Teach me about magnets

[polifemo]

Hi,

New to this forum.

Been a pro player for ages and always tweaked/modded/built amps and pedals and stuff in order to get "the perfect tone".
Guitars have been adjusted and pickups have been bought and sold.

I´ve now come to the point when I want to experiment with swapping magnets in some pickups, but I feel that I don´t know enough about it all.

That´s where you guys come in

 

[cakire82]

Re: Teach me about magnets

Welcome to the forum!

I would suggest you to use the search function. You will find that there a lot of threads where characteristics of each type of magnet is explained and discussed. Once you have specific questions you are always welcome to ask away.

 

[Nagash]

Re: Teach me about magnets

I'm not a magnet teacher and I'd like someone to eventually correct what I say but I believe you can go like this : Alnico V is very common and most vintage pickups have Alnico V. Alnico II I couldn't tell, haven't played many II's. Ceramic bars give a much higher output and a harsher tone, many active pickups or high power pickups (such as heavy metal styled ones) use Ceramic.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Teach me about magnets

There's some online instruction on how to swap a magnet (project guitar.com, etc). You can do it with HB's and P-90s, both use the same magents.

A2 - warm, lots of mids, rounded top, great dynamics, loose low-end, low output.
A3 - similar to an A2 but with more treble. Not used a lot, but handy when an A2 is too dark, and an A5 is too much. Probably best in a neck PU.
A4 - balanced EQ, makes for a good middle ground between A2's and A5's. Medium output. Becoming more popular.
A5 - lots of treble and bass, mid-scooped. Tight low-end. High output. The most commonly-used alnico.
A8 - ample mids, moderate treble, firm low-end, high output. Usually used for the bridge poistion only, very popular in a Custom, making it a 'C8'.
Roughcast - A2, A3, A4,a nd A5 can also be sand cast (as opposed to polished); this smoothes out the high-end and makes for very nice tones. Best for bridge PU's.
Unoriented - A2, A3, & A4 are unoriented, and A5 is normally oriented. But the latest excitement here is unoriented A5's, which have the warmth and dynamics of an A2, but with a firmer low-end, more output, and little more treble. Great for adding body to bridge PU's.

Decide what is missing in your tone, or what you have too much of, and then look to see if a replacement magnet might move your tone in the direction you want to go. You've got 10 kinds of alnico to play with.

We get our magnets at Addiction FX on eBay; best selection and low prices. Get an assortment and have some fun.

 

[polifemo]

Re: Teach me about magnets

there's some online instruction on how to swap a magnet (project guitar.com, etc). You can do it with hb's and p-90s, both use the same magents.

a2 - warm, lots of mids, rounded top, great dynamics, loose low-end, low output.
a3 - similar to an a2 but with more treble. Not used a lot, but handy when an a2 is too dark, and an a5 is too much. Probably best in a neck pu.
a4 - balanced eq, makes for a good middle ground between a2's and a5's. Medium output. Becoming more popular.
a5 - lots of treble and bass, mid-scooped. Tight low-end. High output. The most commonly-used alnico.
a8 - ample mids, moderate treble, firm low-end, high output. Usually used for the bridge poistion only, very popular in a custom, making it a 'c8'.
roughcast - a2, a3, a4,a nd a5 can also be sand cast (as opposed to polished); this smoothes out the high-end and makes for very nice tones. Best for bridge pu's.
unoriented - a2, a3, & a4 are unoriented, and a5 is normally oriented. But the latest excitement here is unoriented a5's, which have the warmth and dynamics of an a2, but with a firmer low-end, more output, and little more treble. Great for adding body to bridge pu's.

Decide what is missing in your tone, or what you have too much of, and then look to see if a replacement magnet might move your tone in the direction you want to go. You've got 10 kinds of alnico to play with.

We get our magnets at addiction fx on ebay; best selection and low prices. Get an assortment and have some fun.

thanks!

 

[skynyrd]

Re: Teach me about magnets

Gotta Luv it ! !

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Teach me about magnets

Standard A5's can seem "boomy" in humbuckers in the neck position, which annoys the piss out of me.

The UOA5 DOES work in the neck position, and work very well, contrary to what some have said. If you need more power than an A2 will give you the UOA5 will make a slightly brighter/louder pickup but still will have that sound. I like it quite a bit better than the A4 in the neck.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Teach me about magnets

thanks!

Every time you put in a new magnet, you literally create a 'new' PU. Too many guys give up on a HB or P-90 without ever trying a different magnet, which to me is crazy. You don't know what potential a PU has to offer. I didn't like the JB, put in an A2, and I love it. Completely changes the sound & EQ. Not every mag swap is this drastic, sometimes you only want to bump the tone a little. With all the magnets our new mag source, Addiction FX, carries, we've got our hands full trying them out.

If you have P-90's it gets even more exciting, as thay have two magnets, and (as it dawned on me one day) they don't have to be two of the same kind. You can really dial in the EQ you want, more than with an HB.

You sound like the kind of guy that will really get into this. Glad you joined us.

 

[dr. ad]

Re: Teach me about magnets

also, be aware that the number of the grade isn't necessarily an indication of it's strength; alnicu 3 doesn't contain cobalt, and alnico 4 doesn't contain copper, for example.

this has some very useful info in....

