Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

[clocker]

The straight goods, for the impatient:
What single coil pick up should I add between a Seymour Duncan SH-6 and TB-6 on an alder body Ibanez RG220B to compliment those pickups?

Let me say first that I've played an acoustic for many years, but have only owned an electric for a year. The amp was a gift and the guitar was a steal. Tough to lose.

I'm finally developing some touch and an ear for the game. I bought a 4 pole five way switch and a couple of push pull pots, changed the tone cap and swapped out the original pups for Seymour Duncan SH-6 and TB-6. All of which I'm having fun with now that I've found a string gauge I can live with. So much to learn!

I've cleaned up the bridge anchor pins and knives to behave well and I'm loving the setup now. I'm a watch and clock maker (horologist) by day so attention to detail isn't foreign to me. Machine tools are a wonderful thing.

Anyway, I'm falling in love with this guitar and have been playing it a lot. I'm going to strip the paint off it, route out the body to take a single coil type pick up and hopefully find some nice looking wood to show off. I'm looking forward to a whole lot more tone options when I'm done and with any luck a somewhat more resonant body.

After too many hours scouring the Net, I conclude that I just don't know enough yet to make an educated guess as to what might be the best single coil pick up to round out an H-S-H setup like I'm aiming for. The options are many, but my experience is too limited. Please help me flush out the options.

These are the pups under reveiw so far:
Seymour Duncan - Vintage Rails (bridge model)
GFS Lil killer (10k model)

 

[clocker]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

Holy smokes! Nada? Was it my good looks? ;^)

 

[Despair]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

The straight goods, for the impatient:
What single coil pick up should I add between a Seymour Duncan SH-6 and TB-6 on an alder body Ibanez RG220B to compliment those pickups?

Is that an SH-6n, or a bridge model? Not that there's anything wrong with bridge models in neck, that can be a great setup for neck pickup soloing.

After too many hours scouring the Net, I conclude that I just don't know enough yet to make an educated guess as to what might be the best single coil pick up to round out an H-S-H setup like I'm aiming for. The options are many, but my experience is too limited. Please help me flush out the options.

These are the pups under reveiw so far:
Seymour Duncan - Vintage Rails (bridge model)
GFS Lil killer (10k model)

Any idea what kind of single coil tone you want? Do you prefer hum-cancelling? Are you aiming to get classic strat sounds, or do you want it to balance well in volume against the full humbuckers? An STK-2 Hot Stack is a pretty awesome high output pickup. Or you could try an STK-6 Custom Stack Plus or STK-S7 Vintage Hot Stack Plus.

Since you are routing it, you might look at the PA-STK1N.

Another thought is that you could use 5-way switching with two humbuckers, PRS does a lot of that. Typically use the extra positions for coil splits (both inner coils tends to be vaguely stratty, both outer coils more like a tele), or with the pickups wired in parallel instead of series.

What arrangement you pick depends a lot on what you want out of it, any artists whose tone you are interested in? Also, information on the amp or what electric tones you like would help. (If it's a practice amp, you may not want to build your guitar around it.)

 

[Gingrel]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

I would have thought Vintage Rails would get a bit drowned out by the DD, unless you're doing auto-splits in the 2 and 4 positions

 

[Diocletian]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

Depends what you want to use the middle for.
Are you going to use the bridge and neck for higher gain stuff, and the middle for cleaner sections of music? If so, the Vintage Rails would likely work well. I have an SSL-1 in between a JB and Hot Rails in a guitar and love it.

 

[clocker]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

I'll check out the recommendations. Thanks.

If I get any technical data to support one choice over the other I'll report back.

 

[clocker]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

Got this note this evening. These guys have got it together in the customer support department.

I recommend the stk-s6. First off this pickup will be humcanceling
when used with the other pickups and by itself. It has great strat tone
with a little more beef and the output will be a good match with the
duncan distortions.


Brandon Ficquette
Artist Relations/Sales/Tech Support
Seymour Duncan/Basslines/D-TAR
5427 Hollister Ave, Santa Barbara, CA 93111-2345
www.seymourduncan.com

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/../

 

[Despair]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

For mixing with non-split distortions, and having a reasonably even volume between the individual pickups, that'll work great.

If you want a more stratty 2 & 4 position with split humbuckers, that isn't likely to quack like the real thing. But the middle coil will be more usable by itself. The downside of a lower output middle coil is that the 2-4 positions aren't usable on the same channel as the humbuckers by themselves.

Neither option is bad, question is which is to your tastes.

