Fndrfreek69
New member
I'm looking for a set of super low output organic sounding PAF style pickups for my Epiphone dot any suggestions? thanks
Pickups for 335
- Thread starter Fndrfreek69
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Dru Edwards
New member
Re: Pickups for 335
Have you considered Gibson '57 Classics? The only thing is I don't consider them "super low" output.
Have you considered Gibson '57 Classics? The only thing is I don't consider them "super low" output.
T
Thunder
Guest
Re: Pickups for 335
Seths for sure.
Seths for sure.
ImmortalSix
John Mayer's Mankini
Re: Pickups for 335
I will second Seth Lovers
I will second Seth Lovers
Jeffrec
New member
blueman335
Mojo's Minions
Re: Pickups for 335
Not being an A2 fan, I've gotten nice organic tones with other PU's & magnets in my 335's.
I like a 59B (with 250K's) and a JazzN (500K's). You could even use a '59N in the bridge. A5's give a tighter low end & better cut than A2's.
In my 490T's & '57 Classics, I use A4's with 250K's, to get a full, rich sound.
I also have a PGB with an A8, that corrects the A2's shortcomings (flabby low end, lack of bite, and low output that doesn't balance with the neck PU).
A Phat CatN on the neck paired with a bridge HB is a very good combo, especially if you put a brighter magnet in the PC. I have a Dot Deluxe with a '57 Classic (A4) and a PCN (A5/A3) that has excellent warm tones.
Not being an A2 fan, I've gotten nice organic tones with other PU's & magnets in my 335's.
I like a 59B (with 250K's) and a JazzN (500K's). You could even use a '59N in the bridge. A5's give a tighter low end & better cut than A2's.
In my 490T's & '57 Classics, I use A4's with 250K's, to get a full, rich sound.
I also have a PGB with an A8, that corrects the A2's shortcomings (flabby low end, lack of bite, and low output that doesn't balance with the neck PU).
A Phat CatN on the neck paired with a bridge HB is a very good combo, especially if you put a brighter magnet in the PC. I have a Dot Deluxe with a '57 Classic (A4) and a PCN (A5/A3) that has excellent warm tones.
Fndrfreek69
New member
Re: Pickups for 335
thanks for all the help. i was actually highly considering the seth lovers so i will probably look further into those...as for the 59's how close are they to that vintage style tone? i play mostly jazz/blues/country so i don't need something that can handle tons of gain but chord definition is super important thanks again. also how do you know what type of pots to use i know that 250k is usually for single coils but i noticed that blueman mixed and matched his.
thanks for all the help. i was actually highly considering the seth lovers so i will probably look further into those...as for the 59's how close are they to that vintage style tone? i play mostly jazz/blues/country so i don't need something that can handle tons of gain but chord definition is super important thanks again. also how do you know what type of pots to use i know that 250k is usually for single coils but i noticed that blueman mixed and matched his.
T
Thunder
Guest
gilles27
New member
Re: Pickups for 335
Done a bit of looking into original PAFs and Gibson Patent number humbuckers recently and the two that stand out in terms of authenticity are the Seths and a pickup called the Mule by Bare Knuckles.
The differences being as far as i can gather that Bare Knuckle actually speicify maple as a spacer material and butyrate as the bobbin material as well as the use of AlNiCo IV rather than II or V.
The II IV or V being in reference to the strength of the magnet, the Mule i would imagine would offer some of the advantages of the AlNiCo V Duncan '59but in a package that is otherwise more comparable with the Seths or Ants
Done a bit of looking into original PAFs and Gibson Patent number humbuckers recently and the two that stand out in terms of authenticity are the Seths and a pickup called the Mule by Bare Knuckles.
The differences being as far as i can gather that Bare Knuckle actually speicify maple as a spacer material and butyrate as the bobbin material as well as the use of AlNiCo IV rather than II or V.
