SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

[PwnageEngage]

Hello,

I'm an avid metal player. I tend to play newer metalcore and thrash.

I have an Ibanez 870QMZ (basswood body, 5pc neck, bolt-on).

I'm considering replacing the CAP-VM pickups (if anyone has more info on these pickups, i'd love to know more about them. Perhaps they're suited for another genre and not metal?) for either SH-4, SH-6, or SH-8.

I've seen some comparison videos on Youtube, but some of them sound pretty similar to me. The only thing I can say that the SH-4 has a terrible clean sound imo.

So SD experts: Can you tell me the major/minor differences between these pickups? I would love some help and/or recomendations.

Thanks!

EDIT: So it's come down to the following 2 (although i'm still researching other options): The aforementioned SH-6 Distortion and the Black Winter. I'd appreciate any info i can get on these 2 PUPs.

Also, this is my current setup: Laney LV100 Tube Fusion amp (running on the clean channel) + ML-2 Boss Metal Core Distortion Pedal (distortion knob is on 6/7) + NS-2 Boss Noise Supressor. Hope this helps!

 

[Dark Order Lord]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Hello,

I'm an avid metal player. I tend to play newer metalcore and thrash.

I have an Ibanez 870QMZ (basswood body, 5pc neck, bolt-on).

I'm considering replacing the CAP-VM pickups (if anyone has more info on these pickups, i'd love to know more about them. Perhaps they're suited for another genre and not metal?) for either SH-4, SH-6, or SH-8.

I've seen some comparison videos on Youtube, but some of them sound pretty similar to me. The only thing I can say that the SH-4 has a terrible clean sound imo.

So SD experts: Can you tell me the major/minor differences between these pickups? I would love some help and/or recomendations.

Thanks!

Black Winter. Don't muck around.

 

[toneseeker74]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

I spent a while trying to figure out the same question. Tried the Distortion, JB, Full Shred and Screamin Demon. Then the Black Winter came out. I need to get a set, because every track I hear played with them just rules.

 

[darthphineas]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Between the three you mentioned, the magnets are the primary differences. The pole pieces are an added difference with the invader.

The JB is the most versatile, especially if you need clean tone. If you don't require clean tone, go for the DD. The Invader will be thicker.

For something between the JB and the DD, have MJ make you a Dokkenbucker.


Sent from my armored battle station using Tapatalk

 

[LatsMcGee]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Being you have a basswood guitar I'm recommending dimarzios, The Deactivator X set or the Crunchlab/Liquifire combo....

 

[dominus]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

I believe this guitar is basswood:

 

[Ryan84]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Confused why you feel the sh-4 has bad cleans? Of the 3 it's Alnico 5 which compared to other the two ceramics would be less harsh and sterile. As far as cleans most people would say the Invader is too dark, almost unusable clean. But the positive is the Invader has that extra power and bass response for metal/high gain.

 

[Progbusters]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

they should all work but I'd side with the Invader, Black Winter, or Dimarzio's for the modern metalz

 

[oneblackened]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Either the DD or Black Winters. Invader is way too loose for what you want to do.

 

[Gibson 1964]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Black Winter. Seriously.

JB is its own animal. In Metal, it is the preferred pickup of classic megadeth. It is a fairly bright pickup with an upper mid spike. A very classic sound. Pinch harmonics are cake with the JB and DD. Under extreme gain some complain it is flubby. I feel it can have a bit of a cocked wah sound, which can be friend or foe.
DD is like a boxier black winter. The black winter is similar, but IME superior in every respect. The DD is a very dark pickup with a piercing high end. Absolutely great in the right guitar. I would say it is definitely a classic pickup, but to my ears it seems somewhat lacking in the mids and has more lows than I like. I am being picky though, it is a great pickup
Invader. Loose, flubby, overly bassy, too dark to have much definition IMO. It ends up sounding dark and fat and flubby. It is the only SD pickup I tried which I do not like at all.
Black Winter is a remarkably balanced pickup. No spikes, no mud, string definition like nothing else, and I would say it sounds relatively open for a high output pickup. It preserves nuances well. Played clean, with light drive, or under gobs of distortion it sounds excellent.

 

[LatsMcGee]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Don't get the Invader "lose" stuff, how lose the Invader and even the JB feels depends on your amp more than anything....You can always run the Invader with a 1 meg too....

 

[Big D]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

If you can wait i would get a Sentient 6 string

 

[darthphineas]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

If you can wait i would get a Sentient 6 string

is the OP looking for a neck model?

 

[Demanic]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Don't rule out the Alternative 8. I put one in an RG-120 and it's huge with distortion but nice and clear clean.

 

[guitarjunkie986]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

My vote is for the Black Winter. I much prefer the cleans of the BW to the JB.

