Question for the luthiers...will this work?

[rspst14]

Let's say you have a Wolfgang with a non-floating Floyd, but the action is a bit screwy. It's way too low at the nut and way too high past the 12th fret. This is definitely not a setup problem, it's just physically impossible to get the action any lower. At some point, turning the bridge screws only causes the bridge to tilt forward, the action doesn't get any lower. I was able to fix the problem at the nut by using a thin Floyd nut shim, but I'm not sure how to go about fixing the problem at the bridge. I came up with three ideas:

1. Shim the neck

2. The area the Floyd sits on is slightly recessed. I don't mean "recessed" as in a recessed Floyd, I mean that it sits flat on the body, but there's a small area of wood removed on the face of the guitar so that the Floyd can mount flat, but still sit deeper in the body. A good luthier could probably deepen this slightly so that the action could be set lower

3. Have a luthier or machinist grind down the saddles a bit, while maintaining the proper radius. As long as he didn't take off too much metal, there shouldn't be any problem, and it would enable me to get lower action.

I'm leaning toward idea #3, does anyone see anything wrong with this approach? I know I'm not the only one who's had this problem with the Wolfgang. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

Ryan

 

[theodie]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

Shim the neck IMO!

 

[ErikH]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

Check your neck relief. I bet the neck has a nasty bow. Every Wolfgang I've picked up has had very low action. If that checks out, shim the neck.

 

[rspst14]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

No issues with the truss rod. The neck is almost straight with just a small amount of relief, just how I like it.

 

[Zerberus]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

Shim the neck. If the Floyd nut is already shimmed to the proper height, nothing should be left in the way of low action and effortless bends.

If you really hate the new neck angle, then consider taking it to a good luthier and having the rout modified. But not as a first step

 

[XSSIVE]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

shim the neck...that's typical of a guitar with a non-recessed floyd and nothing new or wrong.

-Mike

 

[frankfalbo]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

I always route neck angles into the pocket. You can get get very precise and you're left with a perfectly flat bottomed neck route. The problem on the wolfgang (or any non-floating floyd) is that you want the bridge to sit perfectly flat. That's basically like having a non-adjustable bridge. Sure you could go a little higher and have the bridge angle back slightly. But it looks the best when its laying flat against the guitar. So you're basically adjusting the bridge height with the neck angle. I did an OLP for a client with a floyd, lock nut, and new pups. It's actually a pretty fun guitar now.

Anyway, that's the "right" fix for it, but shimming is okay too. I just can't stand the thought of shims on anything. The lock nut shims are fine, because the nuts are metal anyway. But a paper or wooden shim in a neck pocket is hard for me to take. Plus they dig into the body wood to the point of being useless after awhile. So you have to use a shim that's a little taller than necessary because you know the body will compress. Especially Basswood on the wolfgang.

 

[Fritz6]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

I use masking tape on the neck heel itself. Think I got it from Steve Kersting's page. The tape wont compress or shift in the pocket.

One of my axes has two strips on the heel area closest to the neck pup, one in the middle of the heel, one parallel under the high e and then a small square under the high e in the corner of the neck heel. The relief is .003"

Your gonna have to take the neck off a bunch of times, let it sit, play it a while. But it'll be worth it. Eventually it'll be dialed in pretty tight.

projectguitar.com has a good tutorial on shimming also that helped me out alot.

 

[Blueline]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

it sounds like you need a steeper neck angle which could be done by shimming the neck
or you could drop the floyd lower into the guitar
i don't work with floyd's much, but if there is already a cutour for it and it is alreadly slightly recessed, a top bearing dado bit would make quick work of it

 

[frankfalbo]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

Not on the wolfgang. The wolfgang's route is just to accomodate the "underchassis" and not a full recess. But yes, you're right that a bearing bit would just follow the existing route like a template. But on the wolfgang that wouldn't gain you any depth of the unit itself.

 

[theodie]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

I had a wolfgang and I will say that it will be diffacult to use a router and a
flush trim bit to follow that tiny amount of recesses to deepen the pocket! You will also have to pull the studs, drill em deeper and re-press them. Also, alot of Wolfgangs are arch tops so, it makes it even more complicated! Shim the neck bro! Its the easiest and best option IMO!

 

[Blueline]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

didin't relaize they were archtops
shimmin sounds like the way to go

 

[octavedoctor]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

Shim the neck IMO!

+1

 

[octavedoctor]

Re: Question for the luthiers...will this work?

I always route neck angles into the pocket.

That's fine if you've got the money to pay for the precision routing involved. A change in the neck pocket base angle of just a tiny fraction of a degree is enough to make a huge difference in the height at the bridge.

Anyway, that's the "right" fix for it, but shimming is okay too. I just can't stand the thought of shims on anything. The lock nut shims are fine, because the nuts are metal anyway. But a paper or wooden shim in a neck pocket is hard for me to take. Plus they dig into the body wood to the point of being useless after awhile. So you have to use a shim that's a little taller than necessary because you know the body will compress. Especially Basswood on the wolfgang.

I've never found this to be a problem. The trick is to use wide flat shims and I use a coarse 3M abrasive paper which is friction-enhancing and increases stability.