The II IV or V being in reference to the strength of the magnet, the Mule i would imagine would offer some of the advantages of the AlNiCo V Duncan '59but in a package that is otherwise more comparable with the Seths or Ants
blueman335
Mojo's Minions
Re: Pickups for 335
That's the dilemma with "that vintage" PAF tone. Those PU's weren't wound to precise specs, often not even balanced, and Gibson used about 4 different magnets during those early years. PAF's are all over the board. To some guys, it's A2's, to others (like me) it's A5's. But it also depends on what amp & speaker you're running them thru. Different approaches, but nobody's wrong.
Since the same PU will sound very different depending on whether it's in the neck (dark & powerful) or the bridge (bright, sharp & thin), there's no reason to feel obligated to use the same pots or magnets in bridge & neck PU's. Neck PU's have fewer windings, which preserves their treble & clarity which aids definition. Bridge PU's are wound hotter to add mids, reduce treble, and increase output. You have two very different animals. Depending on the PU's involved, using the same magnets & pots on everything may or may not make for the best tones. Forget the "matched set" concept, that's a marketing slogan; you're interested in getting each PU to sound it's best in that slot in your guitar, and most (but not all) of the time that means "unmatched" sets.
Once a PU is built, there are two common ways to change the EQ: magnets & pots. On my guitars with a (bright) A5 or A4 magnet in the bridge PU, I'll use 250K pots to warm them (shaves off some excess treble & brings out the mids). If I have a warm magnet on the bridge, which already reduces the treble (A8 or A6), I'll use (bright) 500K pots to keep the sound from being too compressed. With neck HB's & P-90's, 500K's are almost universally used. You have a dark position, with a dark PU (HB), and you need to squeeze all the treble you can out of it, to prevent a dull, muddy sound. Likewise...if you have a bright PU, in a bright postion (bridge), you may not always want to take the treble up another notch with 500K pots. Something to think about.
As a blues player with 335's, to me the ideal vintage sound is a '59B & a JazzN. Lots of clarity & definition. Great clean or with overdrive.
That's the dilemma with "that vintage" PAF tone. Those PU's weren't wound to precise specs, often not even balanced, and Gibson used about 4 different magnets during those early years. PAF's are all over the board. To some guys, it's A2's, to others (like me) it's A5's. But it also depends on what amp & speaker you're running them thru. Different approaches, but nobody's wrong.
Since the same PU will sound very different depending on whether it's in the neck (dark & powerful) or the bridge (bright, sharp & thin), there's no reason to feel obligated to use the same pots or magnets in bridge & neck PU's. Neck PU's have fewer windings, which preserves their treble & clarity which aids definition. Bridge PU's are wound hotter to add mids, reduce treble, and increase output. You have two very different animals. Depending on the PU's involved, using the same magnets & pots on everything may or may not make for the best tones. Forget the "matched set" concept, that's a marketing slogan; you're interested in getting each PU to sound it's best in that slot in your guitar, and most (but not all) of the time that means "unmatched" sets.
Once a PU is built, there are two common ways to change the EQ: magnets & pots. On my guitars with a (bright) A5 or A4 magnet in the bridge PU, I'll use 250K pots to warm them (shaves off some excess treble & brings out the mids). If I have a warm magnet on the bridge, which already reduces the treble (A8 or A6), I'll use (bright) 500K pots to keep the sound from being too compressed. With neck HB's & P-90's, 500K's are almost universally used. You have a dark position, with a dark PU (HB), and you need to squeeze all the treble you can out of it, to prevent a dull, muddy sound. Likewise...if you have a bright PU, in a bright postion (bridge), you may not always want to take the treble up another notch with 500K pots. Something to think about.
As a blues player with 335's, to me the ideal vintage sound is a '59B & a JazzN. Lots of clarity & definition. Great clean or with overdrive.
