Please help with my les paul

[buellracer]

Hey, I posted this over in the guitar part of the forum too, but I don't know where I would get the most help so here it is.
I'm new here, and I've got a question. I have a 2001 Gibson Les Pual gothic and the whole time I've had it the 490r in the neck was always overly bassy and muddy (even compared to other les pauls with a 490r in the neck) while the 490t in the bridge was just fine. This weekend I swapped the pots from bridge to neck and vice versa and installed a set of SD seth lovers. I love the way the bridge seth sounds (which since I swapped the pots around, leads me to believe it wasn't the pots doing it) but the neck pickup is still muffled and dark sounding. The only thing I really haven't checked is the wire going from the switch to the pot. Could this be degrading my signal? Or would it really open this thing up to install all around 500k pots (since it comes stock with 300k vol. and 500k tone). My dad has recently got a 2001 gibson les paul studio with the 490s in it and his bridge sounds about the same but his neck pickup is much brighter and clearer.
By the way if it helps the amps I use are a gibson ga-5 les paul jr. and a fender hot rod deluxe.

Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[jeremy]

Re: Please help with my les paul

try lowering the neck pup. 500k pots will open up the high end quite a bit as well

 

[buellracer]

Re: Please help with my les paul

I've tried lowering the pickups to the point where my neck pickup was almost at the end of the screws (it was down in the cavity). It did lower the overall boom, because it weekend the pickup but for some reason when my knobs are maxed it sounds like the tone is still on about 5-6. I'm thinking it has to be something in the electronics, like a faulty wire or something because (especially with the satin finish) my les paul is particularly bright acousticly.

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: Please help with my les paul

I don't know anything about you or how you play so this is just a guess -- but maybe you need to alter your playing technique some when playing the neck pickup?

Play more gently and maybe a bit closer to the bridge. If you're thrashing the strings like a punk rocker, then there's no neck pu in the world that will get rid of the mud.

 

[buellracer]

Re: Please help with my les paul

I like to think I play with a rather soft touch (I was originally taught to play jazz). Just my neck is so boomy and bassy. Like with my volume on 10 and my tone on 10 on the neck I have the woman tone NAILED. Most people say that they have to almost roll the tone all the way down, if I do that you can't understand what the hell I'm doing.

Thanks for the help yall. I'm going to install 500ks all around tomorrow and I'll let you know how that works out.

 

[Simon_F]

Re: Please help with my les paul

I'm going to install 500ks all around tomorrow

That should solve your problem. 500K pots and Seth Lovers make a great-sounding Les Paul.

 

[octavedoctor]

Re: Please help with my les paul

That should solve your problem. 500K pots and Seth Lovers make a great-sounding Les Paul.

Absolutely. The 300k vol, even though it's not directly connecting to the tone cap will pull down the gain and the top end slightly. You might want to try bringing up the adjustable poles in the front coil of the neck pickup; this slews the flux density, subtly altering the balance of the cancelled harmonics.

At the risk of stating the bleedin' obvious, make sure that all your solder joints are good particularly the signal wire from the centre tag of the volume pot. You do have them wired as potential dividers, don't you? If the volume pot is reverse wired (pickup into centre tag, signal out from end tag) then the pickup will lose clarity if the volume is reduced, although you will be able to adjust the volumes independently.

 

[martinsixstringcustoms]

Re: Please help with my les paul

I agree with going w/ 500K Pots. Additionally, does anything make you believe that the cap is faulty as well?

 

[The Golden Boy]

Re: Please help with my les paul

I agree with going w/ 500K Pots. Additionally, does anything make you believe that the cap is faulty as well?

As long as the pot is OK, and it's wide open, the cap shouldn't be a factor at all.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Please help with my les paul

I like a 300K pot in the bridge-especially with a hot pup. But - back to the neck:
1. Try lowering the bass side slightly
2. 500k pot (which I like in the neck! And I love my 490 neck!!!!!!!)
3. Since I'm not a pro w/ an Iron, check the solder!

 

[LPCustom]

Re: Please help with my les paul

If he plays with the pots turned full on (set at 10) then the rating of the pots matter. With the pot set to 10 the cap is in full play. You could have a cap that has a too high microfarad rating on the capacitor attached to the tone pot for the bridge. If you do, no amount of fiddling with the pot is going to fix the sound. Check the rating on that cap.

I would also make sure that when set to 0 that you get no resistance (or very little) from the volume and tone pots. If you are getting resistance in the pots even when the wipers are set to 0, then you have defective pots and they should be replaced. You should be getting at or very near the rated resistance on one side and little or no resistance on the other side with the wiper at 0 or 10. (you may need to disconnect the pot to check it)

On a Gibson Les Paul, you should have caps rated at about .047 microfarads (47 picofarads). If it's higher than that, it will attenuate the higher frequencies more. If it's lower than that, it will attenuate the higher frequencies less. You could try removing the cap from the neck tone pot to see if that brightens it up enough. If that doesn't do it, then the cap isn't your culprit.

Just remember that pots and caps do not always have the resistance or capacitance respectively that they are rated at. And the variations can make a big difference on how your pickups work.

 

[buellracer]

Re: Please help with my les paul

So are you saying I should try it with just a wire connecting the vol pot and the tone pot (completely void of the cap)? I'm about to install my 500k pots and I will tell yall how it is with and without the cap through my Ga-5.

 

[The Golden Boy]

Re: Please help with my les paul

So are you saying I should try it with just a wire connecting the vol pot and the tone pot (completely void of the cap)? I'm about to install my 500k pots and I will tell yall how it is with and without the cap through my Ga-5.

I'd just unsolder the cap from the volume pot, just to see. No need to throw the other pot into the mix. <that's an ungainly use of metaphors.

 

[CraigJC]

Re: Please help with my les paul

The stock pot could be defective. New pots are a wise decision.

I wouls also recommend a .022 microfarad capacitor, somthing of a polyester film or film in foil variety. Sweet 'woman' tones.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Please help with my les paul

That should solve your problem. 500K pots and Seth Lovers make a great-sounding Les Paul.

500K pots. .02 tone caps connected to the middle terminal of each volume control...NOT the terminal the pickup is soldered to. That'll do it. The Seth Lovers sound best to me with 500K pots...250K bleeds off to much treble. Lew

 

[buellracer]

Re: Please help with my les paul

Why and how does it affect the tone to have the cap soldered to the middle lugs on vol and tone instead of pickup lug of vol to middle lug of tone?

 

[buellracer]

Re: Please help with my les paul

Ok everybody, thank you so much for the help.
I installed the 500k pots (4 new ones) and I did as Lew suggested and soldered the caps onto the middle lugs of vol. and tone pots and WOW!
THIS IS WHAT A LES PAUL IS SUPPOSED TO SOUND LIKE!!!
The seths have the perfect amount of grit and are really focused and they just flat out sound AMAZING, everything from sparkiling beautiful jazzy cleans to huge fat balls out rock. This guitar with these pots and pickups IS CLASSIC ROCK.
Carlos Santana
Eric Clapton
Van Halen
AC/DC
to Chet Atkins
Joe Pass
Les Paul
I now own these tones!
Thank you all so much for the help and thank you Seymour!