Orange drops, are they even worth it?

Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

In a guitar circuit there isn't going to be any really magical tonal difference you'll hear...Myself and lew have both used a switch that allowed us to quickly switch between different cap brands rated for the same value...I remember not hearing any difference "at all" between an Orange Drop and an $9 Hovland cap in the same guitar...I was literally able to quickly switch back and forth between whatever caps I wanted on the switch...Lew has the exact same story to tell..I use the Orange Drops because they are a reliable investment,they work great in guitar amps,they're big,and they look cool....Well worth the $1 per cap price and sure beats the cheapo green ceramic caps in my guitars...If you still think you hear a tonal difference between caps in your guitars,I strongly recommend you wire a switch up and listen and see what your ears tell you? I have really good ears and have tryed all this already...

John
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

STRATDELUXER97 said:
In a guitar circuit there isn't going to be any really magical tonal difference you'll hear...Myself and lew have both used a switch that allowed us to quickly switch between different cap brands rated for the same value...I remember not hearing any difference "at all" between an Orange Drop and an $9 Hovland cap in the same guitar...I was literally able to quickly switch back and forth between whatever caps I wanted on the switch...Lew has the exact same story to tell..I use the Orange Drops because they are a reliable investment,they work great in guitar amps,they're big,and they look cool....Well worth the $1 per cap price and sure beats the cheapo green ceramic caps in my guitars...If you still think you hear a tonal difference between caps in your guitars,I strongly recommend you wire a switch up and listen and see what your ears tell you? I have really good ears and have tryed all this already...

John
Click to expand...

That's right. I use the Orange Drops because I like to know I'm using high quality parts (just in case, I guess! :smack: ) and because I like the way it looks! :)
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

Lewguitar said:
That's right. I use the Orange Drops because I like to know I'm using high quality parts (just in case, I guess! :smack: ) and because I like the way it looks! :)
Click to expand...

Orange Drops look cool,they're big,and everyone recognizes the ODs right away for these reasons...

I also like the maroon colored Xicons and Cornell Dublier Poly caps I get from Mouser..These are the same caps I use in each and every pedal I Mod,except in my wah mods...

John
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

STRATDELUXER97 said:
In a guitar circuit there isn't going to be any really magical tonal difference you'll hear...Myself and lew have both used a switch that allowed us to quickly switch between different cap brands rated for the same value...I remember not hearing any difference "at all" between an Orange Drop and an $9 Hovland cap in the same guitar...I was literally able to quickly switch back and forth between whatever caps I wanted on the switch...Lew has the exact same story to tell..I use the Orange Drops because they are a reliable investment,they work great in guitar amps,they're big,and they look cool....Well worth the $1 per cap price and sure beats the cheapo green ceramic caps in my guitars...If you still think you hear a tonal difference between caps in your guitars,I strongly recommend you wire a switch up and listen and see what your ears tell you? I have really good ears and have tryed all this already...

John
Click to expand...

The guy I was talking to wanted to do something like that, just to prove what he was saying- that there really is not much of a audible difference, often more of a percieved difference. He also pretty much reenforced what you said as to WHY people use them--> for looks. Thanks guys.
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

I did the test John mentioned where I installed a push/pull tone pot that let me switch between a .02 Orange Drop and .02 Hovland.

If the two sounded differant from each other it was to subtle to hear with any certainty.

I also found that I could play for a listener and ask them to tell me the diff between the two caps, and then make a click noise with my pick that had nothing to do with switching caps and most listeners would be fooled into thinking they were hearing a differant cap when they were hearing the same cap they'd been listening to before.

Sometimes they'd insist they sounded differant when there'd been no change made...they were still listening to the same cap!

With the tone control turned down to 1/2, sometimes I felt that when the Hovland was engaged the tone was 1/1,000,000 brighter or more transparent. :smack:

But the diff was so minute that sometimes it was the Orange Drop that struck me as being brighter or more transparent. :smack:

I think they sound pretty much identical in a guitar's tone circuit.
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

Lewguitar said:
I did the test John mentioned where I installed a push/pull tone pot that let me switch between a .02 Orange Drop and .02 Hovland.

If the two sounded differant from each other it was to subtle to hear with any certainty.

I also found that I could play for a listener and ask them to tell me the diff between the two caps, and then make a click noise with my pick that had nothing to do with switching caps and most listeners would be fooled into thinking they were hearing a differant cap when they were hearing the same cap they'd been listening to before.

Sometimes they'd insist they sounded differant when there'd been no change made...they were still listening to the same cap!

With the tone control turned down to 1/2, sometimes I felt that when the Hovland was engaged the tone was 1/1,000,000 brighter or more transparent. :smack:

But the diff was so minute that sometimes it was the Orange Drop that struck me as being brighter or more transparent. :smack:

I think they sound pretty much identical in a guitar's tone circuit.
Click to expand...

Yep....It's called "Placebo Effect".... :burnout:
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

Where's a good place to buy Orange Drops?
Are all round orange caps Orange Drops?
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

skh515 said:
Where's a good place to buy Orange Drops?
Are all round orange caps Orange Drops?
Click to expand...

Lew probably sells them....There are a few types off the top of my head?

715 series...716 series....And a Polyfilm series(forget the number)starts with a "2" 226 series?

www.mouser.com
www.hoffmanamps.com

Check with Lew first though.
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

big_black said:
I trust your ears are more in tune than mine. Thanks.
Click to expand...

