Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

I always say it is the nut. You need good well cut nut, the bridge needs to be set up well too. My good friends strat with a vintage trem works very well, both the nut and the bridge are set up well. Jeff does use a 2 point trem American Standard trem and a roller nut so that should help a lot.
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Falloffthebonetone said:
This pic might be relevant to discussion!View attachment 49452
It's Jeff's go-to up close. Make of it what you will. Funfact: it's basswood.
Click to expand...

Regarding the vibrato bridge saddles.

The JB sig model has the shiny, machined-from-solid, saddles as seen on Fender American Deluxe guitars, NOT the cast powder ones seen on older American Standard examples.

As has been mentioned, JB does sometimes go out of tune onstage. On such occasions, he just makes more use of vibrato until the end of the song then has his tech bring on another guitar. (Witnessed - Hammersmith 1990 and Cardiff 2011.)
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Beck's Strat is Alder not basswood... I googled it and I call b.s.
Beck changes his tech all the time and the latest guy says its Alder.
Its the special John Suhr made pickups that are the unique thing but according to Suhr they actually sound terrible, 13k and really middly.
He hasn't made more because he says everyone would complain how bad they sound.
Apparently its also the reason Beck sticks to that one Strat.
He loves the pickups and non of his spares sounds the same.
Odd but true.

Vasshu, how the hell can you wear out a trem ?
What're you jumping up and down on it ?
 
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Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Soft metal...not hard to wear out:)
To be honest I think the answer is more simple, he is used to the guitar, and knows it.
It is more down to his usage of amps and just how he is and plays, he is no static player, the voume and toneknobs are at work all the time.
My JB strat is a rather wide sounding guitar, but it suits my playing style, I do not play like Mr Beck, but I like to work both my tone and volume all the time:)
And all in all it is a simple strat with alot of sounds build into it, and it still feels like an extention of one self, very comfy and responsive, and the normal JB is lightyears apart from the CS shops ones, I have louder and easier guitars to play, not that it is hard to play, far from it, but this is one of the best sounding and playing guitars I have had, and I have had a great many guitars in the last 30 years.
It plays the paint off my CV guitars, caused me sell my 85 Navigator and other guitars, I keep the CV's for fun, I still get the tingle to fiddle stuff now and then;)
The JB I only chnaged the vib out of necessity, otherwise I only change strings on that one.
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Yes to everybody,
But in my original post I meant to isolate the one fact I don't hear discussed much at all. The heavy bottom strings and their relation to tuning stability. A matter of physics, all things being equal, there is no place except for the saddles, where the strings touch on the way to the nut. I use the Beck solid saddles, came with the J.Beck guitar, and I do have a nice roller nut. Can't cut that. I must have not seen J.B. trade out his go to strat, so If someone saw this, I must remain corrected on the "never seen him go out of tune" statement. Again, I have removed any possible points of contact from the block and the plate, use a little graphite some times, and was told by the manufacterer that any lubricant might collect dust and become a problem that way. So I polish the ball berrings and they work great. 2 point plate set up perfectly.
I am on board with everyting you have said, and I thank you for doing so! Any physics majors want to tackle the idea of heavy low strings helping with stability? I can't imagine how out of balance that would feel with 9,11,16,28,38,52! This is from his newest tech who has been with for years now, and also says the go-to is basswood.
Steve B.
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

wolf5150 said:
Beck's Strat is Alder not basswood... I googled it and I call b.s.
Beck changes his tech all the time and the latest guy says its Alder.
Its the special John Suhr made pickups that are the unique thing but according to Suhr they actually sound terrible, 13k and really middly.
He hasn't made more because he says everyone would complain how bad they sound.
Apparently its also the reason Beck sticks to that one Strat.
He loves the pickups and non of his spares sounds the same.
Odd but true.

Vasshu, how the hell can you wear out a trem ?
What're you jumping up and down on it ?
Click to expand...
http://www.woodytone.com/2011/05/10/becks-strat-is-not-like-his-sig-model/
Read it and weep buddy. That was only a couple of years ago. Also Premier guitar did a rig rundown a month ago and said it was basswood too. Now where is his new tech saying it is alder?
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

My Washburn USA's all have a Wilkerson 2 point trem, Gotoh factory locking tuners and a regular synthetic bone nut. My PRS Custom 24 is stone stock with the PRS trem their lockers and a black factory nut. I use the trem a lot during a set and may play 2 hours or more without a break and I very very rarely have to tune any of my guitars in a set so---.
 
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Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Of course he goes out of tune. There is no way to prevent it entirely with heavy vibrato use. It's just that with what he plays, it's easy to fudge and hide the intonation. It isn't like he sits in the back playing bar chords all night. If a lead guitarist is out of tune, it doesn't stand out nearly as much as when a rhythm guitarist is.
 
