Miking guitar amp?
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seafoamer
Guest
Re: Miking guitar amp?
Get a Shure sm57, a mic stand, and get down on your hands & knees & listen to where the sound coming out of the speaker sounds best to you. Put the mic there!.
Or put the headphones on (use headphones with good isolation), get on your hands and knees and move the mic around till it sounds the best. Put the mic there!.
I usually like to put a condenser mic, either even with the Shure (dynamic) mic, or I use the 3 to 1 rule, & put the condenser 3 times further than the dynamic mic. This helps avoid a phasing issue with frequencies.
Get a Shure sm57, a mic stand, and get down on your hands & knees & listen to where the sound coming out of the speaker sounds best to you. Put the mic there!.
Or put the headphones on (use headphones with good isolation), get on your hands and knees and move the mic around till it sounds the best. Put the mic there!.
I usually like to put a condenser mic, either even with the Shure (dynamic) mic, or I use the 3 to 1 rule, & put the condenser 3 times further than the dynamic mic. This helps avoid a phasing issue with frequencies.
Skullkrusher
The T-Files-ologist
Re: Miking guitar amp?
+1 to what Seafoamer said.
+1 to what Seafoamer said.
MikeS
Bengalsologist
Re: Miking guitar amp?
Joe, I'm not sure that there really is a right way. It's a lot of trial and error like Seafoamer said. All told, I think I've spent a total of probably 8 hours fussing around with mic combos and mic placement in the mini studio. I'm not sure if my current configuration happened because I finally heard something I liked or I was tired of messing with it.
Joe, I'm not sure that there really is a right way. It's a lot of trial and error like Seafoamer said. All told, I think I've spent a total of probably 8 hours fussing around with mic combos and mic placement in the mini studio. I'm not sure if my current configuration happened because I finally heard something I liked or I was tired of messing with it.
NT02
New member
Re: Miking guitar amp?
LOL at MikeS. I know the feeling. How much time can a guy spend with headphones on, bent over in a chair, moving a mic with one hand and strumming the guitar with another? : )
Here's another question - I don't capture the bass coming from my 1x12 with a mike right up on the speaker. I guess this is due to the fact that bass waves are much bigger and take more room to flesh out. So, how do you capture the full bass sound that you hear in a room? I suspect a good condenser mic for room micing, but don't have one to play with, don't have tons of money to spend on one, and don't know which one to choose. Any suggestions?
LOL at MikeS. I know the feeling. How much time can a guy spend with headphones on, bent over in a chair, moving a mic with one hand and strumming the guitar with another? : )
Here's another question - I don't capture the bass coming from my 1x12 with a mike right up on the speaker. I guess this is due to the fact that bass waves are much bigger and take more room to flesh out. So, how do you capture the full bass sound that you hear in a room? I suspect a good condenser mic for room micing, but don't have one to play with, don't have tons of money to spend on one, and don't know which one to choose. Any suggestions?
MikeS
Bengalsologist
Re: Miking guitar amp?
Well NT02, the best way would be to do what Seafoamer suggested and try a condensor mic a few feet back from the cab face. If budget doesn't allow for such extravagant setups, try moving the mic back and forth while making minor adjustments to the EQs on both the amp and mixing board (just thought I'd throw in a couple more variables ). Like I said, it takes awhile to find the sweet spot.
Well NT02, the best way would be to do what Seafoamer suggested and try a condensor mic a few feet back from the cab face. If budget doesn't allow for such extravagant setups, try moving the mic back and forth while making minor adjustments to the EQs on both the amp and mixing board (just thought I'd throw in a couple more variables
). Like I said, it takes awhile to find the sweet spot.
Quencho092
New member
Re: Miking guitar amp?
how about live miking to a pa system, i dont think a condenser would work well in that situation since it picks up almost everything around it. Say miking a deluxe reverb with an SM57?
how about live miking to a pa system, i dont think a condenser would work well in that situation since it picks up almost everything around it. Say miking a deluxe reverb with an SM57?
Re: Miking guitar amp?
Quarter space loading can work well, half space loading is more practical though, that and the proximity of the 57 ... half space involves pointing the amp into a corner of a room with the mike in the corner ... quarter space loading would involve literally pointing it into the corner (thinl loading from three dimensional planes instead of two ... look up boundary conditions and spl effects as well as phase cancellation from them in either the Yamaha Sound Reinforcement handbook, or a good book on Acoustics (like the Master handbook of acoustics), that can dramatically increase bass response as well as acoustic gain at the mike itself. Condensers, BTW work very well, but they don't like high sound pressure levels as much as dynamics. Nor are they as touch ... hence most people shying away from them for live sound (at least in relation to guitar work). Also, a second mike put in the bask of a combo amp (remember that the signal there is 180 degrees out of phase literally works well when mixed in judiciously for ambience ... although your results may vary of course.