 

[polifemo]

Re: Teach me about magnets

I, like the rest of you guys I would guess, tend to get quite obsessed when I find a new parameter to tweak in the signal chain, so this will be fun!
In general I go for low/medium output PU´s and I usually find neck humbuckers to be way to boomy in the low end (prefer SC in that position) and the "PAF-style" HBs I use in bridge position usually are a bit too bright. (Run the tone set to about 6-7)

A clear "un boomy" neck PU and a bit warmer/fatter bridge PU - both in the vintage output camp - is what I´m looking for.

Maybe a 59 would be a good starting point for the bridge PU?
Don´t really know about the neck PU, but I found the 59 to be way too boomy in the low end for that position.

Or maybe I just should get some cheap Tonerider PUs to practise my "magnet swapping skills" on to start with.

 

[skynyrd]

Re: Teach me about magnets

I had a sh-5 Custom, swapped out the ceramic mag for a A4 and really liked how it opened up the sound, then after hearing a few of the guys here talk about putting an A8 in their Customs I tried that, loved it ! ! It was like a punch in the gut yet still retained note definition. Somehow when removing the cover to try the pup uncovered the pup died, not sure if it was something I did or what? But have ordered a cheaper Vintage 59 to try out, I heard sound clips of the GFS 59 neck and loved the brightness and lack of boomy bass so will be ordering 1 of those for the neck. The GFS 59 bridge will be the mag swapper, will leave it stock then will try the A8 , then will try a UOA5 and see which I like best. Right now for me money is tight so buying a cheaper pup and playing with magnets is more economical for me. Later on I will most likely get the Duncan 59`s , I think Seymour nailed a practically DUPLICATE copy of the origonals. I hear alot of guys say why pay his price when I can get the same thing cheaper ? IMO Seymour has put in the time to make sure he gets every detail of the origonal down to a T, but the mag swapping can definately take your sound to a new level and I am just getting started learning the mags.

 

[misterwhizzy]

Re: Teach me about magnets

Maybe a 59 would be a good starting point for the bridge PU?
Don´t really know about the neck PU, but I found the 59 to be way too boomy in the low end for that position.

I tend to like a little bit higher output pickups in the bridge position, so I can't comment on that, but it sounds like A4 in the neck might just do the trick for you. I had the same problem, and consultation on here led me to lower the pickup under the low strings and raise the polepieces. That increased clarity and decreased boominess well enough. If that had NOT worked, though, I would have put in an A4.

That being said, I'm a proponent of magnet swapping. I swapped an A2 into a Distortion neck, and that made things too voweley and woman toney. Then I put in an A5, and even though it was a bit too hot, that was a pretty nice pickup. I eventually replaced it with the 59n that I was talking about above, but it's worth tweaking. In the bridge, I have a Custom 8 right now, and that is a GREAT pickup.

 

[polifemo]

Re: Teach me about magnets

Just did my first magnet swap :friday:

I used a cheap GFS 59 bridge humbucker.
The magnet was tightly "glued" into the wax, but after some work I was able to get it loose.
The A2 magnet that I used as replacement removed the shrill high end as well as adding some nice mids.
This is a cheap pickup (have no idea what type of wire that was used) in every respect, but it sounds waaaay better now!

I´ll order a variety of magnets and use this PU for experiments.

I´ve had a look at the addiciton FX site, and they specify magnets as: new, magnetized, charged, fully charged.
I suppose one should get the "fully charged" ones, or?

 

[cakire82]

Re: Teach me about magnets

Just did my first magnet swap :friday:

I used a cheap GFS 59 bridge humbucker.
The magnet was tightly "glued" into the wax, but after some work I was able to get it loose.
The A2 magnet that I used as replacement removed the shrill high end as well as adding some nice mids.
This is a cheap pickup (have no idea what type of wire that was used) in every respect, but it sounds waaaay better now!

I´ll order a variety of magnets and use this PU for experiments.

I´ve had a look at the addiciton FX site, and they specify magnets as: new, magnetized, charged, fully charged.
I suppose one should get the "fully charged" ones, or?

Now it is your turn to provide sound clips then

 

[polifemo]

Re: Teach me about magnets

If things would have been "normal" here at home I most definitely would have made some clips in my little home studio, but at the moment my youngest daughter is really ill, so I try not to make too much noise right now.

As I´ll most definitely will continue doing this (swapping magnets, that is) I promise to make a series of "before/after magnet swapping clips" later on!

Will try a A8 in this PU as well. (Have to buy one first, though ;-)

 

[blueman335]

Re: Teach me about magnets

I suppose one should get the "fully charged" ones, or?

Yes, specify that.

 

[polifemo]

Re: Teach me about magnets

Thanks!
This is fun :1:

 

[skynyrd]

Re: Teach me about magnets

I like my GFS 59 so far, I have GHS strings on my paul and they are so bassy and lack high end I can`t really give a great review on the pup. The SH-5 Custom I had must have been defective from the git-go, my amp had a his to it constantly no matter what I did and with the GHS its dead quiet. When I changed from my 20+ year brand of strings to the GHS Boomers it was like night and day in tone, the boomers had zero high end and are all bassy, so will pick up my old standbys tomorrow and see what happens, I definately want to try my spare A8 in the 59, will try to do up some B4 and after clips so everyone can hear the difference.

 

[Jet-Jaguar]

Re: Teach me about magnets

There's a Youtube Demonstration of the sound of various Magnets if you want to hear it for yourself:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WloCr8VOGXU

 

[polifemo]

Re: Teach me about magnets

Thanks.

Lousy sound quality, and I can´t say that the panning was of much help, but obviously there´s rather subtle differencies between certain magnets.

Would have loved to have been able to listen to a selection of overdriven/distorted clips as that´s where these "subtle things" get magnified!