Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

[jtougas]

Okay, here's the deal. I've got a Mesa Thiele Compact cab on the way, to use with my Egnater Tweaker. I've got a Hellatone 30 to put in it, but I've read the Celestion H30s (which are what the Hellatones are made from) can be a bit on the bassy/flubby side. Looking for 12" speakers under 30w led me to the Eminence Patriot Black Mountain, which has a resonance frequency of 68hz, a fair bit lower than the 85Hz of the Hellatone.

Perversely, supposedly this means it'll cope with the bass better.

Is my thinking correct in this, or what?

I would like to set this cab up to work well with a variety of lower powered amps...

 

[schecterplayer]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

The Theile cab is ported, which should improve the bass response of your speaker, so I'm not sure how important that lower resonance is going to be. Do you play drop-tuned? Definitely let me know how you like the cab, I've been thinking about picking up one with an EV for my Boogie MkII.

 

[jtougas]

I don't generally play drop tuned.

I'm hoping for something that'll work for whatever's thrown at it.

 

[ericmeyer4]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

Don't worry about the "what-ifs" right now. Try the one you have and after you spend some time with it, if you don't like it, start looking for one that is like the currenty with a,b,c but doesn't have x,y,z.

 

[FretFire]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

Don't worry about the "what-ifs" right now. Try the one you have and after you spend some time with it, if you don't like it, start looking for one that is like the currenty with a,b,c but doesn't have x,y,z.

+1. Play and listen first, then see if you actually need to modify anything.

 

[Van Noord]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

Thiele cabs perform best with the speaker they come from the factory with.

 

[alteredbeast]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

i have one with a c90, it can handle both the blackstar ht-5 obviously, and the mark IV (not same time haha) very nice speaker enclosure if you ask me. smart move purchasing it, dude.

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

With the original EV 12L they can be kinda dark and bassy until you turn the volume up quite a bit. I think the 12S is better in them for lower volume work, but good lick finding one, I'm not selling mine.

 

[jtougas]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

i have one with a c90, it can handle both the blackstar ht-5 obviously, and the mark IV (not same time haha) very nice speaker enclosure if you ask me. smart move purchasing it, dude.

Thanks. My choices were an empty Seismic for $99, or the Mesa Thiele for... not much more, before shipping.

I also figured the name wouldn't hurt for re-sale if I didn't like it. ;-)

Though I do find myself curious: with the port, how well would it work for a bass cab with a 12" bass speaker?

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

That cab was designed around a 12L, so the "perfect" theile dimensions would be off if you used a speaker with a different length chassis, which would matter less for guitar than bass. I think it would make a pretty decent bass cab though.

 

[Boogie Bill]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

I have three of these cabs that I use with my Mesa Mark IIIs and my DC-3. I really like the EVM in these, but the factory C90 also works great, as does the Mesa Black Shadow MS-12, which was Eminence-made.

I STRONGLY recommend that you folks with Mark or Caliber Series amps pick up a 112 Theile cab. They really add a lot of bottom end, enchancing both the clean tones and the distortion tones--especially so if you like to use the Graphic EQ in a "V" curve. A great little mini-stack with your combo amp, with a tiny stage footprint.

Bill

 

[alteredbeast]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

Thanks. My choices were an empty Seismic for $99, or the Mesa Thiele for... not much more, before shipping.

I also figured the name wouldn't hurt for re-sale if I didn't like it. ;-)

Though I do find myself curious: with the port, how well would it work for a bass cab with a 12" bass speaker?

not much more than a hunj? sweet!

I have three of these cabs that I use with my Mesa Mark IIIs and my DC-3. I really like the EVM in these, but the factory C90 also works great, as does the Mesa Black Shadow MS-12, which was Eminence-made.

I STRONGLY recommend that you folks with Mark or Caliber Series amps pick up a 112 Theile cab. They really add a lot of bottom end, enchancing both the clean tones and the distortion tones--especially so if you like to use the Graphic EQ in a "V" curve. A great little mini-stack with your combo amp, with a tiny stage footprint.

