NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

BleedingFingertips

BleedingFingertips

New member
Hi guys,

so I bought the Silencer from Electro Harmonix and it does the gating great. Some metal dudes say it doesn't close fast enough or it "swallows" the first attack. I don't know... I found my setting pretty fast:

Release: 7 o'clock (fully counterclockwise)
Threshold: 2 o'clock
Reduction: 2 o'clock

As a result, I've deleted ISP Decimator II and Fortin Zuul from my wishlist for good. Why bother?

The only thing that bothers me is this.

The Silencer makes some cracking noises when I hook it up to my amp via the 4 cable method, i.e.

1. Guitar -> Silencer INPUT
2. Silencer SEND -> Amp Input
3. Amp Send -> Silencer RETURN
4. Silencer OUTPUT -> Amp Return

To eliminate other causes, I did the following:
A. Run some effects through the amp's FX Loop - no issues
B. Run the Silencer straight into the amp (using INPUT and OUTPUT) - no issues
C. Used the FX loop of the Silencer for stompboxes in front of the amp, i.e. Guitar -> Silencer INPUT / Silencer SEND -> stompboxes -> Silencer RETURN / Silencer OUTPUT -> amp - also no issues
D. Checked all my cables for loose connections one by one - no issues

It's sad, since the 4CM is the only way I intended to use this noise gate.

Do you think the pedal is the cause of the problem? Any Silencer user here with the same issue?
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

I have a Silencer. Never used it like that. Just last item in Loop. Never any issues at all.
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

Aceman said:
I have a Silencer. Never used it like that. Just last item in Loop. Never any issues at all.
Click to expand...

I think I could use it in the amp's loop too but I'd like to know for sure whether it's defective.

This guy used the Silencer the way I described and it seems to work well.

 
Last edited:
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

Are you sure that's hooked up right?
I thought the input output and the send return were dual channels thru the same device
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

ehdwuld said:
Are you sure that's hooked up right?
I thought the input output and the send return were dual channels thru the same device
Click to expand...

100% correct. The idea is to put the noisy preamp in the Silencer's loop as if it were a distortion pedal. That's why Silencer's SEND into preamp Input and preamp output (FX Send) into Silencer's RETURN.
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

Naw I meant the input output from silencer just as you were using a single pair of cables
And the silencer send and return to the loop

That seems more logical to me
But you have the manual I suppose
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

BleedingFingertips said:
Pretty much. But maybe you have a theory as to why the same four cables would work flawlessly in one instance but not in the other.
Click to expand...

No, but it wouldn’t be the first time something like that was overlooked.

Let me see if I can find the boss NS-2 diagram...at least you’ll be able to double check your current wiring.
I’ve used bot the Boss and ISP in the loop as well and I always need to go back and rethink the connections. It’s confusing as hell!!


https://youtu.be/NjtII98Cddo

https://static.roland.com/assets/media/pdf/NS-2_e01_W.pdf

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=boss+ns-2...icflickr.com/3806/9311315087_396b2832a2_c.jpg

Hopefully this helps!
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

the manual

https://www.ehx.com/products/silencer/instructions

from the manual
INPUT Jack – Plug your instrument into this ¼” jack which is the main audio input for The Silencer. The input impedance is 2MOhm.
OUTPUT Jack – The OUTPUT jack is The Silencer’s main audio output. The gated signal exits through the OUTPUT jack. The output impedance is 300Ohm.

SEND Jack – Connect the SEND jack to the beginning of your effects loop. The output impedance is 300Ohm. The SEND jack outputs a buffered version of the signal present at the INPUT jack at all times. If you do not need to use the Silencer’s effects loop, the SEND jack could also be used to split the input signal.

RETURN Jack – Connect the end of your effects loop to the RETURN jack. The signal preset at the RETURN jack is gated by The Silencer. The input impedance is 1MOhm. If you are not using the effects loop and prefer to use The Silencer as an inline gate, do not plug anything into the RETURN jack.
Click to expand...
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

ehdwuld said:
the manual

https://www.ehx.com/products/silencer/instructions

from the manual
Click to expand...

Most noise gate pedals with FX loops are actually not marketed the way many guys use them, unfortunately. It creates lots of confusion.

I think the 4 cable method is very logical if you think of your dirt pedals and the preamp as a single fx chain. You go from the SEND of the Silencer into your dirt pedals, from there you go into your preamp and from the FX send (which is the preamp OUT - end of your whole dirty chain) you go back to the RETURN of the Silencer thus making a loop.

It seems that if you use all 4 jacks the circuit of the pedal switches from INPUT -> OUTPUT to INPUT -> SEND -> RETURN -> OUTPUT. The 4 cable method is the only way to use such noise gate both in front of the amp and in the FX loop. Alternatively, you can use two noise gates through INPUT->OUTPUT. In fact, when I run my guitar through INPUT - OUTPUT of the Silencer into the amp and used SEND and RETURN for the FX loop, there wasn't any output signal at all because I basically skipped the preamp section.

This is a 4CM diagramm for NS-2, it should work the same way for the Silencer too.

4c423054ae0616bcefb7a9481e650cca.jpg
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

Gtrjunior said:
No, but it wouldn’t be the first time something like that was overlooked.