NT02 said:
Quarter space loading can work well, half space loading is more practical though, that and the proximity of the 57 ... half space involves pointing the amp into a corner of a room with the mike in the corner ... quarter space loading would involve literally pointing it into the corner (thinl loading from three dimensional planes instead of two ... look up boundary conditions and spl effects as well as phase cancellation from them in either the Yamaha Sound Reinforcement handbook, or a good book on Acoustics (like the Master handbook of acoustics), that can dramatically increase bass response as well as acoustic gain at the mike itself. Condensers, BTW work very well, but they don't like high sound pressure levels as much as dynamics. Nor are they as touch ... hence most people shying away from them for live sound (at least in relation to guitar work). Also, a second mike put in the bask of a combo amp (remember that the signal there is 180 degrees out of phase literally works well when mixed in judiciously for ambience ... although your results may vary of course.
Mesaboogieman
New member
Re: Miking guitar amp?
Hey whats a good condenser mic to use for micing? You know one that isn't too expensive but a good value such as the sm57 but a condenser. thanks
Hey whats a good condenser mic to use for micing? You know one that isn't too expensive but a good value such as the sm57 but a condenser. thanks
Re: Miking guitar amp?
I forget the number but it's one of the Shure Beta series, that series gets *mixed* responses from people, but there are two condensers in that series one is for choir type stuff (IIRC) and the other is for acoustic instruments, woodwinds, and saxs ... it's what ever that one is ... as far as I remembered they were very economical ... as far as tonal colouration (from the mike model that is) I don't know if they have one that is real close to being a 57.
I woulds look into the Beta series as they have a few different ones ... I can't remember if it's the 4.1 or what.
Mesaboogieman said:
I forget the number but it's one of the Shure Beta series, that series gets *mixed* responses from people, but there are two condensers in that series one is for choir type stuff (IIRC) and the other is for acoustic instruments, woodwinds, and saxs ... it's what ever that one is ... as far as I remembered they were very economical ... as far as tonal colouration (from the mike model that is) I don't know if they have one that is real close to being a 57.
I woulds look into the Beta series as they have a few different ones ... I can't remember if it's the 4.1 or what.
kevlar3000
Bullet Proof Toneologist
Re: Miking guitar amp?
http://users.adelphia.net/~opunwide/MicPrime/MicrophonePrimer.html#MikeGuitar
This is a great help.
I personally don't love the 57, I have used it quite a bit, but there are are times I feel lots of the tone is missing esp when compared to other mics. I have used tons of different combos on my Planet K cd I am finishing up I ended up useing the 57 less and less. It can surely do the job, but if it is placed wrong I think the guitar sounds lifeless.
http://users.adelphia.net/~opunwide/MicPrime/MicrophonePrimer.html#MikeGuitar
This is a great help.
I personally don't love the 57, I have used it quite a bit, but there are are times I feel lots of the tone is missing esp when compared to other mics. I have used tons of different combos on my Planet K cd I am finishing up I ended up useing the 57 less and less. It can surely do the job, but if it is placed wrong I think the guitar sounds lifeless.
T
TheArchitect
Guest
Re: Miking guitar amp?
You may want to try a Sennheiser 609. Its a dynamic that costs about $100 and carries a stronger low end than the '57.
Just move the mic your using back a few inches to maybe 2 feet and see what that does. You lose a little bit of the "in your face" quality but you get a more overall friendly tone in terms of what the amp sounds like in the room.
The other thing to consider is the bigger picture when mixing. All the bass you are trying to capture may get EQ'd out at mixdown to make room for the bass guitar to sit in the mix. What you hear from the amp and what you hear in the control room are very different things. It takes experience to learn how one translates into the other.
NT02 said:
You may want to try a Sennheiser 609. Its a dynamic that costs about $100 and carries a stronger low end than the '57.
Just move the mic your using back a few inches to maybe 2 feet and see what that does. You lose a little bit of the "in your face" quality but you get a more overall friendly tone in terms of what the amp sounds like in the room.
The other thing to consider is the bigger picture when mixing. All the bass you are trying to capture may get EQ'd out at mixdown to make room for the bass guitar to sit in the mix. What you hear from the amp and what you hear in the control room are very different things. It takes experience to learn how one translates into the other.