Bill

for small gigs i use the mark 4 and the thiele, no v curve here tho. i wish i could a/b the c90 with the EVM, but i got a pretty sweet deal on the c90 loaded thiele. is it THAT much better? i know its highly revered.

 

[RayBarbeeMusic]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

Mesa Thiele with a 12L is just a classic cabinet, every guitar player should have one. I wouldn't describe it as 'dark' though. The 12L was designed as a PA driver, it doesn't have the forward mids of most guitar speakers, so some people describe it as 'scooped' even though it isn't, it's just more neutral than what guitar players are used to. It has plenty of high end to, more than a lot of guitar speakers do, but no high mid spike.

It is also the only "guitar" speaker that absolutely WILL NOT CONE CRY, EVER.

They also made a 1x12 open back with 12L around the time the closed backs originally came out, and they sound GREAT as well. I have both and actually like the open back better, it seems to have a fuller low end, even compared to being on axis with the closed back thiele.

 

[jtougas]

UPDATE: Hrm. Not a whole lot of bass response, but I don't know the head (Egnater Tweaker 15) well enough to know if the lack is amp, or speaker.

I did try stuffing the ports with foam - no improvement. Seems to have a middy peak to it.

Should I try the Black Mountain?

 

[jtougas]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

Or any other speaker suggestions that aren't $250? o_0

 

[FAC]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

UPDATE: Hrm. Not a whole lot of bass response, but I don't know the head (Egnater Tweaker 15) well enough to know if the lack is amp, or speaker.

I did try stuffing the ports with foam - no improvement. Seems to have a middy peak to it.

Should I try the Black Mountain?

In general, stuffing the port should reduce bass frequencies, not boost them. On the other hand, blocking the port might make for better transient response....but it should not increase the bass.

As previously noted:

Thiele cabs perform best with the speaker they come from the factory with.

The whole point behind a "Thiele" cabinet is that they are tuned to a particular speaker (or more specifically, a speaker with a certain set of Thiele/Small parameters). That does not mean other speakers might not work and sound good, but the purpose is somewhat defeated if the original speaker is not used.

Is there a stock cabinet at a shop nearby that you can try out to see if you like the original speaker? If so, I might suggest dealing with it as is until you can get the original speaker...how much $$ will you spend trying to find a speaker that works vs. just waiting to get the one it was tuned for? That is, unless you can somehow demo a bunch of speakers without buying them.

 

[schecterplayer]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

Another speaker that was known for working in the Theile cabs was the Eminence MS-12, came as a stock speaker in a lot of old Boogie amps and cabs. They don't make them anymore but some guys on the Boogie forum say the Eminence Delta Pro and Deltalite are good substitutes in those cabs. I haven't tried it myself so I couldn't confirm. Might help to call eminence or a good speaker dealer and see if they have a recommendation.

 

[jtougas]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

Re: stuffing the ports - *nods* Yup. I noticed it went from 'vague and lacking bass response' to 'tightly focused mids with clear highs...with no depth to the bass'.

All in all, not bad, would work great in a gigging situation to make sure you don't have to duck your bass player a whole lot in the mix.

Just not what I'm looking for. And the Hellatone is the same speaker as comes in the Egnater cab, just 'gently aged'... so, I'm leaning towards this speaker/cab combo not working, not amp/speaker.

I'll give Eminence a call, and get their slant on it.

 

[jtougas]

Update: Hrm. I played my Crate V18 through the cab, and there be plenty o' bass.

Egnater = low bass response?

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Soon NCD: Mesa Thiele Compact

The EVM at low volumes can be dark, once you crank it up a bit its not, thats what I was saying (for ray).

Don't know nuthin' about the egnater though bro, sorry. Don't stuff the ports, that defeats the purpose. You should have a decent amount more low end than you have in a normal 1x12 or combo. I'm not sure about putting a V30 or H30 in one, so I can't say anything about that either. MS12, 12L and 12S are all pretty badass in it, that's what I do know.