Neck PU for shred

[Mertay]

I want to get rid of my old air norton (neck) but keep the tonezone. The faster I try to play, I tend to loosen my touch and pick softer so I need something sensitive. Honestly I feel more comfortable with my jackson js11's cheap PU than the air norton which is on my ibanez.

During my modification trials with the AN, I noticed the more open/singlecoil-like the sound got the more I liked it. After a web search I narrowed to Humbucker from hell or full shred. The HFH seems to be a closer contender but I have some worrys;

-I'm ok with a bright sound but don't want it to be harsh on clean tones.
-Not expecting the air-norton versatility but somewhat good performance with clean or (plexi type) lower gain settings.
-If I go with full shred, would it match well with the tonezone?
-Paf pro and jazz are also mentioned a lot, am I going overboard with the brightness cause I find the air norton dark?

Any advice is welcome

 

[gregory]

Re: Neck PU for shred

Ah, shredding with the neck is perhaps my most favorite subject.

First things first, because your last paragraph has you all over the map:
Do you care about cleans, and if so how do you want them to sound?

Is there some reason you didn't mention one of Petrucci's signature models or the Evolution? I ask because of your concern about losing saturation with a lighter touch.

 

[Phantasmagoria]

Re: Neck PU for shred

MAB Hands With Shadows from Dean/DMT

...fantastic neck pup for shred with crazy note separation & clarity while still staying really sweet & fat as **** :bigthumb:

 

[Mertay]

Re: Neck PU for shred

Ah, shredding with the neck is perhaps my most favorite subject.

First things first, because your last paragraph has you all over the map:
Do you care about cleans, and if so how do you want them to sound?

To give an example I would hate them to sound like yngwie's hendrix-y tones on lower gain Again single example but I really liked Fender vintage noiseless PU's (shreds nice too) but didn't like the new ones they place on Elite series. You're right about me being a bit confused, I feel not exactly sure if I want less phase cancellation or (much) more brightness...

Is there some reason you didn't mention one of Petrucci's signature models or the Evolution? I ask because of your concern about losing saturation with a lighter touch.

I prefer using a lot of boost with pedals. I also tried converting the Air norton to a norton and did get more output but still didn't like it. I'm positive on not having a problem with output but being still close to the tonezone is important.

A friend had a CL-LF set and they were too thick sounding to me, was impressive with mesa but not so good with marshalls. As for evo, its been a really long time since I played one but having a ceramic magnet I suspect it would sound too different character-wise when switched to the tonezone.

 

[Mertay]

Re: Neck PU for shred

MAB Hands With Shadows from Dean/DMT

...fantastic neck pup for shred with crazy note separation & clarity while still staying really sweet & fat as **** :bigthumb:

Thanks for the suggestion but due to where I live its best for me to stick with dimarzio or SD as they're easier to find.

 

[Mincer]

Re: Neck PU for shred

The Full Shred or Jazz are great pickups for neck shredding, especially if you tend to pick every note *and* like to hear the attack of the pick hitting the string. I also like more mid-focused pickups like the Alnico II Pro for more of a 'thump' when you pick the string, rather than a 'ping'. Whatever pickup you choose, make sure it is dynamic enough that you can pick how you want (it doesn't compress everything to sounding the same).

 

[gregory]

Re: Neck PU for shred

Higher output without being dark like the Air Norton in the neck and still not thin is the PAF Pro.

Paul Gilbert has used an HFH with a TZ, but he is extremely heavy-handed and practically orients his pick at a 45 degree angle.

Keeping up with a Tone Zone may be problematic with the typical Duncan vintage-output neck suggestions, especially regarding the lighter touch comment. The idea is to maintain gain and focus, rather than offer something pulls back/cleans up/loses saturation. If you went the vintage output Duncan route I'd steer you towards an A5 with a focused voice. That's either the Full Shred Neck or the 59; not the Jazz. Because the TZ has a massive low end, I bet you don't have to compromise bass in the neck spot, so I'd say the 59.

But let's get back to the output issue...
I use a FSn with a Screamin Demon and that is a perfect match for lead guitar with a lot of gain, provided you like that kind of thing as both are very dynamic and begin to clean up with a lighter touch. The Screamin Demon is weaker and thinner than a TZ.

Sooooo....
With all that aside, I think the best Duncan choice for the neck to accompany a TZ in the bridge could actually be the Screamin Demon! The only thing that would still concern me, however is like with the Jazz, there could be a lack of focus.

The next rung up the ladder from the Screamin Demon would be the PAF Pro. It will be fuller in the low end, give a more focused midrange voice and be just a tad darker. I'd say the Jazz Neck would be to the Screamin Demon somewhat like what the 59n would be to the PAF Pro.

 

[Mertay]

Re: Neck PU for shred

...

The more I read your comment the more it made sense to me, thank you for the very detailed reply.

 

[Mr. B]

Re: Neck PU for shred

The Full Shred and Humbucker From Hell are similar. The Full Shred is a bit hotter and has a bit of a softer feel to it. The Humbucker from Hell has a little less output and can feel a tiny bit stiff, sort of like the Jazz n. They are both GREAT pickups. Out of the two, I prefer the Full Shred, but I have both. All that said, I prefer the Paf Pro for use with the Tone Zone. Their characters are similar and the Paf Pro keeps up with the Tone Zone better than the other two. I have that combo in an Ibanez RG with a Cruiser neck in the middle. The Paf Joe is another option, if you want something a bit more vintage, but still great for shred. The PAF Pro and PAF Joe both sound great clean. I don't like the Jazz neck for shred at all.

