Small amps as recording amps?

[MetalManiac]

Okay, i guess a good small amp like a Tweed Champ or a Marshall Class 5 would be a damn fine recording amp.
I want to ask you all though, what exactly dot they do with the small amps in the studio- they mike them and try and make them sound like 30+ watt combos .
Also, can a small amp capture the dynamics of a big amp in the studio by just being miked?
IIRC , Van Heusen used a full stack ofr VH1?

 

[drpietrzak]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

I have absolutely no use for a Marshall ( or Fender)distortion style amp with less than 30 watts...unless you run more than one of em.

I do have low wattage amps, but they are strictly for practice and mainly with cleans.
I wouldn't wizz on a less than 3000 watt distortion style amp...well, unless its a Fender Deluxe reverb, and that is mainly a half clean half ballsy blues rock amp, albeit the greatest tone of all time( besides the 59 Bassman, and I need two of those, or forget it.)

Playing around with little heavy low watt metal amps is like playing with a 67 Camaro Hotwheels instead of driving a real 67 Camaro.

Like t$ts on a steer.

 

[MetalManiac]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

i dont think I'm totally right with my quote on the Calss 5 thread, but I don't think I'm totally wrong either.Thats why I made this thread. Okay, you drove an intellectual ball point pen into my forum cornea. Point, serve, but I don't think you've won any match.

 

[TwilightOdyssey]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

Wattage has very little to do with loudness in terms of dB, especially when it come to high gain tones, in which there is little to no headroom. The amplifier design and especially the output valves have a lot to with whether the amp will be able to do passable crunch or distortion sounds for hard rock or metal.

"Small" amp or no, a good amp in a good room will sound HUGE if recorded in a way to capture the sound of the amp, in the room.

 

[woemoejack]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

multiple mics on the amp at different spots on the cone and at different distances from the grill and utilizing an efficient and well broken in speaker(s) will make it sound huge. then multi track it for even more depth and fullness.

 

[drpietrzak]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

Personally I think Van Heusen used the No-Iron pinstripe on VH1. I do however think he would have been better off with the Fitted Poplin.

Van Heusen.

 

[SirJackdeFuzz]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

Okay, i guess a good small amp like a Tweed Champ or a Marshall Class 5 would be a damn fine recording amp.
I want to ask you all though, what exactly dot they do with the small amps in the studio- they mike them and try and make them sound like 30+ watt combos .
Also, can a small amp capture the dynamics of a big amp in the studio by just being miked?
IIRC , Van Heusen used a full stack ofr VH1?

Led Zeppelin 1

Their 1st album, sound HUGE, to my ears.
It was done with a single 'lil 15'ish watt amp and Tele.

In the studio an Orange Tiny Terror can be recorded to sound like a 120W non master vol amp !

 

[drpietrzak]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

layers, mic placement, multiple mics and studio tweaks.

 

[drpietrzak]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

Layla ...

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=451438&page=4

Clapton and Allman were set up in the studio facing each other, looking one another in the eyes and playing live through small Fender amps--a Princeton and a Deluxe. “These guys weren’t wearing earphones,” Dowd recalls. “They were just playing softly through those little Fenders. If they talked while they were recording, you would have heard it over the amplifier. It’s funny, too because when I did Cream, Eric was playing through double stacks of Marshalls and it literally hurt to be in the room with those guys. When Eric showed up for Layla, he had a Champ under one arm and a Princeton under the other and that was it. He and Duane used those amps, switching back and forth.”

 

[drpietrzak]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

"I do like the sound of the sweet spot on Lights Out, but then again that was played through a Pignose amp. Live, we had all these stacks of Marshalls, but there I was, in the studio making an album with a Pignose, and it turned out to be the biggest UFO album."

Michael Schenker "Brick by Brick"

 

[Virtual Kevorkian]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

We used an Orange Tiny Terror for 2 of the 4 rhythm tracks on my bands album that I'm mixing right now. It's not making up the 'beef' of the tone, but the string definition and raunchy character it brings is integral to the sound of the CD.

Part of this is because of the lack of headroom the thing has, and part of it is the voicing of the amp.

As said, headroom is the biggest problem you'll run into, aside from the difference in tone from the poweramp tubes. EL84's just don't quite sound like 6L6's or EL34's.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

not every style of music requires the guitar to sound "huge" "crushing" or "brutal"....

 

[AlexR]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

And huge crushing and brutal can also be done softly as well. Given that most studio micing is done about an inch from the cab, it only needs to be loud enough to reduce the background noise/hiss from the mixing desk input gain.

 

[wahwah]

Small amps as recording amps?

The preamp or input channel of a mixing console or audio interface needs to see a few millivolts of signal. The content of that signal is not necessarily dependent on high output volume from power tubes. If you're looking for a lower output power tube that will provide a similar tone and response to EL34's, you need look no further than the mighty 6V6.

Large, powerful amps with multiple speaker configurations can cause headaches for recording engineers trying to capture a sound. They were designed purely for large stages in an era when PA system were small and inefficient. They certainly weren't designed with recording in mind. This is why so many recording studios will buy amps like Deluxes and Princetons for their stock, because they know how often they will provide good results. Obviously this is style dependent, and there are times when a high output amp and large cabinet are the solution. For the majority of styles outside of metal and heavier rock, lower output amps quite often all that is required.


Cheers..................... wahwah

 

[Virtual Kevorkian]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

And huge crushing and brutal can also be done softly as well. Given that most studio micing is done about an inch from the cab, it only needs to be loud enough to reduce the background noise/hiss from the mixing desk input gain.

I really disagree - speaker movement is INTEGRAL to a good recorded guitar tone, and that requires at a greater volume than just over the noise floor of a given mic/preamp combo.

 

[PVFan]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

small does this, big does that

medium is best

ideally, fair-in-the-middlin' is the perfect size for most applications

sounds like I'm talkin about something else, when in fact I'm just cracking wise

 

[the guy who invented fire]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

a mic has no idea how big an amp is or how much power it is putting out...small amps are studio favs becasue you can get the goods w/o all the volume...

Just crank it and put a mic in front of it...

 

[richard parker]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

The Marshall Studio 15 was made for exactly this reason - you could get all the classic Marshall sounds at low volume and without causing problems for the engineer. 2 x 6V6 output stage. Wish I still had mine.

 

[Johtosotku]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

A good amp is a good amp, regardless of the wattage.

I do agree that significant volume is necessary to get the speaker moving.

That doesn't mean that it requires a lot of wattage. The best tones I've captured recently come from a single 6v6 power stage. Great tone, but it too will break you ears without plugs or such. In my experience, every tube amp will.

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Small amps as recording amps?

The Marshall Studio 15 was made for exactly this reason - you could get all the classic Marshall sounds at low volume and without causing problems for the engineer. 2 x 6V6 output stage. Wish I still had mine.

That model had a Loudspeaker Emulator DI output as well.