan of the CC, have a C3 in my 355.

 

[papersoul]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

Zhangliqun,

I also love pickups in the 9s. I recently had two Wolfetone pickups made for me, one is 9.2 and the other 9.4 accoridng to my readings although his site say 9.0 and 9.2 respectively. These are Wolfetone pickups(Marshallhead and Caretaker). Heck, I could even get my 8.4k Burstbucker Pro to slam. Go figure.

-Rich

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: Joys/challenges of low output Humbuckers

It's not surprise that you might get a different DCR reading from the official spec. Just 5 or 6 degrees increase in temperature from what Wolfe measured at the shop and where you are when you took your own measurement can crank the DCR up that much.