Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

[Broadcaster]

I have a Vox Toneworks desktop unit and a mackie 1400i power amp (350 watts per channel into 8 ohms) that is the main part of my setup for giging live.

I have heard of people using full range pa cabinets for a live setup with an amp modeler, and that does sound interesting.

Any thoughts from anyone out there regarding using a double 12 guitar cabinet as apposed to two - full range 12" floor monitors as a live stage rig/setup?

I always wanted to have my guitar speakers on stage aimed up at me like a vocal monitor to keep the stage volume down to insure a good amount of guitar in the house mix and to hear my guitar better.

http://www.cerwinvega.com/products/professional/prostax/psx-122.html

I was interested in these Cerwin Vega speakers (above link) since they do not have a woofer and a horn it would be easy to mic up with just one center mic, instead of a 2 way speaker setup as most full range cabs are.

Any thoughts, comments suggestions PLEASE....
thanks

 

[LesStrat]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

Generally speaking, modellers work best with full-range speakers (e.g., PA). The modeller has the guitar amp/cabinet tone already, so using a "guitar-voiced" speaker can have a detrimental affect on the tone.

Of course, you could turn off the amp models....

Others will be along with differing opinions shortly, I'm sure. But I stand by my general assessment.

 

[Broadcaster]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

Generally speaking, modellers work best with full-range speakers (e.g., PA). The modeller has the guitar amp/cabinet tone already, so using a "guitar-voiced" speaker can have a detrimental affect on the tone.

Of course, you could turn off the amp models....

Others will be along with differing opinions shortly, I'm sure. But I stand by my general assessment.

In a setup with the full range speakers would you use the speaker modelers or
leave that function off?

thanks

 

[WhoFan]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

Generally speaking, modellers work best with full-range speakers (e.g., PA). The modeller has the guitar amp/cabinet tone already, so using a "guitar-voiced" speaker can have a detrimental affect on the tone.

Of course, you could turn off the amp models....

Others will be along with differing opinions shortly, I'm sure. But I stand by my general assessment.

PLUS 1000!!!!! I plan to buy a Keyboard amp to run my modeler's thru.... in fact i am going to borrow one from work to try out... I oneday want a good synth/keyboard anyways so i will be killing 2 birds....

 

[Mincer]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

look at the passive JBL EONS with a 15 and horn...they are shaped so they can sit many ways, and work well with modelers. When using any modeler, a guitar cab kills a lot of the modeling.

 

[Artie]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

I don't know about Pods et al, but on the J-Station, the amp models and the cab models are separate functions. You can turn off the cabs and still use whatever amp you want. They did this specifically so you could run through a guitar cab.

 

[Broadcaster]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

look at the passive JBL EONS with a 15 and horn...they are shaped so they can sit many ways, and work well with modelers. When using any modeler, a guitar cab kills a lot of the modeling.

do you have a switch to shut off cabinet/speaker modeling and leave the amp modeling on?

 

[Mincer]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

do you have a switch to shut off cabinet/speaker modeling and leave the amp modeling on?

Yup- although, the cab/sp modeling is part of what I bought it for, and part of why it cost what it does- I don't want to get stuck with one cab sound, so I model it Also, I don't want to pay for something I won't use. If you have to though, yeah, you can turn it off.

 

[Broadcaster]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

look at the passive JBL EONS with a 15 and horn...they are shaped so they can sit many ways, and work well with modelers. When using any modeler, a guitar cab kills a lot of the modeling.

If you are to run the tonelab through a solid state poweramp and full range speakers which setting would you use: LINE or AMP ?

Line sounds to bright and abrasive to me, amp sounds better, but the I think the manual suggests using line when using a poweramp, but does not mention using full range speakers directly with a poweramp..........

ANY IDEAS????
HELP!

Thanks

 

[Robert Delahunt]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

I have a Vox Toneworks desktop unit and a mackie 1400i power amp (350 watts per channel into 8 ohms) that is the main part of my setup for giging live. I have heard of people using full range pa cabinets for a live setup with an amp modeler, and that does sound interesting. Any thoughts from anyone out there regarding using a double 12 guitar cabinet as apposed to two - full range 12" floor monitors as a live stage rig/setup? I always wanted to have my guitar speakers on stage aimed up at me like a vocal monitor to keep the stage volume down to insure a good amount of guitar in the house mix and to hear my guitar better. I was interested in these Cerwin Vega speakers (above link) since they do not have a woofer and a horn it would be easy to mic up with just one center mic, instead of a 2 way speaker setup as most full range cabs are. Any thoughts, comments suggestions PLEASE.... thanks

I would say grab two 30W roland keyboard amps. I've used them before on an amp simulating setup, and they are NICE. You might end up modding them (i.e. disconnecting the horn speakers for less treble), but in the end, they rule, and you can always sell them used to a keyboard player lol.

 

[Tor]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

Don't exclude the possibility for a couple of studio monitors. That gives you the stereo-effects for some of the settings Also, if you should find you don't want a modeler any more, you can still use the monitors for making music. But for portability, monitors come too short, so a keyboard amp (mentioned & recommended by a lot) might be your best bet.

 

[iekobrid]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

some thoughts:


* I considered getting a 12" PA floor wedge for my bedroom PODxt, but don't have that kind of carpet space available, even under my desk. Still think it would be hella cool.


* Having run Line 6 and Johnson modelling products into powered studio monitors with cab models on, keyboard amps with cab models on, electric guitar amp inputs & effect returns with the cab models on & off, acoustic guitar amp inputs & effect returns with the cab models on & off, and even a Vox modelling guitar amp's effect return with the cab models on & off, I gotta say the best sound was keyboard amp w/ cabs on


* Peavey makes a keyboard amp (KB3 ? KB4 ?) where instead of a horn there's a concentric tweeter built into middle of the woofer. Glutton for overcomplication that I am, I wonder if it would be possible to run a modeller into that amp and get a decent tone mic'ing it live in the room... :banana:

 

[LesStrat]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

It has been addressed, but to answer your last question of me directly, when using a full-range cabinet/amp combo, you can leave the amp/cab models ON. That is the benefit of using full-range speakers.

It is when using an electric guitar amp that you really need to turn them off.

 

[Broadcaster]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

If you are to run the tonelab through a solid state poweramp and full range speakers which setting would you use: LINE or AMP switch setting on the back of the unit ?

Line sounds to bright and abrasive to me, amp sounds better, but the I think the manual suggests using line when using a poweramp, but does not mention using full range speakers directly with a poweramp..........

ANY IDEAS????
HELP!

Thanks

 

[LesStrat]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

/\/\/\True.

However, if you're ears don't like it, don't do it. That's the bottom line. Do what sounds good to you.

 

[baritone]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

The general rule is the keep it on "amp" for everything, but switch it to "line" if the signal distorts.

 

[Broadcaster]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

The general rule is the keep it on "amp" for everything, but switch it to "line" if the signal distorts.

Hi,
That is the issue I'm having.
I have a great sound patch with the amp setting switch, but when I turn it up, it peaks my 600 watt pwramp in the 800k range and thus ends up distorting. I switch it to line in the back, and it no londer distorts, but the sound is way too bright eeven if I turn the treble and middle to 0, aslo the sound is way too abrasive unlike when it was on amp.
Basiclly I lose the distortion and clipping, but I also lose the good warm sound?
Any suggestions?
thanks

 

[LesStrat]

Re: Speakers for Amp Modelers??? Help

Tweak tweak.