Tone Control Mods?!??

[newjersey236]

Re: Tone Control Mods?!??

Yes, I have had this exact mod in my guitar, thanks to having a box of stock Fender guts laying around, and I've tried a few other mods to the 250k, gone back to the "greasebucket", and currently it's pretty much wired like the BlueGuitar diagram, though with a different value Hovland MusiCap (not worth the $12). I'd also like to try a smooth-rotation Stellartone "ToneStyler", either with 8 or 16 positions, but the notched-rotation one I have in another guitar is too much of a pain in the ass to bother with.

Isn't the smooth-rotation "Tonestyler" just like a normal rotary switch with different value capacitors at each position but it has a smooth taper rather than a notched one?

 

[ratherdashing]

Re: Tone Control Mods?!??

Ahh that was very cool to read. I never knew what that would have looked like on a diagram but thank you for ellaborating that for me.

Then if what your saying is true (which is what it seems), that would mean that the .001 cap is actually doing just what I thought it would do, bleeding off some of the super high frequencies to ground.

See, the reason I wanted to use a .001 cap is because I wanted a very trebly (tele-ish) sound at 10 but I didn't want full blown 1 meg pot treble, (thats too much for me) so I figured a really really low value like .001 would be good for this as it would allow alot of highs to be in the signal but it would also cut off some of those super high frequncies at 10 that I felt were too much for me.

As for the 4.7k resistor, I now understand that does pretty much nothing at all.

But however, looking at your entire diagram I noticed you put a .01 value cap on the 250k pot along with the .022 cap and 4.7k resistor. In my mod that particular cap was valued at .1.

Wouldn't that make a big difference though in this case being a .1 cap rather than a .01 cap because a .1 cap would be cutting out alot more mid and high frequncies than a .01 cap would be?

Because that would mean the .01 cap would cut out less highs than the .022 cap would be. So really, the .01 cap would be pointless since once it reaches the .022 cap it would filter out the extra mids that the .01 cap allowed as you said.

I was figuring that the .1 cap would be great for this mod then as it would be cutting out alot of highs and mids from the signal (at least alot more than a .022 cap). But then when the signal passes through the .022 cap it would retain some high and mid-end which would ultimately cause for the tone to be really low (because of the highs/mids cut from the .1 cap) but also have some high and mid frequencies still in the signal (due to the .022 cap).

It would be kind of like having the low frequencies of a .1 cap with some retained high and mid frequencies due to the .022 cap. Would this statement be correct??

Ohhhh yeah ... you're right. That was a typo on my part. Sorry!

Everything I said still applies though (and in my brain I was thinking .1 but didn't type it for some reason ... d'oh!) No matter what value cap you put there, the .022 is going to reject anything below its cut-off value, and let through anything above. Since everything has to go through that .022 to get to ground, it calls the shots.

Think of the signal as cars, and the caps as tunnels. A huge car can get through the .1, a medium-sized car can get through the .022, and a tiny car can get through the .001. If a tiny car can get through the .001, we know it can also get through the .022 and make it to ground. However, the huge car that can get through the .1 will be blocked at the .022. In the end, only medium-sized cars or smaller will get through to ground.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[newjersey236]

Re: Tone Control Mods?!??

Ohhhh yeah ... you're right. That was a typo on my part. Sorry!

Everything I said still applies though (and in my brain I was thinking .1 but didn't type it for some reason ... d'oh!) No matter what value cap you put there, the .022 is going to reject anything below its cut-off value, and let through anything above. Since everything has to go through that .022 to get to ground, it calls the shots.

Think of the signal as cars, and the caps as tunnels. A huge car can get through the .1, a medium-sized car can get through the .022, and a tiny car can get through the .001. If a tiny car can get through the .001, we know it can also get through the .022 and make it to ground. However, the huge car that can get through the .1 will be blocked at the .022. In the end, only medium-sized cars or smaller will get through to ground.

Hope that makes sense.

Then hmmm.. with all that being said, I wonder why the .1 cap is even on the greasebucket circuit in the first place seeing as how it really doesnt do anything much because whatever value cap goes to ground will be the cap value ultimately shaping the tone in the end..

Do you know if the .1 cap does anything tone-wise in this mod or is it kind of just pointless?

 

[ZiggyZipgun]

Re: Tone Control Mods?!??

Isn't the smooth-rotation "Tonestyler" just like a normal rotary switch with different value capacitors at each position but it has a smooth taper rather than a notched one?

That's the one. 16 positions on a notched one gets pretty aggravating when you're trying to jump back to a fairly bright sound right away - in between riffs you're required to click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click...huge pain in the ass. Unfortunately, the Varitone number plates that are available don't match up to anything on a ToneStyler, but I used Adobe Illustrator to design a few number plates that I can have a local metal printing shop make if I decide to really permanently install a smooth-rotation one in anything.

 

[newjersey236]

Re: Tone Control Mods?!??

So today I removed the .001 cap I in this mod seeing if it would maybe increase treble frequencies when the 1 meg pot is turned towards "10" as it wouldnt be cutting out the super high frequencies at all.

It turns out, it did something else in fact... it effected the 5-1 postions before the center detent. When I turned the knob towards 0 after the center detent, the tone became more darker than when the .001 was present. Not muddy at all, just a more dramatic type of effect with the treble cut.

I think the .001 cap was retaining some high-end so that when the pot was turned all the way off there were still some high frequencies in the signal causing it to have some more treble and mid freqency in the tone when the knob was turned off.

Pretty much....

When the tone is off with the .001 cap its dark sounding but still has some slight treble and mids in the tone

When the tone is off without the .001 cap it sounds much more like a bass guitar