Strats Personality and Pickups

[Guitar Toad]

I have heard that strats (and guitars in general) can have unique sonic properties such that pickup XYZ in strat A may not sound the same in Strat B.

Have you ever installed set of SSL-1’s, Surfers, or (insert your pickups here) and thought that they just didn’t sound like you thought they should? This assumes that everything is set up correctly! Which may not always be the case.

What did you do? Do you then say that SSL-1’s are not the answer for your strat or do you try another set of SSL-1’s? or do you try another pickup model?

Do pickups vary in personality as much as guitars?

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

No...never. They have always sounded the way I expected them to and the guitar just adds its own personality to the mix. I've never installed a SSL-1 or Surfer or 59N or JB or whatever pickup and had it sound like anything other than what I expected it to sound like. I mean some guitars are naturally a little brighter or a little warmer or a little something or other differant from another guitar...but I've never found that to drastically alter the usual tone of a given pickup. I think to much is made of that sort of obsessive thing.

I use my favorite pickups in all of my guitars and they all sound just fine.

One exception might be the Jerry Donahue Tele lead pickup. In an exceptionally warm guitar that pickup can sound like it could use a little more treble.

Lew

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

No...never. They have always sounded the way I expected them to and the guitar just adds its own personality to the mix. I've never installed a SSL-1 or Surfer or 59N or JB or whatever pickup and had it sound like anything other than what I expected it to sound like. I mean some guitars are naturally a little brighter or a little warmer or a little something or other differant from another guitar...but I've never found that to drastically alter the usual tone of a given pickup. I think to much is made of that sort of obsessive thing.

I use my favorite pickups in all of my guitars and they all sound just fine.

One exception might be the Jerry Donahue Tele lead pickup. In an exceptionally warm guitar that pickup can sound like it could use a little more treble.

Lew

Lew, man you are a rock. Steady and true.

Some others make it sound like pickup selection is a guessing game. The say just because you have one set of the same pup doesn't mean they will sound the same in two different gutars. They confuse me and get me all muddled up. I'll just have to be sure I am listening selectively to the right voices.

There is wisdom in a multitude of counsellors, but also, we have to watch out for the pretenders.

 

[Curly]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Do pickups vary in personality as much as guitars?

I don't think the point others were making was that pickups change personality, but rather, that different guitars bring out the tone of pickups differently, and emphasize the EQ differently

the guidelines on the main site suggest that A2 magnet pickups work well with ash bodies and maple necks - guitars that tend to be bright; and that A5 magnet pickups work well with alder bodies/ rosewood fretboards.
While you can use A2 pickups on alder/ rosewood guitars with fine results, I do think that sometimes A5 pickups on ash body/ maple neck instruments can get a little bright. That's my experience, at least.

also, I think that strats and teles are very much a sum of the parts, which is probably the reason that everyone discusses all the details ad infinitum - everything seems to make a difference with these guitars - wood, pickups, hardware, etc, etc

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

I don't think the point others were making was that pickups change personality, but rather, that different guitars bring out the tone of pickups differently, and emphasize the EQ differently

the guidelines on the main site suggest that A2 magnet pickups work well with ash bodies and maple necks - guitars that tend to be bright; and that A5 magnet pickups work well with alder bodies/ rosewood fretboards.
While you can use A2 pickups on alder/ rosewood guitars with fine results, I do think that sometimes A5 pickups on ash body/ maple neck instruments can get a little bright. That's my experience, at least.

also, I think that strats and teles are very much a sum of the parts, which is probably the reason that everyone discusses all the details ad infinitum - everything seems to make a difference with these guitars - wood, pickups, hardware, etc, etc

Thanks for the help Curly.
This is why I ask, to be sure that I am understanding what is said
Yes, I expect that there is great deal of uniformity/consistency between different pickups of the same model (ie. SSL-1's) Lack thereof would not be good for SD!

I guess I am trying to guage how much difference there can be between any two stratocasters considering each one's some-of-it's-parts factors.

