P-Rail alternatives?

stm113

stm113

New member
I have a guitar with P-Rails in it and they’re very interesting pickups. I have read the P90 mode is the gem in the pickup and I have to agree, which is odd since I am not one to use p90s or single-coils very often. For me the the “single-coil” mode is too bright, almost shrill, the “humbucker” mode (which is where I spend most of my time) just doesn’t have the vibe I am looking for in a hum. I like a JB vibe with a little more umph in the bottom, but not so much that it muddies the sound. Does anyone have a suggestion as to a beefed up JB, with a tone closer to the P90 mode of the P-Rails when split?

Thanks all!
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

I don’t have a suggestion, but I agree about the P-Rails. As a humbucker in series it’s pure mud. It’s a bit better in parallel though. The P-90 coil is ok but the two sound too much alike.

I’ve installed a few for customers. I didn’t care for it.

A JB is actually a fairly dark pickup. So if you like the P-90 half, look for a less hot, brighter humbucker that sounds more like a beefy single coil. That’s how I make my humbucker. I want them bright and snappy when clean, with a nice bite when over driven.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

The Custom sounds a lot like a fatter JB, at least that's what I was looking for when I switched back in 2002. It's been a long time since I've heard one split, so I can't really help you there.
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

I much prefer the 59/Custom Hybrid over the JB, and in my guitars, it has similar (though stronger) punch to the PRails P90.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

dystrust said:
The Custom sounds a lot like a fatter JB, at least that's what I was looking for when I switched back in 2002. It's been a long time since I've heard one split, so I can't really help you there.
Click to expand...

The JB is 16.6k with an alnico magnet. The Custom is 14.1 with a ceramic. It’s more like a DiMarzio SDHB. Much brighter.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

DavidRavenMoon said:
The JB is 16.6k with an alnico magnet. The Custom is 14.1 with a ceramic. It’s more like a DiMarzio SDHB. Much brighter.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

We can agree to disagree as far as which one's brighter; I find them at least somewhat similar in that regard and currently have and use both of them in different guitars. OTOH a Custom definitely has more bass and low mid than a JB and it doesn't have the JB's upper mid spike. The question of which one is brighter may come down to the amp and speakers in use, and I'm mostly playing through Marshall Jubilees into Eminence Wizards.

As far as the DCR differences, the Custom is AWG43 while JBs are AWG44.
 
P-Rail alternatives?

dystrust said:
We can agree to disagree as far as which one's brighter; I find them at least somewhat similar in that regard and currently have and use both of them in different guitars. OTOH a Custom definitely has more bass and low mid than a JB and it doesn't have the JB's upper mid spike. The question of which one is brighter may come down to the amp and speakers in use, and I'm mostly playing through Marshall Jubilees into Eminence Wizards.

As far as the DCR differences, the Custom is AWG43 while JBs are AWG44.
Click to expand...

My problem with pickups like the JB is while they sound good distorted, they are total mud clean.

My favorite bridge pickups are always in the 10-14k range, of course acknowledging the higher resistance of thinner wire. As long as we keep using standard humbucker size bobbins there’s your limitations. [emoji3]

A Super Distortion is 44. So are Ricks.

But I need to be able to go from a clean chime to dirty, often in the same song. Lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

DavidRavenMoon said:
My problem with pickups like the JB is while they sound good distorted, they are total mud clean.

My favorite bridge pickups are always in the 10-14k range, of course acknowledging the higher resistance of thinner wire. As long as we keep using standard humbucker size bobbins there’s your limitations. [emoji3]

A Super Distortion is 44. So are Ricks.

But I need to be able to go from a clean chime to dirty, often in the same song. Lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I don't know if I'd say "mud", but these sorts of pickups definitely aren't my favorite for clean tones either. I usually pair both Customs and JBs with a Jazz in the neck and switch to either middle or neck position for clean tones.
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

VinceT said:
I much prefer the 59/Custom Hybrid over the JB, and in my guitars, it has similar (though stronger) punch to the PRails P90.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Hey, me too! Although it still sounds like a humbucker to me, rather than a P90. Split, it still doesn't quite get the P90 thing, though.
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

dystrust said:
I don't know if I'd say "mud", but these sorts of pickups definitely aren't my favorite for clean tones either. I usually pair both Customs and JBs with a Jazz in the neck and switch to either middle or neck position for clean tones.
Click to expand...

