Review of DMZ Norton

[bigheadood]

I just put the Norton in my Ibanez RG321mh, replacing the C5 in the bridge position.

In a word…warm. Obviously, the Norton has much greater mids than the C5. So does the customcustom. But with the dimarzio, there are some strange things happening that I did not think were possible. The dimarzio has just as much low end as the C5, and is nearly as tight. The dimarzio has just as much high end as the C5, and actually sounds sweeter, smoother. The customcustom has a huge midrange which pushes the front end of an amp into compression very easily, but lacks low end thump and high end attack. The mid-range power of the CC tends to make it sound boxy, not very dynamic. The neutral mids of the C5 make it sound very open and organic…responds very well to changes in pick attack, but can sometimes sound kind of thin for single note leads. The mids of the dimarzio are strange…Huge and fat like the CC, but open and dynamic, like the C5….Oxymoron. Too good to be true. This comes at a price. The dimarzio sounds quite horrible (compared to the duncans) at clean settings. It also doesn’t sound very good when split. There’s a certain hardness (for lack of a better word) to the midrange which makes it sound wooden, and dead.

Good—Gain. The Norton is absolutely the best, most articulate shred pickup I’ve ever come across. The combination of the warm mids and sharp (yet smooth) attack really make fast picking and hammer-ons/tapping ring out with authority; piano-like, almost. The tight low-end makes it a very good rock and metal riff machine. It is very articulate, and responds very well to changes in pick attack; soft picking remains warm and sweet sounding, harder picking brings out the pick attack, allowing it go get nasty.

Bad—Clean. Don’t even try to play this pickup clean. It sucks. Bad. Also, don’t bother wiring split controls into the circuit. They’re worthless. This pickup does not mix well with the A2Pn that is also in my guitar. This guitar has a 5-way switch; only three of the positions on the switch are usable: Neck (serial), Neck (parallel), and bridge (serial). The other two positions are instant crap.

Since I usually play with at least some gain, this pickup works pretty well for me. I often find myself playing Paul Gilbert licks, that I otherwise wouldn’t, but that’s not necessarily a bad thing. Overall, I’m glad I traded my CC for the Norton, but I wouldn’t trade my C5 for it.

Thanks, Micah. I hope the ToneZone works out for you. Thank you, donnievaz. I hope my CC works better for you than it did for me.
Nick

 

[LoFiBrian]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

if you want something that sounds better clean I suggest going for a Air Norton with a 250K pot...

also make sure you tap the hotter coil on the AN...

its probably my favorite Dimarzio pickup...

 

[Yngwiestein]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

I just put the Norton in my Ibanez RG321mh, replacing the C5 in the bridge position.

In a word…warm. Obviously, the Norton has much greater mids than the C5. So does the customcustom. But with the dimarzio, there are some strange things happening that I did not think were possible. The dimarzio has just as much low end as the C5, and is nearly as tight. The dimarzio has just as much high end as the C5, and actually sounds sweeter, smoother. The customcustom has a huge midrange which pushes the front end of an amp into compression very easily, but lacks low end thump and high end attack. The mid-range power of the CC tends to make it sound boxy, not very dynamic. The neutral mids of the C5 make it sound very open and organic…responds very well to changes in pick attack, but can sometimes sound kind of thin for single note leads. The mids of the dimarzio are strange…Huge and fat like the CC, but open and dynamic, like the C5….Oxymoron. Too good to be true. This comes at a price. The dimarzio sounds quite horrible (compared to the duncans) at clean settings. It also doesn’t sound very good when split. There’s a certain hardness (for lack of a better word) to the midrange which makes it sound wooden, and dead.

Good—Gain. The Norton is absolutely the best, most articulate shred pickup I’ve ever come across. The combination of the warm mids and sharp (yet smooth) attack really make fast picking and hammer-ons/tapping ring out with authority; piano-like, almost. The tight low-end makes it a very good rock and metal riff machine. It is very articulate, and responds very well to changes in pick attack; soft picking remains warm and sweet sounding, harder picking brings out the pick attack, allowing it go get nasty.