 

[Luke Duke]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

With the exception of small amounts of resistance, inductance, and gauss strength pups are going to be pretty close to exact every time. However guitars are made of organic material (wood) which is subject to completely different nuances. We often forget that trees are living, thus are each unique. They are different ages, weights, densities, and have different minerals present in their wood. All this makes variations which a pickup will "pick up". I've played alder guitar that weighed a tone, and some that you forget you've got on.

Luke

 

[Steve R.]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

I would say that the guitar absolutely influences the sound of the pickup. (Although, I prefer to think of it the other way around, saying that the pickup influences the sound of the guitar.) That's not to say that I wouldn't like the same pickup in different guitars, it's just that they won't sound the same.

For example, if I love JB pickups, I know I will like it in any of my guitars. BUT, I know that all the guitars will not sound the same. My mahogony strat will sound warm and full, but my maple strat will have a sharper attack and more bite and punch.

Having said that, I usually choose a pickup that suits the guitars "personality". Again, a JB is a pickup I really like, but if the mahogony guitar is dark sounding I might use a Screamin' Demon, or if the maple guitar is too bright, I might use a pickup with less bite to warm things up a bit.

Everything affects tone though. Wood choice, neck thru versus bolt-on, bridge choice, pickup choice, etc. There are tons of variables that make up a guitars overall character, or personality as you put it. You can change any one of them and influence the tone, but the foundation, in my opinion, starts with the neck and the body.

-Steve

 

[gripweed]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Lew, man you are a rock. Steady and true.

Some others make it sound like pickup selection is a guessing game. The say just because you have one set of the same pup doesn't mean they will sound the same in two different gutars. They confuse me and get me all muddled up. I'll just have to be sure I am listening selectively to the right voices.

There is wisdom in a multitude of counsellors, but also, we have to watch out for the pretenders.

Well opinons are like a**holes. Everybody has got one. :laugh2:

I think sometimes people don't know what they want. Sometimes they get confused about what others want on this forum. Sometimes what we ask for in this forum is not exactly clear.

Guitar players are very odd when it comes to equipment. They claim they can hear a difference when I'm sure most of them couldn't. I wonder for example, if you put a solid state, tube or digital amp and did a blind taste test how many players could actually tell the difference. I'd bet it would be less than one would imagine. But there is a kind of *mojo* that some players claim with their equipment. Eric Johnson is kind of an extreme example of this. Can he really tell the difference? I'll leave it up to all of you to decide but he sure has some odd guitar rituals.

In the end trust your own ears. If that fails ask Lew :laugh2:

 

[Metalman_666]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Guitar players are very odd when it comes to equipment. They claim they can hear a difference when I'm sure most of them couldn't. I wonder for example, if you put a solid state, tube or digital amp and did a blind taste test how many players could actually tell the difference. I'd bet it would be less than one would imagine. But there is a kind of *mojo* that some players claim with their equipment. Eric Johnson is kind of an extreme example of this. Can he really tell the difference? I'll leave it up to all of you to decide but he sure has some odd guitar rituals.

In the end trust your own ears. If that fails ask Lew :laugh2:

LOL wow that's quite the speech... but I'm not sure how right you are... a fair majority have the ears to tell which amp is which! You are right about asking Lew though lol

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

I've had pickups sound way better in certain guitars than I expected. But typically, it's not too shocking when I plug it in after soldering.

 

[Boleslaw Gers 666]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

I have heard that strats (and guitars in general) can have unique sonic properties such that pickup XYZ in strat A may not sound the same in Strat B.

Have you ever installed set of SSL-1’s, Surfers, or (insert your pickups here) and thought that they just didn’t sound like you thought they should? This assumes that everything is set up correctly! Which may not always be the case.

What did you do? Do you then say that SSL-1’s are not the answer for your strat or do you try another set of SSL-1’s? or do you try another pickup model?

Do pickups vary in personality as much as guitars?

No. They keep to standards pretty well with pickups. But strats in particular vary from guitar to guitar. You can play 10 strats and pick up the 11th and go "wow, that sounds better than the rest," even if it's supposedly the exact same guitar.