 

[gregory]

Re: Neck PU for shred

Shredding in the neck requires a lot more than just hearing pick attack, which is essentially all the Jazz has going for it. You need a strong vocal quality and the Jazz just doesn't have it. 59N will always be a better choice.

I get that most of us are enthusiastic about Duncan products (myself included), but this is one specific area where Duncan simply doesn't excel.

I'm not a big fan of Joe's new neck pickup for this purpose: it sounds too much like a Duncan pickup. YMMV! You know what though, I think I would like listening to Joe more if he used Seymour Duncan pickups. You can take that to the bank!

 

[jclogston]

Re: Neck PU for shred

Evo Neck or Liquifire?

 

[gregory]

Re: Neck PU for shred

The more I read your comment the more it made sense to me, thank you for the very detailed reply.

Thank you for the kind words!

 

[Joey Voltage]

Re: Neck PU for shred

Another option I liked a lot for a neck pickup combination with the tonezone, was the Fred. It has the fullness needed to contend with the TZ, and the clank of the paf pro, and is also quite vocal.

The HFH is quite a bit different animal and doesn't blend as nicely with the tz, although you may really love the contrast. It's also a sort of harder pickup to play, although if you are using a ton of gain, and a boost on top, I can't imagine anything would be that hard. Don't worry about it sounding like yngwie trying to play Hendrix. One of best references for it would be Images and words. Petrucci use the TZ HFH combo all over that album, 90's Paul Gilbert too, although paul has so much attack in his playing, a lot of subtleties are lost.

 

[dave74]

Re: Neck PU for shred

Another option I liked a lot for a neck pickup combination with the tonezone, was the Fred. It has the fullness needed to contend with the TZ, and the clank of the paf pro, and is also quite vocal.

I'd also imagine the MoJoe to be a good pairing since it's in the same family as the fred being a slightly hotter and fuller pro.

 

[Joey Voltage]

Re: Neck PU for shred

I'd also imagine the MoJoe to be a good pairing since it's in the same family as the fred being a slightly hotter and fuller pro.

I'm quite convinced your right, and have been considering it myself for a while for that very reason. I just can't comment from experience with it is all, yet at least. Another that might be of use for the op's purpose is the dactivator neck. Because of its frequency response It's not as perciably hot as it's specs suggest, at least not so much so that the TZ couldn't hang with it. It also has more of that pronounced clank.

 

[IMENATOR]

Re: Neck PU for shred

I want to get rid of my old air norton (neck) but keep the tonezone. The faster I try to play, I tend to loosen my touch and pick softer so I need something sensitive. Honestly I feel more comfortable with my jackson js11's cheap PU than the air norton which is on my ibanez.

During my modification trials with the AN, I noticed the more open/singlecoil-like the sound got the more I liked it. After a web search I narrowed to Humbucker from hell or full shred. The HFH seems to be a closer contender but I have some worrys;

-I'm ok with a bright sound but don't want it to be harsh on clean tones.
-Not expecting the air-norton versatility but somewhat good performance with clean or (plexi type) lower gain settings.
-If I go with full shred, would it match well with the tonezone?
-Paf pro and jazz are also mentioned a lot, am I going overboard with the brightness cause I find the air norton dark?

Any advice is welcome

I have been using the full shred neck in a Charvel SoCal 2014. It has the output to match a Duncan Distortion in the bridge which is classified as hot output so it is not a weak sounding yet it has an open sound. The FSn has a single coil-ish sound to it so it has worked fine for me for cleans, edge of breakup cleans and as a rhythm pickup for classic rock, of course it sounds great for leads. I like single coil neck lead tones a lot myself too so I was surprised to find myself liking the FSn this much so far. In the past I had tried the Jazz neck in another strat and I did not like it as much as the FSn, cleans and overdrive were good but something was missing for leads, FSn delivers for me.

 

[gregory]

Re: Neck PU for shred

If you like more of that Yngwie thing from the neck spot, I get it, but for me there is absolutely *no way* I'd use a Full Shred neck with with a Duncan Distortion. The high output Duncan Distortion opens the door to all sorts of humbuckers that are very well suited for shredding like a LiquiFire or Evolution. For more of a single coil-vibe that will keep up far better than a FSn to play Paganini, check out the Gravity Storm.

YMMV!

 

[IMENATOR]

Re: Neck PU for shred

If you like more of that Yngwie thing from the neck spot, I get it, but for me there is absolutely *no way* I'd use a Full Shred neck with with a Duncan Distortion. The high output Duncan Distortion opens the door to all sorts of humbuckers that are very well suited for shredding like a LiquiFire or Evolution. For more of a single coil-vibe that will keep up far better than a FSn to play Paganini, check out the Gravity Storm.

YMMV!

I have also read great comments and nice sound demos about the Gravity Storm, that would be my first choice from the DiMarzio catalog for neck shredding. In my experience so far I am liking the FSn + DDb way better than the Jazz/JB combo, different guitar yes but I am enjoying way more.


Edit: You are right about the Yngwie thing, before I got and upgrade this Charvel I used to play an HSS guitar with the Duncan Fury neck, my favorite single coil for rock... and yes I had used the DiMarzio HS-4 before that and that was a great pickup too but for some reason it would never match volume properly with a DiMarzio OEM humbucker in the brindge... The Duncan Fury is more versatile, has bit more output and matches the DiMarzio humbucerk much better. Go figure.