Bad—Clean. Don’t even try to play this pickup clean. It sucks. Bad. Also, don’t bother wiring split controls into the circuit. They’re worthless. This pickup does not mix well with the A2Pn that is also in my guitar. This guitar has a 5-way switch; only three of the positions on the switch are usable: Neck (serial), Neck (parallel), and bridge (serial). The other two positions are instant crap.

Since I usually play with at least some gain, this pickup works pretty well for me. I often find myself playing Paul Gilbert licks, that I otherwise wouldn’t, but that’s not necessarily a bad thing. Overall, I’m glad I traded my CC for the Norton, but I wouldn’t trade my C5 for it.

Thanks, Micah. I hope the ToneZone works out for you. Thank you, donnievaz. I hope my CC works better for you than it did for me.
Nick

Kind of hard to tell at what point you talking about C5 or Dmzio. It hard to imagine that Norton sound bad clean. What kind of pots use? Same amp or different amps? I think maybe some problem because Dimarzio pickup sound good on clean.

 

[bigheadood]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Kind of hard to tell at what point you talking about C5 or Dmzio. It hard to imagine that Norton sound bad clean. What kind of pots use? Same amp or different amps? I think maybe some problem because Dimarzio pickup sound good on clean.

Sorry, sometimes I ramble a bit.

No, there's nothing wrong with the dimarzio, or the wiring. I used the same amp, optimized settings for each pickup. Quite simply, the Duncans are FAR superior for clean playing. I suppose it could be the guitar. I would like to try this Dimarzio in an alder bodied guitar, but I don't currently own one.

 

[Yngwiestein]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Sorry, sometimes I ramble a bit.

No, there's nothing wrong with the dimarzio, or the wiring. I used the same amp, optimized settings for each pickup. Quite simply, the Duncans are FAR superior for clean playing. I suppose it could be the guitar. I would like to try this Dimarzio in an alder bodied guitar, but I don't currently own one.

Think maybe it because Dimarzio has not sparkle top end like Seymour. Dimarzio pickup very dark and heavy mids. The trick with Dimarzio to scoop some mids. Did you try that? By the way, what Seymours you recommend for Ibanez guitars?

 

[Kosh Naranek]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Just goes to show what I've been finding out too - that pickups that sound great with heavy gain often don't sound too impressive clean. And vice versa. The same is true of the JB. It can sound great (in some guitars) when you play distorted, but I don't think I've heard any guitar with a JB that sounded great through a clean amp.

It makes a good case for having multiple guitars!! There is no such thing as one guitar that does it all! The best approach is to have one that's optimized for distorted playing, and another that sounds exceptional when played through a clean amp.

 

[Ascension]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Pretty much spot on what I saw with the Norton. I also hated the tapped tones with this pickup. I have a Norton now in my Swamp Ash 95 Washburn MG 100 with a pair of Dimarzio Blue Velvets.
I was about to drop a Pearly Gates bridge with an A-8 mag back in this one ( The PG was the factory bucker in this guitar) but decided to try a mag swap in the Norton to the A-8 first.
You may want to try this in yours man as it made a HUGE difference! Sweentened the mid response up and smoothed out the high end a lot, the pickup sounds less honky and harsh clean + now taps well.
The A-8 into the Norton is the single biggest tonal improvement in a pickup I have seen using this mag!

 

[bigheadood]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Think maybe it because Dimarzio has not sparkle top end like Seymour. Dimarzio pickup very dark and heavy mids. The trick with Dimarzio to scoop some mids. Did you try that? By the way, what Seymours you recommend for Ibanez guitars?

That's certainly true. Yes I scooped some of the mids, but that "Hardness" to the tone cannot be dialed out. I can get a usable clean, but it's not very good. Luckily, I have a Duncan in the neck position which sounds great.

