Chistopher
malapterurus electricus tonewood instigator
I actually like the 300k volume, 500k tone setup in a Les Paul. 150k has no buisness being in a guitar without a rythmn switch
T-Tops
- Thread starter Chistopher
- Start date
Chistopher
malapterurus electricus tonewood instigator
I always thought my Bonamassa LP was too bright in the bridge and too dark in the neck. You can imagine my surprise when I found out it had a 300k volume on the bridge with all other pots being 500k.
Sometimes I just don't know
Sometimes I just don't know
Kirk Dahnke
New member
You have to try the Brandonwound JP#1 set. The best sounding humbuckers ever. The T-Top bridge is by far the best HB for a LP. Even if you just want to order a bridge T-Top, I highly recommend that. I've just ordered a T-Top bridge before. $95. Crazy and blows away any of the heavy hitters.
P.S. the T-Top in the JP set is wound to 7.9K. That's the one you want. Not sure what they wind the regular ones to. Just message them and tell them you want that one. Very responsive.
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Yes in thier day of production was the Hey Day of the DiMarzio Super Distortion.
Figure the Marshall 2203/2204 circuit( master volume) wasnt invented till 1975. So through most of the 70s meant a plexi at hearing damage levels to get drive.
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Kirk Dahnke
New member
Yeah, but he was talking Page. BW makes an excellent JP#1 set. The owner even got hired by Gibson to make the Custombuckers, Greenybuckers, and that $1K set of PAFs. All of those you can buy from him at a fraction of the price from his website. Just message him what you want and he'll make them. Has all vintage Gibson machines, and family owned. Once you try his stuff you'll never go back. Personally, I didn't know I loved a T-Top. But I had played a ton of vintage Gibson LPs and SGs that the pickups sounded fantastic in. Finally heard a T-TOP in my Page set, and it nails the sound I always heard. I have the set in a Vintage Mij Burny LPC. YMMV.
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Kirk Dahnke
New member
Can't recommend these enough. I'm 56 and these are the best. Very reasonable. I pulled out Fralins, WLHs, and BBs for these.
If you love your neck pickup, then just get a bridge T-Top. Ask him to send you the one he uses in the JP#1 set.
beaubrummels
Well-known member
FWIW I chased Jimmy Page tone for 3-4 years. I haven't tried Brandonwound, and there are a couple other makers that do JP sets I haven't had a chance to try, but what I landed on to get that tone:
Bare Knuckle Black Dog bridge (seems a similar recipe and tone to a Whole Lotta Humbucker, but better IMHO)
Duncan 59/A4 neck
What also worked, the poor man's version was
59 neck in the bridge
Jazz neck in the neck (or Seth neck, depends on the guitar which works, though. Jazz for dark guitars, Seth for bright guitars)
Bare Knuckle Black Dog bridge (seems a similar recipe and tone to a Whole Lotta Humbucker, but better IMHO)
Duncan 59/A4 neck
What also worked, the poor man's version was
59 neck in the bridge
Jazz neck in the neck (or Seth neck, depends on the guitar which works, though. Jazz for dark guitars, Seth for bright guitars)
Kirk Dahnke
New member
Cool, just a recommendation that you'll be very happy with. I'd at least try the bridge T-TOP someday. Its going to sound great in an LP or SG style guitar. I blow them up on forums just because of how good they are.
I think T-Tops sound ok but they just don’t have the power as compared to modern day pickups. Would a stronger magnet help? I dunno.
I’m also of the opinion that if they were really that good — and this could apply to PAFs as well — our guitar heroes of days gone by would be using them today instead of the stuff made by Seymour and other pickup makers.
I’m also of the opinion that if they were really that good — and this could apply to PAFs as well — our guitar heroes of days gone by would be using them today instead of the stuff made by Seymour and other pickup makers.
freefrog
Well-known member
I won''t repeat what I've already replied to the 2d paragraph... https://forum.seymourduncan.com/threads/dating-gibson-t-top.6325667/post-6331239
But regarding the idea that T-Tops "just don't have the power": that's not my experience. Yes, those from the late 70's tend to have a low output (albeit some of the last units featured ceramic bars). The first ones with pat. number stickers tend to be fitted with stronger magnets. Those in my Flying V are anything but weak.
This answer is not meant to "defend" T-Tops. Tastes and colors aren't to be discussed. I just don't think one can generalize about T-Top's as being low output transducers.
I don't think it's so much that (real) T-tops have less power per se, more that the power they do have is concentrated in slightly higher frequencies compared to a 50s-spec humbucker. Especially these days when very few people have ever heard a real PAF in person but many have heard the modern take, which are typically overwound, I can see how someone might think a T-top lacks power in comparison to those. More upper mids and less lower-mids can feel weaker if you're looking for low rumble, even if in an overall sense the signal strength is the same.
To me, they just don’t have the overall boomyness of SD or other pickups.
Well yeah, that's the point. The last thing any T-top is going to do is "boom", but they may (depends on which parts Gibson had in stock that day) have an equal amount of power in some other part of the frequency spectrum, especially the higher frequencies. It's not a question of "more" or "less" power, just different power. You don't get "boom" but you might get "scream", for instance.