Let me see if I can find the boss NS-2 diagram...at least you’ll be able to double check your current wiring.
I’ve used bot the Boss and ISP in the loop as well and I always need to go back and rethink the connections. It’s confusing as hell!!


https://youtu.be/NjtII98Cddo

https://static.roland.com/assets/media/pdf/NS-2_e01_W.pdf

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=boss+ns-2...icflickr.com/3806/9311315087_396b2832a2_c.jpg

Hopefully this helps!
Click to expand...

From the duckduckgo search results:
49CC9dj.jpg

Yeah, this is how it should be. But the BOSS manual (and EHX too) is not very specific.
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

If the cables are good in every other application, and all the scenarios work except the 4 cable with pre-amp in the pedal loop, then the simple answer is: yes, there’s an issue with the pedal... BUT that does not necessarily mean the pedal is defective.

Given that effects loops vary in circuit (tube-driven, solid state, etc.), quality and input/output impedance, this may simply be a case of a mismatch between this pedal and your amp. You don’t mention what amp it is, so we can’t help diagnose that.

In my experience, and this just may be me, I’ve never met an EHX pedal that didn’t make some level of unwelcome noise in my signal chain, especially in their more recent offerings, so it wouldn’t surprise me if the pedal wont do the 4-cable method cleanly.

If it doesn’t work out, I recommend taking a look at the MXR Noise Clamp - it’s a solid option.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

BleedingFingertips said:
Most noise gate pedals with FX loops are actually not marketed the way many guys use them, unfortunately. It creates lots of confusion.

I think the 4 cable method is very logical if you think of your dirt pedals and the preamp as a single fx chain. You go from the SEND of the Silencer into your dirt pedals, from there you go into your preamp and from the FX send (which is the preamp OUT - end of your whole dirty chain) you go back to the RETURN of the Silencer thus making a loop.

It seems that if you use all 4 jacks the circuit of the pedal switches from INPUT -> OUTPUT to INPUT -> SEND -> RETURN -> OUTPUT. The 4 cable method is the only way to use such noise gate both in front of the amp and in the FX loop. Alternatively, you can use two noise gates through INPUT->OUTPUT. In fact, when I run my guitar through INPUT - OUTPUT of the Silencer into the amp and used SEND and RETURN for the FX loop, there wasn't any output signal at all because I basically skipped the preamp section.

This is a 4CM diagramm for NS-2, it should work the same way for the Silencer too.

View attachment 105146
Click to expand...

you dont have the Boss
you have the EHX
and its manufacturer has made a different pedal than Boss

you will need to NS2 to use the diagram posted

the manual clearly suggests a different method


but please go ahead
its yours
do as you want
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

VinceT said:
If the cables are good in every other application, and all the scenarios work except the 4 cable with pre-amp in the pedal loop, then the simple answer is: yes, there’s an issue with the pedal... BUT that does not necessarily mean the pedal is defective.

Given that effects loops vary in circuit (tube-driven, solid state, etc.), quality and input/output impedance, this may simply be a case of a mismatch between this pedal and your amp. You don’t mention what amp it is, so we can’t help diagnose that.

In my experience, and this just may be me, I’ve never met an EHX pedal that didn’t make some level of unwelcome noise in my signal chain, especially in their more recent offerings, so it wouldn’t surprise me if the pedal wont do the 4-cable method cleanly.

If it doesn’t work out, I recommend taking a look at the MXR Noise Clamp - it’s a solid option.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Oh, my bad... it's a Randall Diavlo 40w all tube combo with 4 12ax7 tubes in the preamp section.

I also tend to think that there's some sort of mismatch between Silencer and my amp. When I roll back volume and gain on my dirty channel (from 2 o'clock downwards) the crackling goes away. It seems similar to clipping when the recording signal is too hot.

Funny thing is the Diavlo series was developed by Mike Fortin - time to start saving for a ZUUL lol

But seriously, I'm going to give Silencer another chance and ask for replacement at Thomann. If the issue persists with the second silencer, I'll have to find another affordable gate be it ns2, clamp or sentry.
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

ehdwuld said:
the manual

https://www.ehx.com/products/silencer/instructions

from the manual
Click to expand...

That manual is confusing to grasp, you figured out what's it saying? Does it imply the Amp Send connects to Silencer Send & Amp Return connects to Silencer Return? Should it not be the opposite? :scratchch

If it were the opposite then the preamp return would only see a signal if the guitar strings were ringing out. Overal a Gate Effect. I'm still confused what I wrote, the Boss NS2 can do the same as well in that config.:friday:

The X-Pattern in the NS2 pics is for 4CM config, it works different. The Silencer would have to be connected in the X-Pattern like NS2 for it.:kabong:
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

ehdwuld said:
you dont have the Boss
you have the EHX
and its manufacturer has made a different pedal than Boss

you will need to NS2 to use the diagram posted

the manual clearly suggests a different method


but please go ahead
its yours
do as you want
Click to expand...

Fyi, boss's manual doesn't recommend to use ns2 this way either. This wiring was drawn by someone else.
 
Re: NPD: EHX Silencer (4 cable method troubleshooting anyone?)

ok its your pedal

please do whatever you like

just trying to help
 
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