Tone control capasitor value???

5150ed

New member
Hi I am a newbie here.

I am so confuse about the value of guitar tone control's capasitor, some recommend .022mf, some recommend .047-.05 mf.

Which is the appropriate value? and what is the effect of changing the value [increase or decrease]?

And the last one, is it worth to upgrade high quality film capasitor to replace the stock ceramic capasitor?
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

The larger the number, the more signal that is removed as you turn down the tone control. If you used a .1uf, you'ld convert the tone control to a volume control because you'ld be removing all of the signal. A .047uf dips down into the midrange and sounds muffled to me. I prefer a more subtle tone control, and use .022uf exclusively now. I've been meaning to try a .01uf. to make the control even more subtle.

Its all a matter of personal taste.
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Welcome to the forum!

Personally I like both. The .047 and the .022. My strat and tele both have the .022, and my Heritage, L,P and PRS have .047.

I think it's all a matter of preference. I like a pretty healthy sweep so I can add treble if a venue, or take it away if necessary.

My Godin has a .033 and I think it's my favorite since it is right in between.

Personally I'm all about tweaking values and cap types. I think that nicer caps give you a more smooth roll off...maybe I should say consistent through the sweep.

Luke
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Thank u so much ArtieToo and Luke Duke.

There is one thing I forgot to ask, if the value of tone's capasitor effect the sound when the tone is at max?
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Get the "orange drop" capacitors from www.acmeguitarworks.com in these values (.015uf, .022uf, .033uf, .047uf). Get a couple of wires with alligator clips and temporarily hook up each one (assuming you can get at them) and play the guitar. Choose the one you like the most ... then solder it in.
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Max meaning wide open?

I do not know how to say, MAX = position that let's high frequency pass the most.


And Doveman do you have any experience about changing brand or type of cap instate of value? Is it make any sound improvment?
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Changing values (.015 - .047) makes the most difference. But I think the "orange drops" I mentioned are better than others I've used ... and they are fairly cheap. I bought several of each value from acme guitar works. It is a matter of changing them until you hear what you like.
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

There is one thing I forgot to ask, if the value of tone's capasitor effect the sound when the tone is at max?

Yes, the value of the tone cap does have some affect on your sound even at "10". The value of your tone pot determines how much of the high frequencies leak to ground through the cap at "10" - you will lose more high end with a 250k pot than with a 500k pot (all other things being equal).

FWIW sometimes I like to use a smaller value tone cap on the neck pickup and a larger value on the bridge, like .015 and .033 for example. Depends on the pickups, guitar, amp, etc.

Chip
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

I'm looking for an opinion regarding what type of capacitor material is best, I'm good as far as far as .022 or .047 but what about Voltage - 200, 400, 600 - any difference? Also is there that big difference of quality of tone between ceramic, paper oil and Metallized Polypropylene Film Capacitors
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

I just bought a couple of Vitamin Q's to go in my LP Traditional which should make my SD Joe Bonamassa Signature Pickups sound even better.
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Standard passive tone controls are variable treble attenuators; they work by removing treble. They siphon from the hot signal only those frequencies that make it though a certain strainer. They send those frequencies to ground (where they are inaudible). In other words, they are just controlled "leaks" from the main signal to ground. The potentiometer is the siphon valve...and the capacitor is the strainer.

The capacitor value is what determines the coarseness of the strainer. The lower the value, the finer the strainer – the higher a frequency must be in order to pass through the capacitor and leak off to ground.

Therefore the capacitor value you use is really just a matter of taste. Use a higher value (e.g. .047 uF) if you want a very bassy, muffled tone when you turn down the control. Use a lower value (say .022 uF) if you want a slightly less treble-attenuated tone. Go even lower to get a tone that mainly just rolls off the top end, kind of like a snarly cocked wah tone.

In a guitar circuit, capacitor material does not affect tone – only the actual value/s of the capacitor/s used. Therefore it pays to spend the money for tight tolerance caps (e.g. 5 percent as opposed to 20 percent), but not to pay for caps made of a certain material. Also, go for the lowest voltage you can find, as they will usually be cheaper. The Orange Drops most guitar parts suppliers sell are 600V or 400V, which is ridiculous. All ratings that high do is to make them larger and more expensive.

FWIW, my go-to cap value is .01 uF. I usually find the higher values too muffled, though I will sometimes go with a lower value, like .0047 uF (4700 pF). My go-to caps are 100V, 5 percent tolerance Orange Drops. Overkill, yes, but for under a buck a piece for a cap that I don't have to bother measuring, they're a good option IMO.
 