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Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Jeff is a tinkerer he tends to get his guitar from his tech and then may with it until it feels right. For him it's all about feel. Getting the trem set up correctly is a matter of how you use it and wha you need the trem to do. I like mine decked and I open the nut slots to allow the strings to move freely through the slots. I also use graphite saddles, graphite but and locking tuners. Works for what I do
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Hi,
I'm the OP, I guess you call me. Still no answer on string tension: if or if not it has anything to do w/tuning stability. I know you are all sick of this subject, BUT the ORIGINAL QUESTION: does string gauge of J.B.-9,11,16,28,38,52-which is heavy on the low strings, help w/tuning stability. I use 9.5,11.5,16, 24, 34 44. D'Addario. Not really interested in all the other things-basswood or not, Callaham Trem(which looks great), we have all heard these other pieces of info on many posts. So - ALL OTHER THINGS BEING EQUAL- Do Heavier strings on the bottom, like J.B., or in general, help/or not when it comes to floating trems like Fender, or Callaham, etc.
Thank you for all the other excellent posts! There are always newbies who might have not heard some of this before.
Steve B.
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Strings need to move freely through the nut and there must be very even tension around the tuner, in the winds. Nothing can move there. The best way to work toward that is to have very few winds.
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

SJ318 said:
Hi,
I'm the OP, I guess you call me. Still no answer on string tension: if or if not it has anything to do w/tuning stability. I know you are all sick of this subject, BUT the ORIGINAL QUESTION: does string gauge of J.B.-9,11,16,28,38,52-which is heavy on the low strings, help w/tuning stability. I use 9.5,11.5,16, 24, 34 44. D'Addario. Not really interested in all the other things-basswood or not, Callaham Trem(which looks great), we have all heard these other pieces of info on many posts. So - ALL OTHER THINGS BEING EQUAL- Do Heavier strings on the bottom, like J.B., or in general, help/or not when it comes to floating trems like Fender, or Callaham, etc.
Thank you for all the other excellent posts! There are always newbies who might have not heard some of this before.
Steve B.
Click to expand...

I play every similar sets and there is no difference in tuning stability.
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

from what i've seen he does regularly knock the thing out of tune, but compensates for it by bending slightly, bending up a fret behind, dipping the bar, probably leaning on the bridge sometimes, dipping the neck
when you can play like that guy, tuning stability isn't as important i guess
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

SJ318 said:
Hi,
I'm the OP, I guess you call me. Still no answer on string tension: if or if not it has anything to do w/tuning stability. I know you are all sick of this subject, BUT the ORIGINAL QUESTION: does string gauge of J.B.-9,11,16,28,38,52-which is heavy on the low strings, help w/tuning stability. I use 9.5,11.5,16, 24, 34 44. D'Addario. Not really interested in all the other things-basswood or not, Callaham Trem(which looks great), we have all heard these other pieces of info on many posts. So - ALL OTHER THINGS BEING EQUAL- Do Heavier strings on the bottom, like J.B., or in general, help/or not when it comes to floating trems like Fender, or Callaham, etc.
Thank you for all the other excellent posts! There are always newbies who might have not heard some of this before.
Steve B.
Click to expand...
No.
 
Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

SJ318 said:
Hi,
I'm the OP, I guess you call me. Still no answer on string tension: if or if not it has anything to do w/tuning stability. I know you are all sick of this subject, BUT the ORIGINAL QUESTION: does string gauge of J.B.-9,11,16,28,38,52-which is heavy on the low strings, help w/tuning stability. I use 9.5,11.5,16, 24, 34 44. D'Addario. Not really interested in all the other things-basswood or not, Callaham Trem(which looks great), we have all heard these other pieces of info on many posts. So - ALL OTHER THINGS BEING EQUAL- Do Heavier strings on the bottom, like J.B., or in general, help/or not when it comes to floating trems like Fender, or Callaham, etc.
Thank you for all the other excellent posts! There are always newbies who might have not heard some of this before.
Steve B.
Click to expand...

String tension doesn't matter nearly as much as how the nut is cut and how the bridge is set up. That is what everyone was saying.
 
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Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Another thing regarding stability, the neck of the CS JB is not as soft(easy to bend the headstock and so on) as the regular US Standard necks.
Which has alot to say how you can set it up, but is also not so stiff that it becomes a dead stick either.
Tuning stability depends on good strings, good setup, and a guitar that is made well.
Meaning good hardware, such as nut, bridge, the studs and the anchoring of those, plus the material used, my guess is that JB likes the sound of the slightly soft two point bridge, and just has it changed when it worn out, or his is hardenend alot better than the stuff we can get our hands on?? Dunno.
I wore mine out and got a highend Gotoh instead, I'm too lazy to go and change bridge stuff every two years;)
Plus I like the sound of the Gotoh alot, not so hung up on the "correct" specs.
JB is hard on the guitars he uses....so his gets repaired alot, and parts do wear out.
The rolling nut has a limit to how large a gauge string you can use, unless you wanna file it wider...and probally dammage the dratted thing in the process....
And some guitars just stays in tune better than others.
 
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Re: Question on Beck's trem staying in tune

Good answers all!
To Vasshu-do you have the regular Jeff Beck strat or the more expensive Custom Shop Jeff Beck strat- I have the regular one. you mentioned that the neck uses harder wood, I think. Is that true, did you compare it? Sounds like you have the CS J.B. What does CV mean? Charvel?
To Tubecrunch and Falloff-good answers, love the "no",classic.
To Ascension: Is the PRS bridge as good or better than the Callaham, or are they the same, they look so stable.
To Bludave, dr. ad, ItsaBass: That makes good sense.
To uOpt: Also good to know you have tried different gauges and found no real difference in stability.
Thanks gentlemen,
Steve B.
 
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