 

[Archer250]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

While I would prefer the JB, having read on Jemsite that you play in drop D, and that you want a metalcore sound, the Black Winter is the best way to go.

 

[Big D]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

My bad i meant Pegasus.

 

[Inflames626]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Darthphineas may have something to add to my comment since he's been so helpful on my threads in the past.

Of Duncan passive high gains, I've tried the JB, DD, Alt 8, and Full Shred. Most of my guitars are alder/maple/rosewood bolt ons--mid priced Japanese models. Licensed Floyds.

IMO, the main distinction among all of them is the amount of saturation you get, as well as slightly different EQ curves.

First, make sure your pickup matches your guitar and amp. If you have a high gain amp, try a lower output pickup so you have more clarity. Way too many metal bands now run a high output pickup through a high gain amp and their tone sounds like a nest of chainsaws or flub-a-flub scooped Recto. If you have a lower gain amp, a higher output pickup will offset that.

I prefer boosting the front end of my amp slightly as opposed to using a hot pickup since I can dial in or remove saturation at will. You're stuck with whatever a pickup gives. Lower output pickups have more clarity and dynamics generally, and it's very difficult to clean up a hot pickup. I dialed in a good metal sound with Gibson 57 Classics once, but I've had less success cleaning up a Distortion.

Second, in my experience, the JB is a hugely overrated pickup because it is loose in the bass and low mids. It is a fine pickup for chunky hard rock rhythm at moderate tempo, but when the speed gets faster it gets loose. It sounds fine in a mix but by itself it is butt ugly. You can work with it, but prepare to use a high pass filter to roll off some of that low end. The low mids and upper mid honk will need work depending upon your taste. I suspect the JB got its reputation because it is a good all rounder for rock and, back in the pre Internet days, it was easier to make a JB work than to compare so many types of pickups.

The DD has tighter bass, more saturation, and more high end cut than the JB, but it can be harsh. I'd start there. I haven't tried an Invader, but it sounds like its bass, mids, and saturation would overwhelm most guitars. The Alternative 8 is similar to a DD but with more bass and slightly less cutting highs.

Think about the difference in the JB and DD as being like a Marshall vs. a 5150. The Marshall has classic tone but the 5150 is more saturated and, some would say, harsh. But the DD suits extreme metal better than the JB does.

So far, my favorite set is the Full Shred. They're the most tonally neutral of the ones I have tried. Some people say they're bland, but I find them balanced. I haven't tried the BWs, but the Shreds are great for moderate rock all the way to death metal if you tweak your signal chain. I've seen several guys here say the Full Shred is fine for drop tuning because it has a really punchy, defined sound.

JB, DD, Alt 8, and Full Shreds will all give you great harmonics, but IMO the Full Shred has the most touch and sensitivity--ideal for articulate solos and those clean to distorted changes in metalcore.

Something you may want to think about is trying full sets first as opposed to individual pups in order to find a good neck pup. Normally the full sets work well. I'm used to an EMG 60, so even the Duncan Jazz is a bit warm to me.

Ultimately, I think the DD set is what you want. That said, I'm not sold on the Distortion neck pup. I've never tried it, but my experience with high gain ceramic pups in the neck is not good. If you want a bright clean sound in the neck like a lot of metal guys use (brighter than a Jazz), you may have trouble finding a Duncan that will do it.

Maybe one of the more experienced guys can help with a bright neck pup.

 

[TNTales]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

+1 for the Black Winters. They clean up nicely with the volume knob and handle all levels of gain cleanly.

 

[PwnageEngage]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Black Winter. Seriously.

JB is its own animal. In Metal, it is the preferred pickup of classic megadeth. It is a fairly bright pickup with an upper mid spike. A very classic sound. Pinch harmonics are cake with the JB and DD. Under extreme gain some complain it is flubby. I feel it can have a bit of a cocked wah sound, which can be friend or foe.
DD is like a boxier black winter. The black winter is similar, but IME superior in every respect. The DD is a very dark pickup with a piercing high end. Absolutely great in the right guitar. I would say it is definitely a classic pickup, but to my ears it seems somewhat lacking in the mids and has more lows than I like. I am being picky though, it is a great pickup
Invader. Loose, flubby, overly bassy, too dark to have much definition IMO. It ends up sounding dark and fat and flubby. It is the only SD pickup I tried which I do not like at all.
Black Winter is a remarkably balanced pickup. No spikes, no mud, string definition like nothing else, and I would say it sounds relatively open for a high output pickup. It preserves nuances well. Played clean, with light drive, or under gobs of distortion it sounds excellent.

Hey thanks for the in depth explanation.

I read or heard somewhere that Black Winter is more for death metal and isn't very melodic? I'm not sure, i might be confusing myself.

To be clear, which would you personally recommend: The SH-6 or the Black Winter? And why?