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Re: Tone control capasitor value???

I just bought a couple of Vitamin Q's to go in my LP Traditional which should make my SD Joe Bonamassa Signature Pickups sound even better.

Depending on the pickups a Vitamin Q set would be good depending on the values. In a LP try an .022 at the bridge and a .015 at the neck. Using a .022 in both positions is ok as well but the neck will be a bit bright.
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Another item to keep in mind (if I have this right), is that if you double the pot value, you should halve the cap value to get roughly the frequencies going to ground. Jumping from a 250k pot and a 0.047 cap to a 500k pot would necessitate using a 0.022 cap (roughly half). Someone might want to confirm this, I may have it wrong.
 
Re: Tone control capacitor value - test the best

Re: Tone control capacitor value - test the best

Capacitors are odd things where in theory only the value should make a difference
There is a difference in tone roll off based on the resistance of the pot and the knee of the roll off frequency is determined by the capacitor Value

This is where things get funky as a dark capacitor of 47nF in the original telecasters would be fine because the guitar is bright while a 22nF capacitor (cap) might be bright

In theory there should be little difference but there is a 20% error in values so that one 22nF cap may be 18nF and another 25nF which you will hear

One person says brand x is bland and brand y is grand may be taken by the difference in values in their guitar

Tone woods of different guitars transmit or absorb different frequencies so there is no magical value or type that I can say would work but you can shape your own by putting two in parallel

Before you solder your guitar rake up a series of capacitors of different types and values
The $30 or so would buy you a lot to play with
Take a guitar cable and pull the shell and wire up a rig so you can test the tone of the capacitor I. Your guitar, keeping the tone off and volume on full, to decide what cap you want to solder in

You can disconnect and turn your tone back on full for the A/B test and say better worse or about the same without guesswork or a lot of soldering

I recommend this as soldering is a pain and it eliminates doubt

Orange drop are fine but as I said try a bunch as the one I put in my precious Ginger sounds nasal as the knee is too high in the frequency range so the cap value was too small

Final thoughts are those guitars with two switched tone controls can take them off the switch and use different cap values on each tone pot and get tone shaping control otherwise unavailable

Good luck
Report back
----
The appropriate value is the one that sounds good to you with your guitar and amp
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Another item to keep in mind (if I have this right), is that if you double the pot value, you should halve the cap value to get roughly the frequencies going to ground. Jumping from a 250k pot and a 0.047 cap to a 500k pot would necessitate using a 0.022 cap (roughly half). Someone might want to confirm this, I may have it wrong.

You are correct the resistance in the pot should be considered. In his case he would have a 500k pot (if stock) .015 and.022 with 500k pots would be good. Two .022s would be good but a bit brite at the bridge (my preference as well as Clapton's when using buckers). It all comes down to line loss in the end.
 
Re: Tone control capasitor value???

Standard passive tone controls are variable treble attenuators; they work by removing treble. They siphon from the hot signal only those frequencies that make it though a certain strainer. They send those frequencies to ground (where they are inaudible). In other words, they are just controlled "leaks" from the main signal to ground. The potentiometer is the siphon valve...and the capacitor is the strainer.

The capacitor value is what determines the coarseness of the strainer. The lower the value, the finer the strainer – the higher a frequency must be in order to pass through the capacitor and leak off to ground.

Therefore the capacitor value you use is really just a matter of taste. Use a higher value (e.g. .047 uF) if you want a very bassy, muffled tone when you turn down the control. Use a lower value (say .022 uF) if you want a slightly less treble-attenuated tone. Go even lower to get a tone that mainly just rolls off the top end, kind of like a snarly cocked wah tone.

In a guitar circuit, capacitor material does not affect tone – only the actual value/s of the capacitor/s used. Therefore it pays to spend the money for tight tolerance caps (e.g. 5 percent as opposed to 20 percent), but not to pay for caps made of a certain material. Also, go for the lowest voltage you can find, as they will usually be cheaper. The Orange Drops most guitar parts suppliers sell are 600V or 400V, which is ridiculous. All ratings that high do is to make them larger and more expensive.

FWIW, my go-to cap value is .01 uF. I usually find the higher values too muffled, though I will sometimes go with a lower value, like .0047 uF (4700 pF). My go-to caps are 100V, 5 percent tolerance Orange Drops. Overkill, yes, but for under a buck a piece for a cap that I don't have to bother measuring, they're a good option IMO.

Very good illustration of what functionally happens with a cap.
 
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