Why are Indonesian guitars better than Chinese?

[LRS]

Having owned / owning Chinese Squier CV strat, Eastman T386 & T64/V, as well as Indonesian Squier VM Jag bass and PRS SE Paul’s Guitar, my experience is that factories in both countries are perfectly able to produce very decent instruments. Building consistency is quite good, and QC is key, the chance you pick up a lemon is small, although not zero. In the basis they all produce quite solid guitars, which can be upgraded to excellent level by changing tuners / electronics / pickups. Last week my eye fell on a P90 equiped Yamaha Revstar. MII, carbon fiber reinforced neck, stainless steel frets… for just €750,- quite interesting of you ask me!

 

[eclecticsynergy]

I think it's primarily a matter of specifications. Many Chinese guitars for export - especially the counterfeit ones - are built as cheaply as possible. Still, the Chinese factories are quite capable of turning out better quality instruments when that is specified and paid for. Some of the guitars they make for their domestic market are built to a high standard, though few of these high end Chinese guitars are making it to the US, so far.

Most of the Indonesian-made guitars for export to the US are spec'd for medium (or better) quality, to be sold at mid-level prices, under the name of known companies who have a reputation to protect. But the Indonesian factories would build them dirt cheap too, if that were specified.

 

[justFred]

My classic vibe is Indonesian!

And of course it is a fine instrument if you have kept it. My point was more along the line of “all generalizations are wrong”.

 

[PFDarkside]

And of course it is a fine instrument if you have kept it. My point was more along the line of “all generalizations are wrong”.

I know. an important thing to realize with all these import brands is that typically they are contract built out of specific factories, and when those contracts change the location of manufacturing will too. “PRS” is Paul Reed Smith contracting an Asian manufacturer to build guitars labeled “PRS” to their spec. (They aren’t like Fender who owns the Mexico factory) They were at World Music in Korea (so proud of this they put that on the headstock) but now I believe they are at some facility in Indonesia. However, I’d imagine that Paul Reed Smith will vet the quality before they allow a location to go forward.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Are Cort still around? I would've thought people wouldn't be buying them after one of their employees lit himself on fire because of the way they mistreat them.

 

[Phantasmagoria]

Yeah, definitely still around, and still the largest guitar manufacturers in the world last I heard. I personally have 5 Cort's now ...and probably at least 5 other guitar's that came out of the Cort factory.
Personally I find it odd that Cort's sudden outbreak of 'labour issues' (they've been manufacturing guitars since the early 70's without issue) coincided with them starting to try to seriously promote their own brand of Cort guitar's instead of only manufacturing for other brands (as in the timing of it all)...

 

[Top-L]

I just found this list of serial number to factory conversion:
https://killerrig.com/esp-serial-num...c%20Instrument.

My Indonesian LTD guitar has a IW serial#. PT Wildwood?

 

[chadd]

The Indonesian guitars I have were made out of nice woods and routed very well and precisely. The finishes feel fragile to me, but generally nice guitars.

I don't own too many Chinese guitars. The one I do own is actually pretty good and was the photo model for the distributor and the seller. Perhaps being the first person to buy has it's advantages.

I couldn't generalize that Indonesian guitars are better than Chinese.

One thing I know for fact about Chinese manufacturing from experience hiring them is they build to exactly your specs, not one bit better and not one bit worse. They will build exactly what you contract for. So if you spec'd a high quality instrument, spec'd how the finish should be, spec'd how the routing should be, spec'd the tolerances on everything, they will build and deliver exactly that. But the tighter the tolerance, the higher the price, because they will build a bunch, and only sell you the ones that match your tolerances. And if you want to retain control, you better pay for and require delivery of the non-conforming pieces also, or they could end up on the secondary market. Chinese will do the job, but they are all about making money also. When Chinese deliver a sub-standard instrument, it's not because they are Chinese, it's because the original company didn't spec any higher quality of instrument.

When I was still working with hockey companies, several of them had issues with their Chinese factory substituting materials to save money. It was only when warranty claims shot up that the material issues were discovered. There were also issues with the factories producing "clone" products with the name brand product but subpar materials that were then distributed outside of the name brand channels. A couple companies started sending people over to oversee production in an effort to minimize the issues. I have no idea what the current practice is as I'm out of the game now.

I'm not saying that happens in the musical instrument side of things, but they really don't view intellectual property rights the same way we do.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Yeah, definitely still around, and still the largest guitar manufacturers in the world last I heard. I personally have 5 Cort's now ...and probably at least 5 other guitar's that came out of the Cort factory.
Personally I find it odd that Cort's sudden outbreak of 'labour issues' (they've been manufacturing guitars since the early 70's without issue) coincided with them starting to try to seriously promote their own brand of Cort guitar's instead of only manufacturing for other brands (as in the timing of it all)...

IDK, man. I still personally wouldn't feel comfortable buying a guitar off Cort the way it was with them. It did get pretty bad. Bad publicity and politics aside, it was people getting lit on fire. And at that point, they also coincidentally just moved out of Korea, didn't they? It would, to me, look like a move to just move out of the country that was making a big fuss about mistreating workers. JMO.

I haven't tried any of the current Indonesian ones, but I used to have a MIK Cort-made Ibanez S570 which was nothing to write home about, TBH. I mean, it wasn't terrible, but my World-made LTD's and Ibanez SZ320 from that same era I felt were much better. What I do remember from that guitar is that the Ibanez logo was painted over the clear coat, so as soon as I tried to polish it, it started coming off, LOL.

What they're doing with the PRS SE stuff does *look* to be top notch, though. Never actually tried one, TBH, but I've also never been impressed with any of the MIK PRS SE's i've owned.

 

[Phantasmagoria]

I don't have any MiK Cort's all mine are Indonesian/Chinese. I do know that the reason they moved out of Korea was because someone was stirring up trouble with their workforce in Korea. At the time they did claim that their wages/working conditions were on par with anything in their country and released a bunch of video's showing that they were running state of the art modern factories not dingy sweatshops as was being portrayed.

It's easy to stir up & instigate a workforce ...even to the point where the odd guy is head-fucked enough to do some crazy stuff for the "cause" and for "justice'. South Korea may be Asia but it's not really the third world. Not saying there's no way there were any issues that needed working out but you'll be hard-pressed to find completely happy workers without any gripes anywhere in the world...and trouble/dissatisfaction is easy enough for others with vested interests to stir up (read Steinbeck or Dickens to see how that works).

My Indo Cort's are all pretty sweet. Great finishes & great features for the price. The Chinese Ibanez (pretty sure it came out of the Cort factory there) I just bought is a fantastic instrument. As were both my new Indonesian Cort's. I can't say I've had the slightest issue with any Cort I've ever bought...so personally, I like them/will keep buying them.

 

[Mikelamury]

I have 2 fender flame maple top teles that are Indonesia and are great guitars in every sense. Ive never experienced a bad Indonesian guitar. I know that China makes a bunch of cheap guitars but my electromatic(mid priced) gretsch5220 is an EXCELLENT guitar. Very good build quality, good woods used, nice finish. If I had to complain about anything it would be the hardware but it's certainly not bad. Gretsch guitars are actually very good quality guitars even though most are Chinese.

 

[Aceman]

A Well Made guitar is a Well Made guitar, wherever it comes from.