Trem?

[KidNotorious]

I'm putting together an electric and need advice about which trem to get. The Floyd's are too much of a hassle (though I like the effect), so what do y'all think? Wilkinson? 2-pin standard? 6-screw old school? It's gonna be kind of a strat-style thing, and I'm using my trem more and more...enough to forget that its a 'vibrato' effect rather than a 'tremolo'. Anyway, suggestions and advice are appreciated.
Out

 

[Kent S.]

Re: Trem?

FWIW, I've always held the belief, the simpler the vibrato, the better ... Forget locking nuts, and clamps ... I'd say put a graphite/trem cut nut on it, locking tuners of some kind, and then whatever will fit your design ... I like the PRS, the G&L, and the American Std. Fender vibrato bridges ... all very close to the same design, heck with locking tuners, and a low friction nut, a traditionl Fender Vibrato will work. You might want to see if Schaller makes one that will work for you as well. For *vibrato* six points works well, for dive bombs two points work better. For full floating the G&L works nicer than the Fender or PRS ... as far as Wilkinson, or Kahlers, never used them more than once, maybe twice ... Floyds , and any full floating have a certain feel to them, that just feels different than a anything based off the Fender design, but I kinda like that feel, to me it's smoother, in a not overly responsive way. Hard call, I'd play with a few different designs and see which has the feel you want, then see which would be easiest to implement in your guitar.

 

[KidNotorious]

Re: Trem?

Thanks guys. With the Floyd thing I just think the hassle of maintenance (string changes, intonation being SO touchy, etc) outweighs the benefits of its performance. There was a reason I charged twice to change somebody's strings who had one back when I worked in a shop.
Kent, could you define a bit more clearly the difference between 'dive-bombing' and 'full-floating'? Do you mean being able to pull the bar up as well? Shouldn't a floating trem be able to do both just by definition? Thanks again.

 

[Kent S.]

Re: Trem?

Thanks guys. With the Floyd thing I just think the hassle of maintenance (string changes, intonation being SO touchy, etc) outweighs the benefits of its performance. There was a reason I charged twice to change somebody's strings who had one back when I worked in a shop.
Kent, could you define a bit more clearly the difference between 'dive-bombing' and 'full-floating'? Do you mean being able to pull the bar up as well? Shouldn't a floating trem be able to do both just by definition? Thanks again.

What I meant by dive bombing was more of a stylist thing (ala heavy metal screaming descending harmonics ), or any other radical use of the arm for dare say I *pitch bending* ... think portamento ala synth), vs mild vibrato (kinda using the arm the produce a natural vibrato like a violin style fingering technique [ lovely technique on chords] ... rather than dropping the pitch a couple of steps or more). By full floating I really meant that the vibrato bridge was set up to be able to pull up *quite a bit* , rather than being floating just enough to allow a natural wiggle without the bridge contacting the body (think strat Vibrato bridge).
Generally when I use a vibrato, I use it in just the manner described, to vibrato chords or to increase the vibrato of single note lines to make them sing a bit more (like a singer would naturally vibrato certain notes in a lyrical phrase for emphasis). Yes a floating trem should be able to do both by definition ... but the full floating as i call them, are the designs like the fenders and similar that can rest on the body as well ... for some weird reason I tend to call floyds and the lot full floating. My point was that they have a different feel to their useage, they tend to work a bit more for the portamento stuff, while the more vintage design tends to do the vibrato thing a bit better. It's really subjective and personal, the trick is finding what feels right for you, and what will fit the best ... to me as long as they stay in tune, then they all are about the same ... and since I like the more subtle use of them, well I tend to go with the more traditional based designs. Sorry about the confusion .

 

[Gr8Scott]

Re: Trem?

Wilkinson! Get the beefy one! You get all the benefits of the locking trem and none of the hassle.

 

[KidNotorious]

Re: Trem?

Thanks Kent, I get what you're saying. I took a look at the Hipshot 2-point trem, and it looks pretty good. I guess I'm looking at that and the Wilkinson.
Scott, tell me a little more about the Wilkinson if you can. I had a guitar with one on it for about 2 seconds when I was in high school.

 

[heavydutysg135]

Re: Trem?

I would recommend getting the Floyd then blocking the back so it cannot be pulled up but can still be pushed down and dive bombed. You can then tighten the springs which fixes all of the problems that the floyds are known for. Since the trem is stabilized you can change tunings, do double stop bends, palm mute all without affecting the pitch of the other strings since it is not floating. It is easy to tune the guitar and it is more stable than the floating floyd. The only thing that you sacrifice by doing this is the ability to pull the bar up.

 

[Gr8Scott]

Re: Trem?

This is the trem that I love and highly recommend to everyone who likes a floyd but hates the hassle. You get a beefy arm to wrench on and the unit has lots of sustain and it will dive bomb just like a floyd will. It's the best trem out there IMHO.

You can get it for $69 in some places. $89 in others. Do a search on Wilkinson Trem and see what's out there for sale.

 

[Gr8Scott]

Re: Trem?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3714622251&category=41407

Here's a nice wilkinson trem on ebay. It was made for a carvin kit, but never used. I own the carvin kit and the trem unit on it is the same thing being offered here. This is an excellent trem and I'll bet you can get it for cheap.

 

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: Trem?

Do G & L sell their trem??

 

[Biu]

Re: Trem?

Wilkinsons are very sweet. It's the perfect blend of vintage trem and Floyd-style double-locking trem. With a Wilkionson, you can get a good amount of divebomb with the ease of setup of vintage trems.

 

[KidNotorious]

Re: Trem?

Biu! What's up man? Those video game clips rock it hard. I gotta get my junk together and put my Metroid suite up here :headbang: Yeah, I'm thinking I'm going with the Wilkinson. I must go to Warmoth forthwith!! Thanks to all you guys.

 

[Kent S.]

Re: Trem?

Do G & L sell their trem??

I actually believe that they do, no company that I know of won't sell you a replacement trem kit for a conversion of one of their guitars from hardtail to trem ... hint, hint, wink, wink, nudge, nudge ... :fing2:

 

[Kent S.]

Re: Trem?

This is the trem that I love and highly recommend to everyone who likes a floyd but hates the hassle. You get a beefy arm to wrench on and the unit has lots of sustain and it will dive bomb just like a floyd will. It's the best trem out there IMHO.

You can get it for $69 in some places. $89 in others. Do a search on Wilkinson Trem and see what's out there for sale.

Did they change the design on that thing? I don't remember the bridge being offset like that on the knife edges ... It's been a while since I had even a passing with one though ... If so what's the purpose behind that? It does look like it would fit in nicely with what I was saying about being minimalist with the actual part load, and as far as simplicity of design.

 

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: Trem?

Ah thanks Kent S.

That is one good trem they have there.

 

[Gr8Scott]

Re: Trem?

Did they change the design on that thing? I don't remember the bridge being offset like that on the knife edges ... It's been a while since I had even a passing with one though ... If so what's the purpose behind that? It does look like it would fit in nicely with what I was saying about being minimalist with the actual part load, and as far as simplicity of design.

The design is the same as the one I currently use and I've had it for 5 years or so. I don't know if it's been changed recently or not. The knife edges are parallel, but they look kind of offset because of the hook design. It's a fantastic trem and I wouldn't want any other trem system on a strat.