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Where's the love man?

I think sometimes people don't know what they want. Sometimes they get confused about what others want on this forum. Sometimes what we ask for in this forum is not exactly clear.

Yes, I have that trouble of trying get my ideas across clearly. And assessing the opinions and experiences that are shared. That's why I keep posting and asking questions. It's all for educational purposes. I have learned a great by doing this. Although, some may say, " Is this guy learning anything?! How many times and ways do we have to tell him!?

Thanks for humoring my posts and questions.

Guitar players are very odd when it comes to equipment. They claim they can hear a difference when I'm sure most of them couldn't.

Yes, some of those claims lead me to confused. But, perhaps I don't have the experience to hear what other hear. I sometime am un-necessarily burdened by other's experiences.

In the end trust your own ears. If that fails ask Lew :laugh2:

Yes, I want to know what Lew thinks. But, I want to hear from gripweed and Farkus and Steve R and Luke Duke and flank, and The Guy Who Invented Fire, and Curly, and Stratdeluxer97, et. al....

No, I don't trust my own ear's at this point. Especially when I spend more time posting on the SD forum than I do playing these days! :smack:

As far as my previous statement; "There is wisdom in a multitude of counsellors, but also, we have to watch out for the pretenders." Perhaps that statement had a sharper edge on it than I realised. But, it's worthy to applied when seeking of any kind of knowledge. The pretender part was not aimed at anyone specific on this forum. But, very good piece of wisdom applicable when seeking knowledge in all aspects of life. A piece of good rhetoric.

My apologies if it caused any offense

 

[gripweed]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Where's the love man?



Yes, I have that trouble of trying get my ideas across clearly. And assessing the opinions and experiences that are shared. That's why I keep posting and asking questions. It's all for educational purposes. I have learned a great by doing this. Although, some may say, " Is this guy learning anything?! How many times and ways do we have to tell him!?

Thanks for humoring my posts and questions.



Yes, some of those claims lead me to confused. But, perhaps I don't have the experience to hear what other hear. I sometime am un-necessarily burdened by other's experiences.



Yes, I want to know what Lew thinks. But, I want to hear from gripweed and Farkus and Steve R and Luke Duke and flank, and The Guy Who Invented Fire, and Curly, and Stratdeluxer97, et. al....

No, I don't trust my own ear's at this point. Especially when I spend more time posting on the SD forum than I do playing these days! :smack:

As far as my previous statement; "There is wisdom in a multitude of counsellors, but also, we have to watch out for the pretenders." Perhaps that statement had a sharper edge on it than I realised. But, it's worthy to applied when seeking of any kind of knowledge. The pretender part was not aimed at anyone specific on this forum. But, very good piece of wisdom applicable when seeking knowledge in all aspects of life. A piece of good rhetoric.

My apologies if it caused any offense

Guitar Toad this was not meant to be a critique of you! I am the one who should be apologizing if that is the impression I gave you! It is hard to choose pickups and its even harder to communicate to others what you want. I'm living proof of this! I have a real hard time when someone calls a pickup spongy or any of those other terms that they use. I think its their way to communicate a sound which *is* hard to do.

Even though I have been playing for quite some time I too have a lot to learn about pickups. I sit at the feet of Bodisatva Lew as well. That was partially intended as a joke. You do need to trust your own ears. Lew has some good ones. That is all I was trying to say.

I have really enjoyed many of your posts and you do have a very interesting perspective on things.

I do however get really ticked at players that claim to have a kind of voodoo or mojo about their playing and equipment. I don't see someone like Lew as an example of this. I think he is a very practical person who has some good insights that many players share. But some players get really precious about their equipment. I *don't* get that impression from many of the players here. That is one of the reasons I enjoy this forum as much as I do.

So once again Guitar Toad, I hope you accept my apology!

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Gripweed, All is well. let's have fun.

What is spongy any way? :laugh2: :laugh2: :smack:

 

[gripweed]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Gripweed, All is well. let's have fun.

