Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

[stupendous silly]

I picked up one of these used and left the orginal EMG's with the previous owner for a small discount (dumb move I now think), and had the pots and switch changed for passives. I was planning putting a JB in the bridge. I never had one, but thought it would be a good versatile highish output passive, and I wouldn't think much about this topic for a while. Neck pickup is easier in my thinking after the fixing something for the bridge. Things have turned out somewhat less simple. I had a couple of spare pickups to fill in temporarily, and I am tonally more concerned after trying them. I tried the Bare Knuckle Black Dog and Dimarzio Breed, not for any particular reason but that I had them free. My humble observation is that Torero is a highly resonant guitar - it is a maple neck-though mahogany wings and 25.5 scale length, Flod Rose, for your info- and it has a loud explosive voice. I am not sure how the original EMGs on it (81/85 I think) worked, didn't have a good situation to try extensively when buying because of set up issues and because owner was had a cheap processor and earphones to try it on. But I think both the Breed and the Black Dog are rather mid-heavy pups, and on this guitar they resulted with an excessively middy and nasal voice, and they hit the amps so hard I doubt any amp would produce a nice response to that. I haven't spent a lot of time with the guitar but as it is I find it hard to spend time with it. My idea shifted from a JB to a Custom 5 to keep those mids in check, but I might rather go for 59/Custom for a more raw and agressive voice I can better associate with this axe. I am open to other suggestions and ideas/experiences/knowledge. I play classic/hard-rock for the most part and thought this guitar would find a place at the heavy end of my musical spectrum. What do you think?

 

[VinceT]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Before you mentioned it, I’d already decided to suggest the 58/custom!


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[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Before you mentioned it, I’d already decided to suggest the 58/custom!


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I don't have a lot of shots I can take this month, so trying to be make certain it will work.

 

[Masta' C]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

The Custom 5 would probably work well in you case. Definitely check out the PATB-1 (Original Parallel Axis) pickup and the matching neck model, as well.

JB might be too "nasally" in your case, maybe not, although that would normally be one of my initial suggestions based on what it sounds like you're after.

If you can spend a little more, I would suggest something like the '78 model or the RTM.

From DiMarzio, check out the Fred, AT-1 and Air Zone models

EDIT: Correction about mids statement

 

[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

I think the 59/Custom is actually more mids-focused than either of those pickups on their own, but that's just me

The Custom 5 would probably work well in you case. Definitely check out the PATB-1 (Original Parallel Axis) pickup and the matching neck model, as well.

JB might be too "nasally" in your case, maybe not, although that would normally be one of my initial suggestions based on what it sounds like you're after.

If you can spend a little more, I would suggest something like the '78 model or the RTM.

From DiMarzio, check out the Fred, AT-1 and Air Zone models

The RTM looks most interesting, but I don't think I will commit to an expensive pup before doing some experimentation with used run-of-the-mill pickups. I see a strong possiblity this guitar will go.

 

[Demanic]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Go with the Custom 5. Worse comes to worse, you could put a regular ceramic in it and make it a Custom.

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[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Go with the Custom 5. Worse comes to worse, you could put a regular ceramic in it and make it a Custom.

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Yes that is an idea I was entertaining as well. I am in Turkey and replacement magnets may not readily be available here though.

 

[Demanic]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

You can pull a ceramic from any cheap OEM Asian humbucker.

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[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Dimarzio Steve's Special sounds just right by eq and description. Full frequency range, scooped mids, big bottom end, smoothed highs. I said I can associate the raw sound of 59/custom hybrid well with this guitar, but it could be too much of a good thing. I am not very intent on getting Dimarzios though because of the general observation that they mask the guitar's natural voice, which I tend to feel like too. Not sure if it matters as much for high-gain playing but I like woodier tones in general (also Dimarzio's don't come with nickel covers which look great on Torero - no not a real concern, but wouldn't mind good looks either) Do you know pickups from the Duncan range, or other brands I can get similar effect without maybe as dramatic a shift in eq as with Dimarzios?