My Ibanez has a mahogany body, so it's not the average ibanez guitar. I definately like the C5 in the bridge best. Norton is good. Custom is a bit too much for me. CustomCustom is too dark and loose, while the mids are too much for me, like the Custom. I imagine a '59 bridge would sound very good, but haven't tried it. Just about any vintage output duncan would work well in the neck position. So far I've only tried the A2Pn. I would like to try the Jazz and '59n.

Just goes to show what I've been finding out too - that pickups that sound great with heavy gain often don't sound too impressive clean. And vice versa. The same is true of the JB. It can sound great (in some guitars) when you play distorted, but I don't think I've heard any guitar with a JB that sounded great through a clean amp.

It makes a good case for having multiple guitars!! There is no such thing as one guitar that does it all! The best approach is to have one that's optimized for distorted playing, and another that sounds exceptional when played through a clean amp.

This is definately true, but some of these problems can be mitigated, somewhat. For example: The A2Pn in parallel sounds wonderful when playing clean chords, and switching to series produces a nice thick clean lead tone. It's not a strat, but it's usable.

 

[bigheadood]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Pretty much spot on what I saw with the Norton. I also hated the tapped tones with this pickup. I have a Norton now in my Swamp Ash 95 Washburn MG 100 with a pair of Dimarzio Blue Velvets.
I was about to drop a Pearly Gates bridge with an A-8 mag back in this one ( The PG was the factory bucker in this guitar) but decided to try a mag swap in the Norton to the A-8 first.
You may want to try this in yours man as it made a HUGE difference! Sweentened the mid response up and smoothed out the high end a lot, the pickup sounds less honky and harsh clean + now taps well.
The A-8 into the Norton is the single biggest tonal improvement in a pickup I have seen using this mag!

Thanks, for that. I will definately keep that in mind. I'm still trying to find the proper "home" for this Dimarzio. I will probably try it in my les paul, next...When I get sick of shredding with the Ibanez.

 

[Ascension]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Thanks, for that. I will definately keep that in mind. I'm still trying to find the proper "home" for this Dimarzio. I will probably try it in my les paul, next...When I get sick of shredding with the Ibanez.

Try the A-8 in the Norton in the Ibanez first. I think the tones will surprise you. I also will reccomend the Custom wind with the A-8 in that guitar. I have a Custom-8 in my Quilt over Mahogany MG 120 and it's one of my tonal favorites out of the 16 or so electrics I have.
The Custom 8 will have more snap and a quicker less compressed tone than the Norton but also cleans up and taps really well with the SSL-1's in my mahogany boddied bolt on MG.

 

[Butch Snyder]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

if you want something that sounds better clean I suggest going for a Air Norton with a 250K pot...

Would you say a little more about that?

 

[Yngwiestein]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

That's certainly true. Yes I scooped some of the mids, but that "Hardness" to the tone cannot be dialed out. I can get a usable clean, but it's not very good. Luckily, I have a Duncan in the neck position which sounds great.

My Ibanez has a mahogany body, so it's not the average ibanez guitar. I definately like the C5 in the bridge best. Norton is good. Custom is a bit too much for me. CustomCustom is too dark and loose, while the mids are too much for me, like the Custom. I imagine a '59 bridge would sound very good, but haven't tried it. Just about any vintage output duncan would work well in the neck position. So far I've only tried the A2Pn. I would like to try the Jazz and '59n.



This is definately true, but some of these problems can be mitigated, somewhat. For example: The A2Pn in parallel sounds wonderful when playing clean chords, and switching to series produces a nice thick clean lead tone. It's not a strat, but it's usable.

Thank you. Is good information to know. I wonder if a pickup like this sound good in bright amp like Fender Twin.

How about mild overdriven tone? Might the Norton fair well on mild breakup?