Don't say that...Some of us are just way too anal about stuff and we took the time to try switching caps in and out...It was the only way I could tell for myself whether the caps in my guitars made a difference or not...

You're naturally going to bias towards the more expensive,bigger,or prettier cap as soon as you put it into your guitar...From that point on,your mind physcologically thinks there's a tonal difference...

In a guitar amp because of the voltages and where the caps are within a circuit,I do in fact hear differences between caps...A guitar circuit is just a low voltage passive circuit...in other words,the cap doesn't actually add anything,but it just shunts highend to ground...It's a subtractive device...

John
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

STRATDELUXER97 said:
In a guitar circuit there isn't going to be any really magical tonal difference you'll hear...Myself and lew have both used a switch that allowed us to quickly switch between different cap brands rated for the same value...I remember not hearing any difference "at all" between an Orange Drop and an $9 Hovland cap in the same guitar...I was literally able to quickly switch back and forth between whatever caps I wanted on the switch...Lew has the exact same story to tell..I use the Orange Drops because they are a reliable investment,they work great in guitar amps,they're big,and they look cool....Well worth the $1 per cap price and sure beats the cheapo green ceramic caps in my guitars...If you still think you hear a tonal difference between caps in your guitars,I strongly recommend you wire a switch up and listen and see what your ears tell you? I have really good ears and have tryed all this already...

John
Click to expand...

Exactly, my tech and I swapped out caps and noticed little difference from the ceramics to the Hovlands! Other than I thought it was more harsh with the Hovlands!

There is a little article on the Harmonic design website where they talk about not bothering to swap out the caps at all.

I notice a larger difference in the quality of pots such as CTS compared to my stock Gibson pots. I would only swap out the caps for the hell of it while swapping out pots - but the larger difference is in the quality of the pots and the value of the pots and caps.

Changing value has a large impact and going from linear to audio, etc.

I also notice that using a .047 cap will give you a slightly darker tone even while all knobs are on 10!

I think the thing to do is, change the pots to a different brand or to go to audio taper or linear depending on preference, change value for a change in tone.

Maybe the difference I hear isn't even in the pot quality but the fact that i went from linear to audio?

All I know is that the linear taper 300k volume pot in my LP does a LOT LESS than the 500k audio taper (CTS?) in my PRS.
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

papersoul said:
Exactly, my tech and I swapped out caps and noticed little difference from the ceramics to the Hovlands! Other than I thought it was more harsh with the Hovlands!

There is a little article on the Harmonic design website where they talk about not bothering to swap out the caps at all.

I notice a larger difference in the quality of pots such as CTS compared to my stock Gibson pots. I would only swap out the caps for the hell of it while swapping out pots - but the larger difference is in the quality of the pots and the value of the pots and caps.

Changing value has a large impact and going from linear to audio, etc.

I also notice that using a .047 cap will give you a slightly darker tone even while all knobs are on 10!

I think the thing to do is, change the pots to a different brand or to go to audio taper or linear depending on preference, change value for a change in tone.

Maybe the difference I hear isn't even in the pot quality but the fact that i went from linear to audio?

All I know is that the linear taper 300k volume pot in my LP does a LOT LESS than the 500k audio taper (CTS?) in my PRS.
Click to expand...

Great post and I absolutely agree with everything you've stated...It has been my findings also..
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

papersoul said:
I also notice that using a .047 cap will give you a slightly darker tone even while all knobs are on 10!
Click to expand...

IMO, that's because when your tone pot is on "10" some highs still leak through it and the capacitor to ground.

Unless you use a no load tone pot. Then I doubt you'd notice any difference with a .02 or .047 cap - until you start to turn the tone control down. Then you'd notice the usual diff.

Lew
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

would it be a good idea to put a .02 or smaller capacitance orange drop for a strat neck pup, or a .047 cap?

You know how it is Lew, typically what you recommend is right on the money for my tone tastes
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

Quencho092 said:
would it be a good idea to put a .02 or smaller capacitance orange drop for a strat neck pup, or a .047 cap?

You know how it is Lew, typically what you recommend is right on the money for my tone tastes
Click to expand...

Thanks! I like .02 for both pickups. That's the only value I ever use, regardless of single coil or humbucker...or neck or bridge pickup.

Just sounds "right" to me. .047 sounds to woofy when I turn the tone control down, whereas .02 leaves enough mids in the signal to get good "woman tone" as Clapton used to call it.

Lew
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

papersoul said:
I also notice that using a .047 cap will give you a slightly darker tone even while all knobs are on 10!
Click to expand...

Hmmmm... I wonder if that has something to do with the pot values? I took a spare pickguard and added a push pull system to take different caps in and out of the circuit. The push-pull lead to two sets of alligator clips that came out of the pickguard and allowed me to change caps outside the body. I heard no difference at all between a .047, a .022, and a .010 cap when the tone pot was on 10. It wasn't until the knob was rolled down to around 3 that I could even start to hear a difference. When the tone was on 1, there was a huge difference, with the .047 cap making the guitar sound like mud.

This was with a 500k audio taper pot, so maybe it can be heard when a 250k pot is on 10. On the other hand, I just grabbed an audio taper pot, put a knob on it, and it reached 250k resistance when the knob was on 8.
 
Re: Orange drops, are they even worth it?

I just switched the cap in my Ibanez RG from stock (.022 I think) to a .010 and do notice a pretty big difference. Much more of tone pot is usable and brighter.

For me, changing the value of the cap actually made a difference. I still don't use the tone control really. :)
 
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