 

[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Also, what places do you guys get your Duncan compatible magnets? I am considering ordering a pack if I can, and I pretty much know what magnets I would need to pick, but can you note ones with special appointments, like A2 'roughcast' whatever, that are widely used and would be very good to have at hand?

 

[Phantasmagoria]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Don't know about magnets (not done much swapping) but I second the Custom 5 suggestion. They sound awesome in middy guitars. I probably would'nt ever have tried one but for the fact that the Charvel Pro series (Alder/Floyd) I bought a year or so ago had one stock-fitted in the bridge..damn that guitar just sings/screams! Def going to get another for my Ibby SZ as soon as funds permit :laugh2:

 

[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Don't know about magnets (not done much swapping) but I second the Custom 5 suggestion. They sound awesome in middy guitars. I probably would'nt ever have tried one but for the fact that the Charvel Pro series (Alder/Floyd) I bought a year or so ago had one stock-fitted in the bridge..damn that guitar just sings/screams! Def going to get another for my Ibby SZ as soon as funds permit :laugh2:

I think I should add 'soft-attack' as another criteria for the pup I need, should it be possible, because this guitar feels über-tight. Not sure how the Custom 5 fits in there, but JB could be better in that respect - not sure though, both Alnico 5.. Maple neck-through users should have things to say.

 

[Phantasmagoria]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Do you mean a slightly looser overall feel? Because I think the Custom 5 has that.. the mids are open & it's very round (3D) and organic sounding (in the right guitar). Really has a nice fat deep-crunchy (but not mushy) feel to it for rhythm & a nice sweet top end for solo's..

This is a demo I did which is far from a professional quality recording, but might give you an idea of it's sound anyway :laugh2: .... just a jam with my loop pedal/metronome & my Charvel going straight into my AMT Stonehead solid state head (recorded direct with a digital handheld recorder)

I also have a maple neck-through with mahogany wings/Floyd Rose ...really happy with the Dean DMT Baker Act (JB with the mid-hump tamed a bit) /MAB Hands Without Shadows bridge/neck combo I have in there. Having said that I think the custom 5 would probably sound great in it as well...

 

[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Do you mean a slightly looser overall feel? Because I think the Custom 5 has that.. the mids are open & it's very round (3D) and organic sounding (in the right guitar). Really has a nice fat deep-crunchy (but not mushy) feel to it for rhythm & a nice sweet top end for solo's..

This is a demo I did which is far from a professional quality recording, but might give you an idea of it's sound anyway :laugh2: .... just a jam with my loop pedal/metronome & my Charvel going straight into my AMT Stonehead solid state head (recorded direct with a digital handheld recorder)

I also have a maple neck-through with mahogany wings/Floyd Rose ...really happy with the Dean DMT Baker Act (JB with the mid-hump tamed a bit) /MAB Hands Without Shadows bridge/neck combo I have in there. Having said that I think the custom 5 would probably sound great in it as well...

Thanks that was very informative and helpful... exactly as you say, looser overall feel... I think I will like something with more lows and low mids, so fuller sounding than Custom 5, but may just give it a shot as well, never bad to hold at least one Custom at hand. That was a nice demo. Never heard those pickups you last mention, definitely going to check them out.

 

[Despair]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

The JB often sits really well in maple neck-through guitars, part of why it's extremely popular in Jackson guitars. But not everyone loves screaming upper mids. Phrases "ice pick" or screaming harmonics often come up.

Custom 5 does sound like a good match for what you want out of the guitar.

If the Custom 5 needs a bit more even mids and a bit less high end, a roughcast A5 would be the next stop. If you need higher output and deeper low end, an A8 would be the way to go, but it sounds like you don't like high output with your rig.

After that, Unoriented A5, it's a bit lower output, less harsh highs and slightly more mids. I don't know if I'd go polished or roughcast, that depends on how the high end sits, really. Polished if you need brighter of the two.

