Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

[Gibson 1964]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Where? And what makes people think that super high output is needed for death metal? If you have the right amp, low output can be very jagged sounding.

My Nazgul 7 is not that high output. Perhaps comparable to a JB or Distortion overall. The difference is in voicing.

A Black Winter is much higher output. Black Winters are good for stuff across the board, not just death or black metal.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Is it? I was contemplating it but I got an invader instead.

The consensus on the Invader is Duncan's loudest and dirtiest passive pick up they make.

 

[Gibson 1964]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

I think Slug may be louder, but I haven't owned an invader in a substantial length of time. Slug may be the single loudest pickup I have ever heard. In fact, it sounds that way for sure.

I suspect a BW may be similar output to an invader. But they are voiced in a very different way.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

I think Slug may be louder, but I haven't owned an invader in a substantial length of time. Slug may be the single loudest pickup I have ever heard. In fact, it sounds that way for sure.

I suspect a BW may be similar output to an invader. But they are voiced in a very different way.

Very good point. Forgot about the new Slug, that and I haven't got my hands on a Black Winter yet. There is always the PERCEIVED output through the tone vs the actual measurable output of the pickup. That's where I think the Nazgul's strength is because it was designed for 7 and 8 strings so the lower strings would stay tight sounding, so without being necessarily a high output pickup, it sounds super focused. So it hits the amp hard yet keeps things articulate. At least that was my impression.

 

[Gibson 1964]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Very good point. Forgot about the new Slug, that and I haven't got my hands on a Black Winter yet. There is always the PERCEIVED output through the tone vs the actual measurable output of the pickup. That's where I think the Nazgul's strength is because it was designed for 7 and 8 strings so the lower strings would stay tight sounding, so without being necessarily a high output pickup, it sounds super focused. So it hits the amp hard yet keeps things articulate. At least that was my impression.

I would agree. I just have a 7 string Nazgul, and it sounds like it is lower output than I would have thought, but very, very clear. Finding out the same team designed the black winter inspired me to buy a black winter which is an amazing pickup. I got a slug because it intrigued me. I like it a lot, but whereas the nazgul has laser focus, a slug is just a much more sledgehammer approach to things. It is massive. I would guess it is substantially louder than a BW even though I can't really test that absolutely.

 

[GuitarHen]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

The consensus on the Invader is Duncan's loudest and dirtiest passive pick up they make.

Man I've been mixed. I really dig the invader. The Nazgul must sound great then

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Man I've been mixed. I really dig the invader. The Nazgul must sound great then

Invader is sick dude. Nothing wrong with it. Even if it wasn't what you were going for, if you got it and love it then that is the end of it. Absolutely nothing wrong with diving into the loud and dirty.

 

[GuitarHen]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Invader is sick dude. Nothing wrong with it. Even if it wasn't what you were going for, if you got it and love it then that is the end of it. Absolutely nothing wrong with diving into the loud and dirty.

Well no, its awesome. I knew it would be dirty. But the way the guy at the shop explained it was that it was was dirtier than the invader, so I thought the invader would be less output, otherwise I might as well stick a blackout in there or an EMG. But in the end I was satisfied. Awesome pickup

 

[Letus]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

I stay with EMG 81 and Duncan JB in all my hard rock/metal guitars.

I think once you get that radio tone in your head, you can keep tone-chasing and never be satisfied.

When I think thrash, I hear Hetfield and Mustaine.

So that's one super-scooped tone and one very midrange-y tone. Just goes to show you thrash is very diverse.

My picks are Dave Mustaine, Revocation, and Jeff Waters for the ideal thrash tone.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

So that's one super-scooped tone and one very midrange-y tone. Just goes to show you thrash is very diverse.

My picks are Dave Mustaine, Revocation, and Jeff Waters for the ideal thrash tone.

Funniest thing man. Metallica's tone isn't very scooped at all. Like I'm serious, within the context of the song it sounds that way, but take a listen to some Pantera and Death and Cannibal Corpse and stuff and then go back to the first 3 Metallica albums and they all seem rather honky, weighty and focused by comparison. Justice and Black album had pretty scooped tones but post-Load all of their stuff has like HUGE and dense crunchy mids, like on Death Magnetic and their recent cover medly for the Dio tribute album.

But yeah it took me a while to notice that and I always presumed their tone was super scooped too.
Like here check it out

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wiDRtEVivGo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UO_84C3fpuI

 

[Gibson 1964]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

And use of a pickup does not guarantee a super scooped tone. I can get a super scooped tone out of functionally any pickup if I say, scooped the mids on a Lee Jackson designed amp or a Mesa.

Pickups are a piece of the equation not the sum. And EMGs never struck me as scooped, probably because of how I used them. My dislike for EMGs has more to do with the percentage of times a battery has failed me while playing. Also, they just were not what I was looking for. But the battery thing is most frustrating to me.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

I actually find EMGs to be totally midrange sounding, especially the 81 and 60.
And I am not a fan of actives for the same reason, a constantly degrading tone the weaker and weaker the battery gets until it eventually just dies on you. I've always seen actives as kind of like putting your guitar on steroids and lifesupport at the same time.

 

[9unslin9er]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

So that's one super-scooped tone and one very midrange-y tone. Just goes to show you thrash is very diverse.

Yeah not really.

