Ok Then, Orange Pedal Baby It Is - But What About The Lack Of A Preamp?

[DarthTangYang]

I've been thinking about getting an Orange Pedal Baby. The whole selling point of this product seem to be that it's a fairly neutral pedal platform that allows you to shape your sound using only pedals, and I like that concept. I sure wouldn't mind owning a Diezel VH-4 but I will never afford one of those monsters and even if I did come across $2.900 just laying around unused I could never justify buying such an expensive amp. So if I can't get an amp that can tickle my tone the right way then I might as well go for something a bit more neutral that I can shape with a heavy distortion pedal that DO shape the tone the right way. So a Diezel VH-4 v2 for instance, or say a Friedman BE-OD Deluxe. However, someone said that a Pedal Baby isn't suitable to run straight up with pedals, that I'd need a dedicated preamp to get the most out of it. But then, isn't that the whole point with the Pedal Baby, the reason why it doesn't have a regular preamp? ...and why it's called "The Pedal Baby"? Now, the Diezel VH-4 v2 can be used as a preamp with a dedicated jack for this purpose (as far as I've understood) but the Friedman doesn't have such a jack, but then again it does have nobs meant to shape the sound so... what exactly is it that makes this less of a preamp than the VH-4 v2? And is that circuit that significant that using a Friedman pedal to shape the tone would waste the potential of the Pedal Baby? Any help here would be greatly appreciated as this confuses the crap out of me :dunno::question:

 

[dave74]

The pedals are your preamp with the PB.
Pedals = preamp,,,,,PB = poweramp.

 

[dave74]

Also if you haven't already look into the Seymour Duncan Powerstage series. Same category, different circuits.

 

[DarthTangYang]

Also if you haven't already look into the Seymour Duncan Powerstage series. Same category, different circuits.

Well, yes I have. However, from what I've read and heard from quite a lot of people class D amps tend to sound a bit sterile while class A/B sounds more like a real tube amp. The Pedal Baby is a class A in the front and has a class A/B poweramp. Many reviews I've read say it gives the Pedal Baby an advantage over the Seymour Duncan Powerstage. Also, the Seymour Duncan Powerstage is more expensive than the Pedal Baby.

 

[DarthTangYang]

I decided to neither get a Diezel VH4-2 or a Friedman BE-OD Deluxe. Instead I bought a Victory Kraken V4 preamp pedal and I'm awaiting its delivery within the next couple of days. I'm back on the fence regarding the Pedal Baby though. The Kraken running through the FX-loop has the possibility of also being hooked to the front of the amp, allowing for it to be bypassed by switching it off, using the preamp of the amp for any clean tones. That's a really cool feature but it is one that won't work with the Pedal Baby since it doesn't have a preamp in the same sense as regular amps. The Pedal Baby only has one input and it's basically an FX-return.

So what I would like is to find a valve amp head (somewhere between 20-100W) with an FX-loop. An amp which is very clean. Something like a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe or similar, with sparkling clean tones and that doesn't cost a fortune. This I think would be the best type of amp to pair with the Kraken V4 to get the most out of it.

Does anyone have any suggestions for an amp head like that?

 

[jeremy]

whats wrong with the hot rod deluxe? they are easy to find used too

 

[DarthTangYang]

whats wrong with the hot rod deluxe? they are easy to find used too

I don't want a combo and as far as I know they don't come as heads. They are also a bit too pricey for my budget at the moment.

 

[dave74]

Well, yes I have. However, from what I've read and heard from quite a lot of people class D amps tend to sound a bit sterile while class A/B sounds more like a real tube amp. The Pedal Baby is a class A in the front and has a class A/B poweramp. Many reviews I've read say it gives the Pedal Baby an advantage over the Seymour Duncan Powerstage. Also, the Seymour Duncan Powerstage is more expensive than the Pedal Baby.

Yeah just throwing it out there for the home team. I would also rather have the Orange than the PS,,,,,,not only for the tone but also I like the layout and looks better.

 

[Mincer]

The PowerStage doesn't impart its own sound in the signal...you need a good preamp pedal, and/or a modeler with preamp/poweramp/cab/mic modeling.

 

[DarthTangYang]

The PowerStage doesn't impart its own sound in the signal...you need a good preamp pedal, and/or a modeler with preamp/poweramp/cab/mic modeling.