But sometimes you want a clean bright bridge pickup tone. I pretty much only use the neck pickup for solos. And only sometimes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

DavidRavenMoon said:
It’s a bit better in parallel though. The P-90 coil is ok but the two sound too much alike.
Click to expand...

I was going to say that you obviously have not played them much. But I'll just say that the P-90 coils sounds NOTHING like any of the other sounds of a P-Rail. I've been playing and modding them with different magnets and orientations since they first came out and have them in at least a half dozen guitars.

The P-90 is a great (not "ok") sound. I agree that the series sound is pretty bad...my least favorite of the 4 options and rarely used. The parallel setting is WAY better than series and used a lot. If the Rail coil is too bright for you try putting a UOA5 magnet next to the rail coil instead of the stock A5. If that's still too bright, you could even go as far as an A2 next to the rail, but that will also soften up the P-90 sound a bit.

But with two magnets, you can tweak the tone with almost endless possibilities.
 
Last edited:
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

GuitarDoc said:
I was going to say that you obviously have not played them much. But I'll just say that the P-90 coils sounds NOTHING like any of the other sounds of a P-Rail. I've been playing and modding them with different magnets and orientations since they first came out and have them in at least a half dozen guitars.
Click to expand...

Well as I said I’m a luthier who also does repairs. I have a customer who put them in a couple of guitars. So the extent of my testing was installing them and playing the guitar after it was setup through my rig.

I didn’t care for them. The series humbucker tone is too dark. The single coil tones are ok, but neither is wound like the real thing, especially the rail coil (coil geometry, etc). I also never use real single coils. Too much noise.

I’d much prefer a bright humbucker to cover most of those tones. It’s an interesting concept though, and not everyone is going to like every pickup. It’s one of the few Duncans I don’t like.





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

CaptainWhizz said:
It has six coils with individual wires, so there must be a fair variety of sounds.
Click to expand...

No, three coils with six wires plus ground (each coil has two wires...start and finish/ground and hot).

It looks interesting enough for me to buy one to try out. A lot of wiring possibilities. With a 5-way super switch or with a couple DPDT on-on-on switches and/or Triple Shot ring, the combinations are near endless.
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

GuitarDoc said:
No, three coils with six wires plus ground (each coil has two wires...start and finish/ground and hot).

It looks interesting enough for me to buy one to try out. A lot of wiring possibilities. With a 5-way super switch or with a couple DPDT on-on-on switches and/or Triple Shot ring, the combinations are near endless.
Click to expand...

And, at 22GBP (about 35USD), it would seem churlish not to!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

I have the perfect pup...if you had p90 routes and are patient;)

I've got a couple of sets of vox coxe pups...

They are tapped coil within coil, so always noiseless and cover extremely wide ground... Depending on amp settings and switching p90 to JB is certainly possible.

I've got a couple of sets off of damaged guitars, and really wish SD or another winder would start winding these pups!


Good description here
http://www.planetz.com/vox-coaxe-interview-with-vox-rd/

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
 
Re: P-Rail alternatives?

I always thought the idea of P-rails is to use rail and P90 in parallel rather than series. I don't have personal experience, but I think P90 coil alone + Parallel + Rail alone (to use with other pickup or alone for really thin wail) is the tone palette P-Rails excels at. (Some day I'm going to get P-rail and start experimenting, but there's too much on that list to it to happen any time soon..)

Who has experimented with partially series or cap splitting P-Rails? I think there would be usable tone to be had that way.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

B
Sanity Check on P-Rail Wiring
Replies
19
Views
262
Bill Dennis
B
P
I'd like to hear your opinion on the EMG81TW mounting orientation.
Replies
7
Views
477
freefrog
freefrog
R
Gibson P90 mounting plate alternatives?
Replies
8
Views
257
GilmourD
GilmourD
K
Wiring Diagram request: 1 P-rail, tone, volume, 3-way toggle
Replies
13
Views
243
Artie
Artie
1
P-RAIL set with Trembucker?
Replies
1
Views
67
jeremy
jeremy
Back
Top