I'd take a PATB-1b over the Custom 5, but it's a bit higher output--but responds incredibly to dynamics. However, it is a bit wider than most humbuckers, so a bit tricky to get in the pickup cavity of some guitars, and some find the looks offputting. I care about function vastly more than form...

PATB-1b is somewhat like a Custom 5, but high end tends to be a bit sweeter, with a softer attack that sharpens with hard picking. It's ridiculously sensitive to height adjustment [but lacks individual polepiece height adjustments]. Wrong height and the mids drop out and it's like a cross between a tele and a piano in tone. I occasionally wish I could get that without losing too much of the mids.

PATB-1b might be hard to unload if it is a miss, and tends to be poor availability as well as a bit more expensive, particularly overseas, so I don't know that I can recommend it for you.

I wouldn't completely dismiss the '59/Custom Hybrid as too midrangy, it has a broad midrange that sits well in a lot of guitars that are picky with more common pickups. But still lots of character, without excessive output. Doesn't overwhelm the instrument's character.

 

[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

The JB often sits really well in maple neck-through guitars, part of why it's extremely popular in Jackson guitars. But not everyone loves screaming upper mids. Phrases "ice pick" or screaming harmonics often come up.

Custom 5 does sound like a good match for what you want out of the guitar.

If the Custom 5 needs a bit more even mids and a bit less high end, a roughcast A5 would be the next stop. If you need higher output and deeper low end, an A8 would be the way to go, but it sounds like you don't like high output with your rig.

After that, Unoriented A5, it's a bit lower output, less harsh highs and slightly more mids. I don't know if I'd go polished or roughcast, that depends on how the high end sits, really. Polished if you need brighter of the two.

I'd take a PATB-1b over the Custom 5, but it's a bit higher output--but responds incredibly to dynamics. However, it is a bit wider than most humbuckers, so a bit tricky to get in the pickup cavity of some guitars, and some find the looks offputting. I care about function vastly more than form...

PATB-1b is somewhat like a Custom 5, but high end tends to be a bit sweeter, with a softer attack that sharpens with hard picking. It's ridiculously sensitive to height adjustment [but lacks individual polepiece height adjustments]. Wrong height and the mids drop out and it's like a cross between a tele and a piano in tone. I occasionally wish I could get that without losing too much of the mids.

PATB-1b might be hard to unload if it is a miss, and tends to be poor availability as well as a bit more expensive, particularly overseas, so I don't know that I can recommend it for you.

I wouldn't completely dismiss the '59/Custom Hybrid as too midrangy, it has a broad midrange that sits well in a lot of guitars that are picky with more common pickups. But still lots of character, without excessive output. Doesn't overwhelm the instrument's character.

I will consider these options, great info thank you. I have taken an interest in Wolfetone Timbre wolf, the description on the site is spot on but it is expensive and and accessability for me is somewhat problematic, it must be in the Jb ballpark with smoother highs and deeper lows, supposed to be slight mid-scoop. I can just get a used JB for a great price and play around with rough-cast and UAO5 to get the best result I like. If only I can get my hands on the right set of magnets (I am in Turkey). The thing is, because I totally counted out the EMGs when buying this, I thought I would get a pretty neutral neck-through tone platform with big sound and sustain when I removed them. It is the the least 'neutral' tone character I can imagine, at least considered within my past guitar experience. This guitar, I now think, is probably designed mainly for super-tight metal riffage, and maybe stacatto feeling solos...

 

[GuitarDoc]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

The Custom 5 is a great pup and may work just fine for what you want. But, contrary to what Masta' C said, the C/59 hybrid is definitely NOT more mid focused than either the Custom or 59. It is very airy, clean and articulate, not as powerful as the Custom 5, and won't overdrive your amp like you've experienced. The hybrid is probably exactly what you need in your guitar.

 

[Masta' C]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

I apologize, Doc is correct. The C/59 is mildly scooped and fairly bright up top. It has a tad more compression and a bit more midrange than a '59, but less output than a Custom or Custom 5. I also remember the harmonic character being really good and the pickup having a certain "spank" to it, carried over from the '59 no doubt.