What is spongy any way? :laugh2: :laugh2: :smack:

Apparently my Seth is :laugh2:

Its used to describe A2 pickups.

 

[Farkus]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Hey all,

I personally think that Strats are a perfect example of guitars that can have a great amount of variability between them. Even the same year, body wood and fretboard type.

Now, it may just be my own delusion (heheh), but I think that you have to be very careful about choosing the same pickup for every one of your Strats.

For example, I had a set of Fat 50's Fender pickups in my 1976 ash bodied Strat. They sounded very thin and brittle-pretty nasty. Just not a good combo. There will be those that say, 'Of course it was bright and thin...these are just slightly overwound Strat pickups in an ASH body with a MAPLE neck'. So, I took these out. Just for kicks, I then put them in my 1975 Strat with an ASH body and MAPLE neck. They sounded fantastic and were just what I was looking for in that Strat.

So, be careful with your choices and your wallet. But then I guess you always have the 21 day return policy if you are 'shocked and awed'...

Mark

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

In the end trust your own ears. If that fails ask Lew :laugh2:

That's funny! :laugh2: But thanks for the vote of confidence.

The truth is that I have my favorite pickups and I use those favorites in my favorite guitars.

I don't put a bright pickup in a warm guitar or a warm pickup in a bright guitar. (Like drinking a bunch of Jack Daniels and then chugging a pot of black coffee for that feeling of being so close to normal again! :laugh2: )

For one thing, I don't own any guitars that don't turn me on and make me feel like playing so I'm not trying to fix anything.

When it comes to Strat neck and middle pickups I like alnico 5 staggered single coils like the SSL-1, Antiquity Surfer, or Fralin Vintage Hots. That's what's in all of my Strats for the neck and middle pickups, regardless of what the neck and fingerboard are made or or how much the body weighs.

When it comes to Strat bridge pickups, I like the alnico 2 Texas Hot Custom, the alnico 2 Twangbanger or the ceramic magnet Fralin Steel Pole 43....again regardless of whether it's a rosewood fingerboard or what the body's made of.

When it comes to neck humbuckers I like the alnico 2 Seth Lover, Pearly Gates or Alnico 2 Pro.

And for bridge humbuckers I like the 59b or 59 Trembucker and the Custom Custom.

I have three Teles: two made of super lightweight ash and one made of aslder.

I have alnico 2 Antiquity I's in my swamp ash Nocaster, alnico 5 Surfer and a2 Jerry Donahue in my alder Tele Custom and a5 Fralin Blues Specials in my old swamp ash '54. But I've tried the Antiquitys in the alder Tele and the Blues Specials too. They all sounded great!

Personally, I feel that the pickups that are my favorites sound good in any guitar I've put them in. It just doesn't matter what the guitar is made of...if it's a good guitar, my favorite pickups always sound good in it.

Lew

 

[Dave]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

If I can add my two bits...

I think it's really tough to find the perfect pickup. I've thought that certain pups will give me the sound I'm after, but I wasn't dead on. The folks here are good at taking words and recommending a pickup based on what we say we want-Lew's a great example, as are many others here. He's done that for me.

They have been able to point me to the pickup I say I want, but when I was relatively new to all this ( and still am... ) I wasn't able to accurately describe what I wanted, and I got the wrong pickup.

So pickups are pretty consistent, guitars are highly variable based on materials/construction. We (I/people) are super variable in our abilities to communicate and our abilities to fully understand what we want.

 

[Hellion]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

Paul Reed Smith said about 20 years ago that an electric guitar is first and foremost an acoustic guitar (Guitar Player interview, though I'm not sure the issue). I'm in agreement. Strats to me sound breathy and whispery even before you plug them in. Teles sound full bodied and twangy. Les Pauls sound midrangy. A pickup is just a microphone. The mechanics are different but the principle is the same.

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: Strats Personality and Pickups

If I can add my two bits...

pickups are pretty consistent, guitars are highly variable...We (I/people) are super variable in our abilities to communicate and our abilities to fully understand what we want.

TRue. weLL said. Well done Dave.