Re: Pickups for 335
Blueman I'm curious about something, being a fellow A5 fan myself. Are you using 250/300K pots on the volume only? Or on volume AND tone at the bridge? I've been working on my amp and it sounds exactly as I want it to sound, but now my neck is a little dark when the bridge is eq'd to where I like it, or the bridge is too bright if the neck is eq'd! I've got 500K all around but I've been thinking about dropping the original 300K volume back in at the bridge. Curious which pot you are indicating, or both, when you state 250K.
Blueman I'm curious about something, being a fellow A5 fan myself. Are you using 250/300K pots on the volume only? Or on volume AND tone at the bridge? I've been working on my amp and it sounds exactly as I want it to sound, but now my neck is a little dark when the bridge is eq'd to where I like it, or the bridge is too bright if the neck is eq'd! I've got 500K all around but I've been thinking about dropping the original 300K volume back in at the bridge. Curious which pot you are indicating, or both, when you state 250K.
Re: Pickups for 335
I have a '59 set in a '335 copy and I couldn't ask for anything better. They just sound superb in semi-hollow guitars.
I agree that seths would be excellent too but I'd start with a set of '59s: great sounding yet less costly than the other options and you probably won't even feel the need for anything else either.
I have a '59 set in a '335 copy and I couldn't ask for anything better. They just sound superb in semi-hollow guitars.
I agree that seths would be excellent too but I'd start with a set of '59s: great sounding yet less costly than the other options and you probably won't even feel the need for anything else either.
blueman335
Mojo's Minions
Re: Pickups for 335
This is what got me using 250K's and swapping magnets! Dark, muffled neck or bright, thin bridge...take your pick. It drives me crazy. For me, the solution is a warm bridge & a bright neck, in other words, bringing the EQ's closer (instead of being total opposites). I get the PU's EQ'd together with the tone pots on "10", so one amp EQ setting will work for both. I used to set my amp for one PU, and when I switched to the other, the tone was way off, so I ended up using only one PU all the time. Now that I warm the bridge (magnets or pots), I can set my amp with more treble, which makes the neck brighter and better defined (added benefit). I switch back & forth between PU's all the time now, as both sound good. Sometimes I'll even forget which PU is on.
When I use 250K's, I have them for both volume & tone on the bridge, whether straight pots or push-pulls. With the brighter magnets (A5 & A4) 250K's give me the crunch & punch I want for the bridge. But some guys want the extra treble, or prefer to adjust the tone each time they plug in, which works fine for them. You can also use a 250K/300K volume and a 500K tone, which is warmer than two 500K's, but not as much as two 250K's. You see a lot posts on this forum about certain bridge PU's being too bright or thin (especially PAF types). Well, if it has an A5 magnet & 500K pots...duh. What do you expect? You're piling on treble at every juncture.
All of the above applies only to bridges. Since I only have HB's, P-90's, and Phat Cats, I always use 500K's on the neck PU's.
There's no "right" way to do this, and different players use different ways to get their tones, but this is what works for me.
This is what got me using 250K's and swapping magnets! Dark, muffled neck or bright, thin bridge...take your pick. It drives me crazy. For me, the solution is a warm bridge & a bright neck, in other words, bringing the EQ's closer (instead of being total opposites). I get the PU's EQ'd together with the tone pots on "10", so one amp EQ setting will work for both. I used to set my amp for one PU, and when I switched to the other, the tone was way off, so I ended up using only one PU all the time. Now that I warm the bridge (magnets or pots), I can set my amp with more treble, which makes the neck brighter and better defined (added benefit). I switch back & forth between PU's all the time now, as both sound good. Sometimes I'll even forget which PU is on.
When I use 250K's, I have them for both volume & tone on the bridge, whether straight pots or push-pulls. With the brighter magnets (A5 & A4) 250K's give me the crunch & punch I want for the bridge. But some guys want the extra treble, or prefer to adjust the tone each time they plug in, which works fine for them. You can also use a 250K/300K volume and a 500K tone, which is warmer than two 500K's, but not as much as two 250K's. You see a lot posts on this forum about certain bridge PU's being too bright or thin (especially PAF types). Well, if it has an A5 magnet & 500K pots...duh. What do you expect? You're piling on treble at every juncture.