The EMG 81 has a lot of mids. It's the Mesas that were scooped. Try using an 81 with an Engl Fireball. Stupid midrange.

And I am not a fan of actives for the same reason, a constantly degrading tone the weaker and weaker the battery gets until it eventually just dies on you.

They don't really work like that. It's just a preamp signal. It's on or off. When they die, you'll know it. They last a long freaking time. I had one guitar go 5 years without a battery change with heavy use.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Yeah not really.

The EMG 81 has a lot of mids. It's the Mesas that were scooped. Try using an 81 with an Engl Fireball. Stupid midrange.



They don't really work like that. It's just a preamp signal. It's on or off. When they die, you'll know it. They last a long freaking time. I had one guitar go 5 years without a battery change with heavy use.

Then maybe it was my imagination? I have years of experience with blackouts and the 81 60 combo and it always kind of seemed that way. Hate having them die on me anyway.

Edit-Yeah actually I'm not crazy, this is from the emg FAQ about when to change the battery.

"We were afraid you were going to ask... Because EMG pickups are designed from the ground up to operate as active pickups, they’re not very functional when deprived of power. As the battery weakens over time, the output level will reduce and become more distorted. When you hear that happening, it’s time to change the battery.
Below a certain voltage, the onboard active circuitry will stop working. At that point, you will hear little or no output from the guitar. Don’t let this happen to you!
Other “active” systems run the output of normal high-impedance pickups into a buffer amp or active EQ circuit. If the battery goes dead in one of these systems, you can bypass the active circuit and still get some sound. That’s nice, but this sort of design compromises the pickup design yielding only a few of the benefi ts of optimized active pickup design. That bypass switch will cost you tone and noise - a BAD tradeoff."

I guess I worded it poorly so it sounds like they don't hold good tone at all, no I know the tone lasts a good long while before it starts to drop off.
Also I think Letus was talking about Metallica and Megadeh's tones in general, not the tones of the pickups.

 

[9unslin9er]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Interesting.

Can't go against the company's word. I guess I've just always really been on top of battery swaps. That and those new Energizers are overkill.

 

[Inder_Cine_Mann]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

How do you figure it would be dirty or too much? The pickup is supposed to be kind of medium output with a rather focused and even tone. Every clip I've heard of it has always been pretty clean and tight sounding because that is what it was designed to do. It's not supposed to be a super hot pickup.

This is spot on about the Nazgul.

 

[Letus]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Funniest thing man. Metallica's tone isn't very scooped at all. Like I'm serious, within the context of the song it sounds that way, but take a listen to some Pantera and Death and Cannibal Corpse and stuff and then go back to the first 3 Metallica albums and they all seem rather honky, weighty and focused by comparison. Justice and Black album had pretty scooped tones but post-Load all of their stuff has like HUGE and dense crunchy mids, like on Death Magnetic and their recent cover medly for the Dio tribute album.

But yeah it took me a while to notice that and I always presumed their tone was super scooped too.
Like here check it out

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wiDRtEVivGo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UO_84C3fpuI

You're actually right. I never noticed very much of a scoop in their sound till Master of Puppets. I actually thought their first two albums had a very nice midrange crunch. Something in the way the scoops were used on Master of Puppets and ...And Justice For All just emphasized them so much.

I can't understand why people like scooped tones.

And yes, I was talking about the overall tone, not the pickups. I've personally found the 81 and 85 quite full and midrange-y.

But here Dino Cazares specifically says he finds the EMGs relatively scooped; http://www.seymourduncan.com/blog/artist-interview/dino-cazares-of-divine-heresy/

 

[9unslin9er]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

You're actually right. I never noticed very much of a scoop in their sound till Master of Puppets. I actually thought their first two albums had a very nice midrange crunch.

Well they didn't switch to Mesa Boogie until Master of Puppets.

For Kill and Lightning James used Gibby's with stock pups or Duncans.
Kirk used a V and a Strat with Lace Sensors.
Both through Marshalls with distortion boxes.
James - ProCo Rat
Kirk - Boss DS-1

Midrange overkill is expected. Piss and vinegar.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

You're actually right. I never noticed very much of a scoop in their sound till Master of Puppets. I actually thought their first two albums had a very nice midrange crunch. Something in the way the scoops were used on Master of Puppets and ...And Justice For All just emphasized them so much.

I can't understand why people like scooped tones.

And yes, I was talking about the overall tone, not the pickups. I've personally found the 81 and 85 quite full and midrange-y.

But here Dino Cazares specifically says he finds the EMGs relatively scooped; http://www.seymourduncan.com/blog/artist-interview/dino-cazares-of-divine-heresy/

Scooped guitar tones, to me, not only sound horrible 90 percent of the time, but are horrible to work with if you're a sound engineer and working with anything other than an extremely guitar focused band.

In comparison to the blackout 7s? Yeah I can see the emg 707s sounding scooped. Blackouts are fatter, middier and bassier than most other actives.

 

[Letus]

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Re: Nazgúl for something other than modern death metal or Djent?

Well they didn't switch to Mesa Boogie until Master of Puppets.

For Kill and Lightning James used Gibby's with stock pups or Duncans.
Kirk used a V and a Strat with Lace Sensors.
Both through Marshalls with distortion boxes.
James - ProCo Rat
Kirk - Boss DS-1

Midrange overkill is expected. Piss and vinegar.

Not to mention Kirk's Tubescreamer.