But I'd suggest trying 5-way wiring with the 2 humbuckers first. That may give you more usable options from your current pickups, with no need for the extras. And give you an idea of what the volume balance would be like with a single coil, since a split high output pickup reasonably approximates a single coil for output, though frequency response & attack are different.

May save you some pain routing, if it turns out you don't like wild volume differences. Or may lead you to wanting a lower output middle, if you don't mind volume imbalance on those positions.

I have an Ibanez RG570, so have thought about it a lot. I've never gotten around to replacing the middle & neck pickups. I can't decide whether I want the middle to balance, or to go for the quack...

 

[Diocletian]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

The downside of a lower output middle coil is that the 2-4 positions aren't usable on the same channel as the humbuckers by themselves.

How so?

 

[clocker]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

For mixing with non-split distortions, and having a reasonably even volume between the individual pickups, that'll work great.

If you want a more stratty 2 & 4 position with split humbuckers, that isn't likely to quack like the real thing. But the middle coil will be more usable by itself. The downside of a lower output middle coil is that the 2-4 positions aren't usable on the same channel as the humbuckers by themselves.

Neither option is bad, question is which is to your tastes.

But I'd suggest trying 5-way wiring with the 2 humbuckers first. That may give you more usable options from your current pickups, with no need for the extras. And give you an idea of what the volume balance would be like with a single coil, since a split high output pickup reasonably approximates a single coil for output, though frequency response & attack are different.

May save you some pain routing, if it turns out you don't like wild volume differences. Or may lead you to wanting a lower output middle, if you don't mind volume imbalance on those positions.

I have an Ibanez RG570, so have thought about it a lot. I've never gotten around to replacing the middle & neck pickups. I can't decide whether I want the middle to balance, or to go for the quack...

Despair - I won't be able to talk knowledgeably about this project until I've lived with these types of options in the guitar for a while. Maybe not even then. : private: Likewise, if the terms of discussion are beyond my newb experience with the parameters of the problems, I'm hardly going to learn much from them. Frankly, I want it all. If that means putting in more switching options so be it. This is my first introduction to these types of variations in tone. I know nothing.

Besides the Seymour Duncan diagrams, these came my way today:

http://www.his.com/~sha3u/gear/wiring.html

http://www.guitarelectronics.com/c=...v/category/wiringresources.3_pickup_diagrams/

 

[clocker]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

How so?

I'd like to know more about this too.

 

[Despair]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

How so?

Opinions obviously vary here. I was a bit overly forceful in phrasing, should have said "aren't as usable."
Another perspective is that humbuckers aren't as usable on the same settings as a single coil. People even complain of this when switching between pickups in an all singles or all humbucker guitar, but it can be even moreso when combining them in one guitar.

Many guitarists aren't happy with a low output single coil in the same guitar as humbuckers, especially the two humbucker case (those who like both that fall into this group tend to argue for getting a guitar for each). Others don't tend to switch between their humbucker and single sounds when playing clean, or use a compressor to dodge the issue, or just don't care because they aren't playing live and can adjust the amp to do what they want. Or the quirks just don't bother them.

Hard to tell which you are without some trial and error, which is why I suggested that clocker tinker with the current pickups split before breaking out the router.

 

[Despair]

Re: Trying to match a single coil type to SH-6/TB-6

Despair - I won't be able to talk knowledgeably about this project until I've lived with these types of options in the guitar for a while. Maybe not even then. : private: Likewise, if the terms of discussion are beyond my newb experience with the parameters of the problems, I'm hardly going to learn much from them. Frankly, I want it all. If that means putting in more switching options so be it. This is my first introduction to these types of variations in tone. I know nothing.

If I've lost you anywhere, feel free to ask questions. If I'm losing you in terminology or overly ornate phrasing, I'm happy to keep trying.

http://www.his.com/~sha3u/gear/wiring.html

He doesn't seem to like combining 2 full humbuckers. A lot of people love the tones you can get with that. But they often do it in guitars that have separate volume & tone for each pickup, which lets you tweak the pickup balance.

Strat fans often feel that's too complicated, or don't want the reduced hum-cancelling in the 2 & 4 positions you get when varying volumes. Or don't want to alter their vintage instruments. Any number of counterarguments.

I have a fascination with mad scientist guitars (always been a fan of Brian May, he gets some really interesting tones with his switching options. Though if that was my guitar, I'd combine pickup phase & on/off into a single on/off/on-but-out-of-phase switch. Do more* with fewer controls, fits my aesthetic. ). So I'm certainly not opposed to the jack of all trades, just pointing out some potential pitfalls.

*More relative to strat, fewer controls compared to the Red Special.