Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

kcrknp

kcrknp

New member
I have stock covered humbuckers in my Epiphone Les Paul Custom, I plan on changing my bridge pickup to a Duncan Custom once I get the money, what I would like to know is how is the Gibson 57 Classic pickup I have going to sound in the neck? I'm looking for more clarity on my neck pickup because the stock one is very muddy on the low E and A strings. I should also mention the pickup i plan to use is a bridge model 57 classic in the neck since I already have it, what can I expect from this pickup in the neck position? Will I get more clarity or will it just be more of the same mud? Thanks in advance.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

thanks for the input reckless, thats what i was thinking myself
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

I think it will sound great when you play clean.

I always wince with overdriven neck sounds...even when it's the "woman tone"...
Anyway, it will be a great start and buy you at least a few months while you settle in with your new SD Custom.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

thanks aloha I plan to use it mostly for cleans anyway, i'm not much of a "woman tone" kind of guy myself, otherwise I would love the mud :P
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

I always yank the stock PU's of out my Epi's. Most have a muddy tone, and even if you happen to have a better pair, a set of American or European PU's will still be a big improvement in clarity, definition, and depth. It's worth upgrading. You can always pick up a used set on eBay for half price.

Do you have a set of '57's now? '57 Classics have A2 magnets, which may not be what you want in the neck. A2's have mids galore & little treble, with a loose low end. In a LP, they could be on the muddy/muffled side. The solution is cheap & easy: put an A5 in the neck '57, & it will brighten it up nicely (I've done this a few times).

In the bridge, you want want to keep that '57 as is, or to gradually add more treble and less mids, try an A3, A4 or A5 (increase in treble in that order). With the right mix of magnets, and maybe pots and caps, the '57's should give you some nice tones, and you may not need anything else. I've been happy with my Gibson PU's once I made these mods.

If you're thinking about a SD Custom (metal player?) you could even try a ceramic magnet in the bridge '57 (which would be bright).
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

Wow blueman thanks for the informative post. I've never actually swapped pickups before so I'm thinking swapping magnets might be a bit advanced for me. Also I was thinking I can't swap the magnet on the 57 cause its got a gold cover on it, someone let me know if I still can.
Also I am a metal, classic rock, and punk player so I think the Custom would be perfect for the bridge. I need a high output bridge humbucker, so now you've got me thinking I should also get a high output neck humbucker and do something else with the 57.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

I've got to chime in here. There's a little misinformation going.

Just because the '57 Classic has an A2 magnet doesn't mean it's got pumped up mids and little treble. In fact, it's actually the opposite with those. They do have mids, more than an A5 pickup, but they also have more lows and highs than other A2 pickups. The Pearly Gates is another example of an A2 pickup with a good amount of highs.

The DiMarzio Super Distortion is a Ceramic pickup with bumped up mids and lows and rolled back highs. The Air Zone is the same way except it is an A5 magnet.

What I'm saying is, there's more to a pickup's sound than the magnet. The type of wire, the wire gauge, number of turns, winding pattern, and all that also contribute a great deal to how a pickup will sound.

If the '57 Classic works in the neck for you, great. Give it shot since you have it. I think they're great pickups and will hopefully be tossing a set in one of my Strats here soon, though the bridge will be the '57 Classic Plus.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

I've got Gibson 57's in one of my LP's and to be honest they leave alot to be desired. I agree, they sound just fine for clean and classic rock, but for punk and heavy rock tones you may want someting else. I think the Duncan Custom in the bridge is the way to go for the styles you listed, but I think you might find that the 57 might not match up that well with the Custom. Unless thats what you want - agressive in the bridge and mellow in the neck... Otherwise, I'd say get a different pup for the neck and do your pup swap once and be done with it.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

I don't know how a 57 would sound in a LP neck, but my experience with a 57 in the neck of my 61 reissue SG has been a good. No plans on ever changing it.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

kcrknp said:
I've never actually swapped pickups before so I'm thinking swapping magnets might be a bit advanced for me. Also I was thinking I can't swap the magnet on the 57 cause its got a gold cover on it, someone let me know if I still can.
Click to expand...

The covers come off, whether chrome, nickel, or gold plated. Sometimes there's a just a small blob of solder on each side holding it on, and you may be able to pop them loose with a screwdriver. If the solder is bigger, I use a dremel with a small disk to cut though it (without damaging the cover).

There's instructions on this forum & other sites for swapping magnets. For the first time practice on a cheap Asian HB if you can. After that, you'll know what to do. It's 10 to 15 minutes from loosening the strings to re-tuning. Very easy.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

ErikH said:
I've got to chime in here. There's a little misinformation going.

Just because the '57 Classic has an A2 magnet doesn't mean it's got pumped up mids and little treble. In fact, it's actually the opposite with those. They do have mids, more than an A5 pickup, but they also have more lows and highs than other A2 pickups. The Pearly Gates is another example of an A2 pickup with a good amount of highs.

The DiMarzio Super Distortion is a Ceramic pickup with bumped up mids and lows and rolled back highs. The Air Zone is the same way except it is an A5 magnet.