So having a class A/B transistor poweamp, or a class D transistor poweramp, or a digital poweramp, or an all valve poweramp doesn't matter at all? It's all going to sound exactly the same?

 

[Mincer]

So having a class A/B transistor poweamp, or a class D transistor poweramp, or a digital poweramp, or an all valve poweramp doesn't matter at all? It's all going to sound exactly the same?

No, but if you are like me, and use a modeler, there are different power amp models, and I want a 'clean' platform to showcase differences in those models. I don't want the actual power amp to affect the sound at all, except make it louder.

 

[NegativeEase]

So having a class A/B transistor poweamp, or a class D transistor poweramp, or a digital poweramp, or an all valve poweramp doesn't matter at all? It's all going to sound exactly the same?

A/B is a smart way functionally -cheaper, run cooler and if anything the cross over distortion colors the sound -but a tube scenario people may like the coloring, but in a solid state scenario it's just about amplification as clean as possible.

 

[DarthTangYang]

I have decided to not go for the Pedal Baby afterall. Since the Kraken V4 has a bypass switch allowing me to switch over to the preamp of whatever amp I end up getting, running the Kraken through a poweramp like the Pedal Baby would not be a logical solution. Getting an amp that has a preamp with a really nice clean tone would be a much better choice, allowing me to get the best of both worlds. On one hand the roaring killer distortion of the Kraken and with one step on a switch a lush, sparkling clean tone. So the question is, which amp to get in order to achieve this? I must admit I'm not well versed in amps but I have found a used Marshall Lead 100 Mosfet being sold for only $200 and from what I've heard on YouTube demos and read on forums about the Mosfet it seem to be a bit of a hidden gem in terms of solid state amps. According to some it's one of the best sounding solid state amps ever made, and to some even better than some of the more recent Marshall tube amps. I don't know whether or not this is true but if anyone has any experience of the Lead 100 Mosfet, and especially its clean sound I'd love to hear what you have to say.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

I don't have any experience with the Mosfet, but it's kind of an open secret that most Marshalls have really nice cleans.

 

[El Dunco]

I know I keep mentioning it but the Powerblock held up really well against the Orange. Both through the CD inputs (which gives you cool routing options with a mini-mixer in between) Even moreso going through the front, cab sim bypassed and utilising the eq on the preamp. Gain at 10/11 o’clock gives it a really sweet sound while staying as clean or with just a hair of breakup, like a tube poweramp and lots of volume. It was way ahead of its time.

 

[Artie]

Just an FYI, but the class A front end, IS the preamp in this unit. That's where the tone controls come into play. Using a pedal preamp is just for additional sound shaping and versatility. (And fun.)

 

[dave74]

Just an FYI, but the class A front end, IS the preamp in this unit. That's where the tone controls come into play. Using a pedal preamp is just for additional sound shaping and versatility. (And fun.)

Very true. A gain/distortion pedal is really just first-stage shaping and then you have the baby's EQ/preamp before hitting the power section.

 

[DarthTangYang]

Just an FYI, but the class A front end, IS the preamp in this unit. That's where the tone controls come into play. Using a pedal preamp is just for additional sound shaping and versatility. (And fun.)

Yes sure, but the Pedal Baby doesn't have a standard EQ in its preamp section, it's merely some kind of over-all tone shaping knob to shape it slightly for whichever cab you're using. However, the real problem is that I want to be able to use the bypass function of the Kraken V4 and the Pedal Baby doesn't have a dedicated FX-loop, the input IS basically the FX-return. In order to use the Kraken as it's intended it needs to be both hooked up through the FX-loop as well as straight into the front (preamp) of an amp. This allows you to use the two channels of the Kraken for your distortion/gain sound and then be able to bypass the Kraken completely and use the sound of the preamp of your amp for your clean tone, or any channel/channels of your amp. This isn't possible with the Pedal Baby. The Kraken V4 pedal in my opinion is really designed for, or at least makes most sense when used in a fairly clean amp with some headroom, allowing you to get a crushing valve preamp distortion and simultaneously have the sparkling clean tone at the push of a button. This is something most heavy gain amps can't do on their own. Most amps either do one or the other, especially tube amps.