I don't know what I was thinking when I posted about the C/59 being "more mid-focused" above (I have since edited that post to avoid further confusion), but I DO remember there was something I didn't fully like about the midrange character on the C/59 compared to the regular models and that's why I ended up pulling it. I just wasn't clear with my statement.

For what it's worth, I remember choosing a '78 model over it at the time. Don't quite remember why, but I felt it better fit what I was looking to play at the time (classic rock up to VH).

The rest of my recommendations are solid and seem to be shared by the other posters here.

 

[stupendous silly]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Okay gentlemen I want to give a short progress report and get your opinions. I tried a BareKnuckle Holy Diver I removed from another guitar, mainly because it is what is recommended for this type of guitar in the past at BareKnuckle forum. It was good but still pretty stiff sounding, and didn't add the kind of juice I was looking for to the sound . So I picked up a used JB - noteworthy that it was coming out of a Jackson soloist - and bang, I am there. Not, but almost. The JB sounds squishier than anything else I tried so is a good remedy for the excessive attack. Unfortunately the infamous bottom end flub is there too, so it lacks some definition in lower strings, but I don't hear much the again infamous ice-pick in it. The sound fattened up and got smoother the way I would like. But one fundamental problem in the guitar's sound for me is still there. I didn' state it clearly because I couldn't tell what it was about, until I read someone define it as 'scratchy pick-attack' in a forum entry. There is a pervasive fizzyness in the guitar's sound, supposedly, according to the forum commentator I am drawing on, is a result of the combination of very fast attack and the high-mids focus in the guitar's natural voice. I may not have emphasized properly, but this is a very bright guitar. And although, for instance, the 59 Custom hybrid has good things said for it, like balanced mids and lower output that will alleviate some of the problems, both the C5 and the Hybrid must be pretty bright and trebly in my estimate. I may be completely wrong on this, and I actually spotted a used Custom 5 I can pick up and try (although I need to take a trip to a distant part of the district), but I am more inclined toward Dimarzio Steve's Special for the job from what I read.
Looking to hear your opinions and suggestions if all this makes sense, and be comfortable and kind enough to tell me if it does not.

 

[Phantasmagoria]

Re: Prs Se Torero anyone? need pickups (I hope I only need pickups)

Unfortunately have no experience with the Steve's Special, but still maintain the C5 is worth trying if you have the opportunity. The highs are smoother and rounder than some of the squeakier notes laugh2 in my demo would have you believe & it has ample lows/is really thick sounding too. If you have a middy sounding guitar it's a phenomenal fit. Plus you do have ample opportunities for mag swapping if you are'nt really happy with it..

I'd just levelled my frets before doing that video & had'nt crowned them & the icepick might have come from a couple of improperly treated frets..also I have a tapped finger slide thing that I do with my picking hand which basically extends off the fret board & over the pickups that can have a piercing effect which I think sounds cool but some may not :laugh2:.

When I bought that Charvel it had been lying untouched/new/unplayed for years with it's strings off and there was a bit of backbow as a result of which some of the frets were uneven & needed to be worked on..it plays like a complete dream now after a bit of work, but I bought it cheap for that reason

Other things you could try..

A perfect fit sonically would be a Lace Deathbucker (my fave humbucker) .. thick lower mids & tight deep bass (not clinically so), slightly scooped & really open mids, warm round highs ...it will do everything you describe you need and more. Despite the name it's actually a very versatile sounding pickup & will work great for any style of playing. However it's aesthtics might be a problem for some (not me )

I just put a clip with it up in this thread in the amp section here.. it's a rough studio clip with my Doom band..

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/showthread.php?325667-Bugera-V22-or-Blackstar-HT50


The DMT Baker act I mentioned before is a great fit for my mahog/maple neck-through axe. It's like a JB that's had everything people don't like about that pickup sorted out (ie less "cocked wah" mids, tighter bass etc) ..but they seem to have stopped making them & they're hard to find...