What I'm saying is, there's more to a pickup's sound than the magnet. The type of wire, the wire gauge, number of turns, winding pattern, and all that also contribute a great deal to how a pickup will sound.

If the '57 Classic works in the neck for you, great. Give it shot since you have it. I think they're great pickups and will hopefully be tossing a set in one of my Strats here soon, though the bridge will be the '57 Classic Plus.
Click to expand...

Very true about the magnets. People like to just assume that the magnet and output is all there is to a pickup, but it's much, much more complex. All things being equal, like when you swap a bar magnet out from ceramic to alnico 2 or 5, you'll notice a difference based on the magnet, but there are some very "hi fi" pickups out there with ceramic magnets (Bill Lawrence and, I think, Lace Sensors), while there are really crappy ones with alnico in them (a lot of the Gibson signature line and what you find in many mid-level Asian guitars).
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

blueman335 said:
. If the solder is bigger, I use a dremel with a small disk to cut though it (without damaging the cover).
Click to expand...

WOW. I don't know how I never thought of that. My standard answer to everything is "Dremel". I used to get so pissed when the frickin solder blob wouldn't melt, even with my 230w soldering 'cannon'. I guess an idiot check really IS a good thing, now and then!
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

Metaphysical said:
Very true about the magnets. People like to just assume that the magnet and output is all there is to a pickup, but it's much, much more complex. All things being equal, like when you swap a bar magnet out from ceramic to alnico 2 or 5, you'll notice a difference based on the magnet.
Click to expand...

My advice about magnets is to use them to your advantage in an existing PU. You first research & buy the best perceived PU for your needs, and magnets are one part of the equation, along with resonant peaks, ohms, EQ's, etc. Unfortuately, most tone charts don't volunteer other important factors, like coil width, wire gauge, magnet size, etc, which have a big impact on tone. That can leave you dependent on player's opinions on what it sounds like in their guitar & wood, thru their amp, which could be totally different than yours. That's the unquantifiable factor you have to be ready to deal with.

After installing a new PU, if it isn't quite what you expected, then use magnets, pots, and caps to tweak it, and don't immediately give up & sell it at a loss, and rush out to buy a new one.

I think that's excellent advice.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

The 57's suck. Gibson doesn't make good pickups.
Muddy, noisy and sing like a cow.

I woul buy a 59 or pearly gates.
Cheaper and much better.
They've become quite a benchmark for PAF replacements.

But as someone said, different pots or poles can sometimes do the trick, it worked for me a couple of times. Had a bright screaming demon and with 250k pots and long screws
it was just perfect.
 
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Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

Orange said:
The 57's suck. Gibson doesn't make good pickups.
Muddy, noisy and sing like a cow. I would buy a 59 or pearly gates.
They've become quite a benchmark for PAF replacements.

But as someone said, different pots or poles can sometimes do the trick, it worked for me a couple of times.
Click to expand...

Gibson makes good PU's, but their magnet choices aren't the best. Sometimes they work well, but too often they don't. I question their use of an A2 in a neck HB, especially with 300K pots; that can be pretty dark in a LP. The 490R/498T pair is greatly improved by switching magnets (put the A5 in the neck, & A2 in the bridge).

I've gotten used Gibson PU's pretty inexpensive, from guys that immediately gave up on them. But with different magnets, and using 250K's on the bridge when needed, I've been able to get some nice sounds from them. Don't give up until you've tried all your options, whether Gibsons or any other high-quality PU.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

kcrknp said:
I have stock covered humbuckers in my Epiphone Les Paul Custom, I plan on changing my bridge pickup to a Duncan Custom once I get the money, what I would like to know is how is the Gibson 57 Classic pickup I have going to sound in the neck? I'm looking for more clarity on my neck pickup because the stock one is very muddy on the low E and A strings. I should also mention the pickup i plan to use is a bridge model 57 classic in the neck since I already have it, what can I expect from this pickup in the neck position? Will I get more clarity or will it just be more of the same mud? Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

It depends on the nature of the guitar. If it's naturally dark, you'll want to stay away from Gibson pickups.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

Orange said:
The 57's suck. Gibson doesn't make good pickups.
Muddy, noisy and sing like a cow.
Click to expand...

Gibson doesn't make good pickups? You're kidding, right? You seriously don't consider the Burstbucker 1's and 2's to be good pickups?
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

Love me some Burstbuckers. I am gonna have to agree with Blueman, Gibson does make high quality pickups but sometimes uses questionable magnet choices.
 
Re: Stock Epi P'ups vs Gibson 57

hanumanlangur said:
Gibson doesn't make good pickups? You're kidding, right? You seriously don't consider the Burstbucker 1's and 2's to be good pickups?
Click to expand...

I played a few les pauls that came with them stock and I found them to be interesting but overly bright... too hi-fi. But it might have just been the guitar and amp. But ignoring that, I'd say the burstbucker is to the seth lover what the P94 is to the Phat Cat.
 
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