All of the above applies only to bridges. Since I only have HB's, P-90's, and Phat Cats, I always use 500K's on the neck PU's.
There's no "right" way to do this, and different players use different ways to get their tones, but this is what works for me.
wanmei1
New member
Re: Pickups for 335
I think you just have to take the plunge and buy whatever your research, soundclip listening and instincts leads you to.
I'ts a bit like buying that first acoustic guitar.
In spite of doing research, you don't really know what you want until you've bought one as there are so many conflicting
recommendations.
By taking the plunge and buying one, you have a familiar reference sound point for comparison. You then know what you like and don't like and what you want and don't want.
Fortunately with pickups if the sound isn't quite right you can expirement and inexpensively modify them a bit to get closer to the sound your after.
In my opinion if you like a good midrange sound then you won't find better than SD Seths and Antiquity's.
Iif you like to hear more of the natural sound of your guitars wood with a slightly recessed midrange then SD 59's are good... but you might find Gibson Classic 57's to be better.
I think you just have to take the plunge and buy whatever your research, soundclip listening and instincts leads you to.
I'ts a bit like buying that first acoustic guitar.
In spite of doing research, you don't really know what you want until you've bought one as there are so many conflicting
recommendations.
By taking the plunge and buying one, you have a familiar reference sound point for comparison. You then know what you like and don't like and what you want and don't want.
Fortunately with pickups if the sound isn't quite right you can expirement and inexpensively modify them a bit to get closer to the sound your after.
In my opinion if you like a good midrange sound then you won't find better than SD Seths and Antiquity's.
Iif you like to hear more of the natural sound of your guitars wood with a slightly recessed midrange then SD 59's are good... but you might find Gibson Classic 57's to be better.
Chickenwings
Alnico 6/8
Re: Pickups for 335
59s.
59s.
L
Lewguitar
Guest
Re: Pickups for 335
I don't like alnico 5 humbuckers for the neck position: to much bass. When I crank up the volume they get muddy when I play chords I want to sound clean.
Even the Jazz neck has to much bass for my tastes.
I like alnico 2 better all around.
My favorite humbucker equipped guitars all have alnico 2 humbuckers and I agree with the guys suggetsing the Seth Lovers or Antiquitys.
However, Larry Carlton is known as Mr. 335 and his '69 ES-335 has two identical and stock Gibson Alnico 5 humbuckers. In those days both pickups were identical - they didn't overwind the bridge pickup or underwind the neck pickup.
Sure works for Larry, and the closest thing to what's in that guitar would be a pair of alnico 5 Duncan 59B's. Wouldn't work for me but it sure works for him.
Check out Larry's website and take a look at all the videos. You'll learn a lot. I did! http://mr335.tv/index.html?channel=rig&videofile=mr335/rig/335setup
I don't like alnico 5 humbuckers for the neck position: to much bass. When I crank up the volume they get muddy when I play chords I want to sound clean.
Even the Jazz neck has to much bass for my tastes.
I like alnico 2 better all around.
My favorite humbucker equipped guitars all have alnico 2 humbuckers and I agree with the guys suggetsing the Seth Lovers or Antiquitys.
However, Larry Carlton is known as Mr. 335 and his '69 ES-335 has two identical and stock Gibson Alnico 5 humbuckers. In those days both pickups were identical - they didn't overwind the bridge pickup or underwind the neck pickup.
Sure works for Larry, and the closest thing to what's in that guitar would be a pair of alnico 5 Duncan 59B's. Wouldn't work for me but it sure works for him.
Check out Larry's website and take a look at all the videos. You'll learn a lot. I did! http://mr335.tv/index.html?channel=rig&videofile=mr335/rig/335setup
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