NT02
New member
Re: Miking guitar amp?
Wow, cool replies. Mike, good suggestions. I do the best I can to get the tone I want without eqing the signal. If I do eq, it's usually to take out an unwanted frequency, but rarely do I boost anything. SKentS, great info. Funny, I've experimented with putting the mic in the open cab, and love the darker sound, but miss the high end. It never occured to me to use two mics, one in the cab and one on the speaker. Duh!
Thanks for the link, Kevlar.
Architect, thanks for the mic suggestion and info. I've messed with room micing, and always come back to putting the mic on the speaker. Course, that has always been with only one mic. Think I'll buy a new mic this weekend and expirement. My control room with my computer is also my amp room. I have a modest setup and record at home as a hobby. I have LOTS to learn!
Wow, cool replies. Mike, good suggestions. I do the best I can to get the tone I want without eqing the signal. If I do eq, it's usually to take out an unwanted frequency, but rarely do I boost anything. SKentS, great info. Funny, I've experimented with putting the mic in the open cab, and love the darker sound, but miss the high end. It never occured to me to use two mics, one in the cab and one on the speaker. Duh!
Thanks for the link, Kevlar.
Architect, thanks for the mic suggestion and info. I've messed with room micing, and always come back to putting the mic on the speaker. Course, that has always been with only one mic. Think I'll buy a new mic this weekend and expirement. My control room with my computer is also my amp room.
I have a modest setup and record at home as a hobby. I have LOTS to learn!Vasshu the humanoid typhoon
Unseen
Re: Miking guitar amp?
I use the AKG414 only now...the57 sounds extremely small next to it, boxy sound and like Kev says, it can get pretty lifeless if you are not careful.
I use the AKG414 only now...the57 sounds extremely small next to it, boxy sound and like Kev says, it can get pretty lifeless if you are not careful.
DirrtyCraig
New member
Re: Miking guitar amp?
I play live every weekend and I've always used a 57 and I've always always found that putting the mic right against the grill-cloth at the edge of the outer rim of the middle cone gets the best results. I've tried farther away, off-axis and some other mics and I end up getting buried in the mix. For live applications Is stronrgly feel this to be best.
I play live every weekend and I've always used a 57 and I've always always found that putting the mic right against the grill-cloth at the edge of the outer rim of the middle cone gets the best results. I've tried farther away, off-axis and some other mics and I end up getting buried in the mix. For live applications Is stronrgly feel this to be best.
NT02
New member
Re: Miking guitar amp?
AKG 414 = $800. SM57=$90. I'll be getting a 57, probably today. They're the standard as far as I can tell, and if I'm going to get into recording the way I want, I can't think of a better place to start and use for comparison later on. I've been using some $60 mic for years, can't think of the name, and it has taken a beating. I'm looking forward to a new mic. Also, I just started checking out condenser mics today. Right now looking at the MXLs. Cheap! But you usually get what you pay for. I love those reviews comparing a $99 mic to a $4000 mic and the person says that the cheap one is almost as good, if not better.
AKG 414 = $800. SM57=$90. I'll be getting a 57, probably today. They're the standard as far as I can tell, and if I'm going to get into recording the way I want, I can't think of a better place to start and use for comparison later on. I've been using some $60 mic for years, can't think of the name, and it has taken a beating. I'm looking forward to a new mic. Also, I just started checking out condenser mics today. Right now looking at the MXLs. Cheap! But you usually get what you pay for. I love those reviews comparing a $99 mic to a $4000 mic and the person says that the cheap one is almost as good, if not better.
kevlar3000
Bullet Proof Toneologist
Re: Miking guitar amp?
I have a 58 clone that I paid 60 in 1990 for that I think is much better than a 57. I also really dig the old Radio Shack PZM for guitars and drums.
I have a 58 clone that I paid 60 in 1990 for that I think is much better than a 57. I also really dig the old Radio Shack PZM for guitars and drums.
S
seafoamer
Guest
Re: Miking guitar amp?
The AKG 414 is real nice condenser.
I favor the Audio-Technica 4050. They're a bit cheaper too, @ around $550. The 4050 can also succeed as a vocal mic. I have 2, and I use them as piano & drum overheads, gtr & occasionaly vox.
The AKG 414 is real nice condenser.
I favor the Audio-Technica 4050. They're a bit cheaper too, @ around $550. The 4050 can also succeed as a vocal mic. I have 2, and I use them as piano & drum overheads, gtr & occasionaly vox.
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