And again, real PAFs rarely have much "boom" to them, but most people will never use one and the typical PAF copies today are more powerful and fuller in sound. Even the Seth Lover Bridge, for example, has 8.2k worth of 42AWG, which is fractionally on the hotter side of average for a PAF. So when people compare T-tops to PAF-types, they're often actually comparing them to modern reproductions of PAFs, which themselves aren't quite as light and bright as real PAFs are.
Remember that later T-tops not only use ceramic magnets, but they use thicker than normal ceramic magnets, and they use longer screws and poles to match. This puts the magnetic force and inductance much higher than even something like an SD '59. But we all know ceramic also means a tighter and brighter sound, and the taller construction also emphasizes the higher frequencies over the mids, especially the lower-mids. (Check out SD's Scooped Strat and Fender's Dig Dippers, which both use taller than normal coils.) T-tops also rarely measure more than about 7.7-7.8k of 42AWG. So you've got a much stronger magnet and higher inductance—more power!—but you've also got less wire and different dimensions which shift that power toward the top end and away from the bottom.
Also, everyone has a different idea of what "power" sounds like. Some people are more sensitive to some areas of the frequency spectrum than others. And if you run your amp with the bass on 0 and the treble on 10 then a T-top will sound very loud, but if you reverse those EQ knobs then the same pickup will seem quieter.
Like I said, I don't think it's a matter of one pickup type having more or less power than the other, it's just they apply power in different places.
And again, real PAFs rarely have much "boom" to them, but most people will never use one and the typical PAF copies today are more powerful and fuller in sound. Even the Seth Lover Bridge, for example, has 8.2k worth of 42AWG, which is fractionally on the hotter side of average for a PAF. So when people compare T-tops to PAF-types, they're often actually comparing them to modern reproductions of PAFs, which themselves aren't quite as light and bright as real PAFs are.
Remember that later T-tops not only use ceramic magnets, but they use thicker than normal ceramic magnets, and they use longer screws and poles to match. This puts the magnetic force and inductance much higher than even something like an SD '59. But we all know ceramic also means a tighter and brighter sound, and the taller construction also emphasizes the higher frequencies over the mids, especially the lower-mids. (Check out SD's Scooped Strat and Fender's Dig Dippers, which both use taller than normal coils.) T-tops also rarely measure more than about 7.7-7.8k of 42AWG. So you've got a much stronger magnet and higher inductance—more power!—but you've also got less wire and different dimensions which shift that power toward the top end and away from the bottom.
Also, everyone has a different idea of what "power" sounds like. Some people are more sensitive to some areas of the frequency spectrum than others. And if you run your amp with the bass on 0 and the treble on 10 then a T-top will sound very loud, but if you reverse those EQ knobs then the same pickup will seem quieter.
Like I said, I don't think it's a matter of one pickup type having more or less power than the other, it's just they apply power in different places.
freefrog
Well-known member
Agreed (especially with the words in bold)...
Agreed again.
[Except that ceramic magnets give a stronger flux vs a lower inductance. But that's a detail.]
It's tempting to judge pickups by themselves, outside of their original context. But it's misleading.
The voicing of T-Tops did make sense in a world where people were playing through low-fi
devices - like wah pedals with a poor input impedance, plugged to highly capacitive long and/or coily cables...
Even when they're meant to clone vintage transducers, contemporary pickups are logically voiced for recent gear, which is more efficient and most often clearer sounding... Customers are accustomed to this situation and have a hard time to deal with the differently voiced PU's of yesteryears (and it's also true for Filter'Tron's for instance)...
... while in fact, it's easy to manipulate RC loads in order to adapt old pickups to new gear. Once that done, they happen to be surprisingly versatile, with a very familiar and pleasing tone.
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I hate a set of Pat # in an old Gibson (they’re not T-Tops) and have used guitars with PAFs many times before.
Like I said earlier, I find that they sound ok (and have used them in a LP for a while) they’re just lacking, for lack of a better term, balls. Granted, that’s just my opinion of them.
freefrog
Well-known member
Damn, I realize that I had left this answer open, forgotting to end and to post it. So let's publish my rambling finally!
@ Cdntac: i have nothing against your opinion. Nor against your preferences. It's just that I didn't and still don't live the same thing than you with the T-Top's that I have met among so many other pickups these 45 last years (and which are necessarily not the same than what you've played). Anecdotically, in the answer 37 to which you've replied above, I've added a few words expressing how I put the question in perspective when I generalize the reflection myself. ;-)
I was rocking the mentioned Flying V a few hours ago through a Mesa and a Hiwatt, BTW. There were enough "balls" there to shake the house.
More later maybe. I might share a few possibly interesting data but have not enough free time for that now...
@ Cdntac: i have nothing against your opinion. Nor against your preferences. It's just that I didn't and still don't live the same thing than you with the T-Top's that I have met among so many other pickups these 45 last years (and which are necessarily not the same than what you've played). Anecdotically, in the answer 37 to which you've replied above, I've added a few words expressing how I put the question in perspective when I generalize the reflection myself. ;-)
I was rocking the mentioned Flying V a few hours ago through a Mesa and a Hiwatt, BTW. There were enough "balls" there to shake the house.
More later maybe. I might share a few possibly interesting data but have not enough free time for that now...
Kirk Dahnke
New member
Fortunately the BW Page set is the same or less than the price of Duncans or Dimarzios.
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