 

[Micah]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Thanks, Micah. I hope the ToneZone works out for you. Thank you, donnievaz. I hope my CC works better for you than it did for me.
Nick

Sweet man! Glad you liked it! The harshness in the mids are what I didnt like about it--as you mentioned. Its definatly a thick, open, crunch machine. But you are right about cleaning up--its very woody sounding with the mid-range stiffness. But then again, in a midrange deficient, bright guitar, it might be the ticket! Just not for my ear in the SG. I havent put the tone zone in yet because Im still messing with the Custom SH-5 I just got--love that thing so far!

 

[LoFiBrian]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Would you say a little more about that?

well I had 2 sets of DMZ air classics in my guitars for the longest time. And I always kind of was left wanting something a little different in my Bridge.

The Air Zone was a muddy/thunky mess...Super Dist was too **** rude...But the Air Norton was very different even from the regular norton. Which is odd as most people don't like the AN for the bridge. But add a 250K pot to drop off some of the high end and you have a awesome bridge pickup that can be tapped in a number of different ways. Which is prob why it works for the neck for alot of metal players?

it also has a cool mismatch in the coils DC resistance. So you can pick the 5k or the 7k coil for your tapping situation. I forget which is which but on my meter I believe one was 7 and one was 5? I'm not sure if they are both 43awg or 43 and 42? or what...but it makes the tone a little more complex. I often wonder what an A2 air norton might sound like?

but imagine a brighter tighter norton with alot of cool coil tapping and switching options...that is what the air norton is to me anyways.

also the cleans were real nice as the AN does not really push my amps pre sections much more than the Air Classic bridge did...and the fact that the mids are a bit more complex than the AIr Classic was really what i was looking for.

Long story short I like a 59 better than a Air Classic neck and the CC has more cut and just the right smooth top that i like and I went duncan in my Agile and have not looked back...:bigthumb:

-Brian

 

[donnievaz]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

Thank you, donnievaz. I hope my CC works better for you than it did for me.
Nick

I was searching for something else and just ran across this. I thought I'd let you know that I still have the CC in the bridge position of my double fat strat and to this day it's one of my faves. I absolutely love it and it's not going anywhere.

 

[dr. ad]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

does anyone else have any other opinions re the clean sound on the norton?
what i've read re guys playing it dirty is pretty consistent, but the cleans must be pretty bad if the CC and C5's cleans are preferable..?

 

[jalguitarman]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

That's certainly true. Yes I scooped some of the mids, but that "Hardness" to the tone cannot be dialed out. I can get a usable clean, but it's not very good. Luckily, I have a Duncan in the neck position which sounds great.

My Ibanez has a mahogany body, so it's not the average ibanez guitar. I definately like the C5 in the bridge best. Norton is good. Custom is a bit too much for me. CustomCustom is too dark and loose, while the mids are too much for me, like the Custom. I imagine a '59 bridge would sound very good, but haven't tried it. Just about any vintage output duncan would work well in the neck position. So far I've only tried the A2Pn. I would like to try the Jazz and '59n.



This is definately true, but some of these problems can be mitigated, somewhat. For example: The A2Pn in parallel sounds wonderful when playing clean chords, and switching to series produces a nice thick clean lead tone. It's not a strat, but it's usable.

I have had much experiance with Dimarzio high output pick ups and must concur they sound down right nasty clean but work well with mondo distortion if you like it. I think most highout humbuckers sound rauchy clean. duncan distortion, same deal. Awesome with gain , stink-ola with clean. I love the EVO2 in the bridge of my Ibanez but same story. Awesome distorted, nasty cleans! Just my 2 cents.

 

[Grandturk]

Re: Review of DMZ Norton

I like the sound of a Super Distortion clean at the bridge. It has a lot of spank to it. As long as you EQ you're amp right, I think you can make a lot of pickups work for clean and dirty.

I think, though, the best clean I can get out of my Charvel with Super-D bridge and PAF Pro neck is the in-between position. Chimey but still warm. Good for chording, lead and finger-y stuff.

Likewise, while I didn't like the Duncan Distortion clean in a strat, combined with a Jazz neck in the middle position yeilded very cool warm classic rock clean sounds.

I might just be partial to the two-pickup sound on a clean setting, as well.