Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

[Jack_TriPpEr]

I have been considering wiring up a spin-a-split.. is it possible to route the 4 pickup wires first to a push-pull for choice of parallel or series connection (see 1st pic), and then somehow from that push-pull, route the red and white wires' output to a spin-a-split (see 2nd pic)? I am thinking that the spin-a-split would need to be a dual-gang pot to receive the red and white wires' individual outputs separately when the push-pull is set to parallel connection? Or if that is not how to do it, is it even possible and what is the way to wire this up?

[EDIT] i realized shortly after posting this, that it seems there are three different potential goals with this and i should clarify which one i am interested in.

Goal A: have spin-a-split capability in both parallel and series modes

Goal B: have spin-a-split capability only in series mode

Goal C: have spin-a-split capability only in parallel mode

I am primarily interested in Goal A, but i would ok with Goal B if Goal A isn't even possible. And i believe to accomplish Goal B, alll that is needed is to run a jumper wire from the top right lug pictured in Pic 1, to rhe middle lug of the spin-a-split in Pic 2 (?)

 

[Bowtomecha]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

I think the problem is with parallel switching, where the series link becomes one hot lead and one grounded lead. Involving a spin a split might need an additional switch. Interesting that this is being brought up because I’ve been researching this very thing recently.

 

[Bowtomecha]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

I feel that you need at least 3 poles to do the first one.

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

I think the problem is with parallel switching, where the series link becomes one hot lead and one grounded lead. Involving a spin a split might need an additional switch. Interesting that this is being brought up because I’ve been researching this very thing recently.

Here is something i dreamed up and sketched out... would it work?

 

[Artie]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

You made that way more complicated than it need be. Just run a wire from the series link of the push-pull to the spin-a-split. That way, parallel overrides split, which is what you want. No need to split when in parallel mode.

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

You made that way more complicated than it need be. Just run a wire from the series link of the push-pull to the spin-a-split. That way, parallel overrides split, which is what you want. No need to split when in parallel mode.

Referring back to Pic 1 in my original post:

The series link of the push pull resides not in one of the common contacts of the push-pull (lugs 2 and 5), but in the series mode section of the push pull (lug 4). When the push pull is set to parallel mode, it looks to me like that series link is not active (?) So how could it be sending signal to the spin-a-split when in parallel mode.

Or am i misunderstanding which push-pull(s) lugs you are calling the series-link?

 

[Artie]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

You aren't sending signal in the parallel mode. You can't. Think about it. If both coils are in parallel, and you slowly short one to ground, you're shorting both to ground.
That's why you want parallel to override spin-a-split. Make sense?

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

You aren't sending signal in the parallel mode. You can't. Think about it. If both coils are in parallel, and you slowly short one to ground, you're shorting both to ground.
That's why you want parallel to override spin-a-split. Make sense?

Sorry, i don't understand how if the two coils are not connected to each other (because they are in parallel mode), how the slow (or even quick) short-to-ground of one of them impacts the other (?)

FYI: I don't claim to fully understand electrical theory, but i am trying to learn, and this forum has been very helpful for that.

 

[Artie]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

Coils in parallel are connected together. If you short out red/green, you're also shorting out black/white. Series mode doesn't have that problem.

 

[Bowtomecha]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

You should consider finding the sweet spot of a spin a split and then matching it to the value of a fixed resistor. It’s just a set spin a split like prs or Ibanez use in their wiring schemes. Or even better, a trimpot. Set it and forget it.

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

You should consider finding the sweet spot of a spin a split and then matching it to the value of a fixed resistor. It’s just a set spin a split like prs or Ibanez use in their wiring schemes. Or even better, a trimpot. Set it and forget it.

Thanks, i actually was thinking about transitioning over to the fixed resistor after i had wired up a spin-a-split and found the sweet spot, like you say.

But i had not considered a trim pot - that will let me skip rigght over the spin-a-split intermediate step... and save me room for other pot control functions... since my guitar only has 3 pots to begin with. Cool, thanks!

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

Coils in parallel are connected together. If you short out red/green, you're also shorting out black/white. Series mode doesn't have that problem.

View attachment 99095

Ahh, now i see it - thanks ArtieToo! I completely missed up until now why it is necessary to connect Red wire to Black wire in parallel mode as in Pic 1 above.

Let me ask this: if Red wire was somehow configured to be sent as its own Hot wire in parallel mode only, separate to the Black wire going out as a Hot wire, *then* the two coils would not be connected at all, right? They would truly be 2 independent pups, running in parallel, and one could be shorted to ground without impact to the other? This is a theoretical question only because it doesn't seem practical to add the push-pull or whatever other switch is necessary to accomplish the send of Red as a separate Hot wire in parallel mode only...

 

[Artie]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

Unfortunately, that won't work either. All you'd be doing is moving the connection point elsewhere. They'd still be connected in parallel. Spin-a-split needs the isolation provided by the "other" coil, between the pot and "hot".

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

Unfortunately, that won't work either. All you'd be doing is moving the connection point elsewhere. They'd still be connected in parallel. Spin-a-split needs the isolation provided by the "other" coil, between the pot and "hot".

Haha, ok, i see.

So, what would the output sound like in the following hypothetical scenario:

[EDIT - PENDING - I need to think this out a little more]

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

Haha, ok, i see.

So, what would the output sound like in the following hypothetical scenario:

[EDIT - PENDING - I need to think this out a little more]

Ok, i was going to propose a scenario where each coil's ground wire went to its own spin a split and each coil's hot wire went to the pickup selector switch.. but once you put that pickup selector switch to middle position to get both pickups running in parallel... i saw that all i had done was again simply moving the connection point to somewhere else. Ok, i think i now see how spin-a-split is impossible in parallel mode.

Thanks ArtieToo!

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

You should consider finding the sweet spot of a spin a split and then matching it to the value of a fixed resistor. It’s just a set spin a split like prs or Ibanez use in their wiring schemes. Or even better, a trimpot. Set it and forget it.

Could you provide a link to an example of a 100K mini trimpot for guitar? I did some looking on the internet, and what i found looked so alien to me, i wasnt sure if it was appropriate for guitar. Sorry, i have no experience with these. Thanks!

 

[Artie]

Re: Parallel/series push-pull b4 a spin-a-split?

Ok, i think i now see how spin-a-split is impossible in parallel mode.

Thanks ArtieToo!

No prob. By the way, it isn't impossible per se, just not wired the way you think. If two coils are in parallel, then you basically need your pot to be wired as a volume control. In other words, it would be just like any LP with the switch in the middle. But then, the switching gets weird if you want both functions.