Why is a PAF Pro so bright?

[Rex_Rocker]

Kind of a techincal question, and just wondering, but what makes the PAF Pro so bright and attacky?

It's slightly overwound for a neck pickup at 8.5K. Quick Google search says it has slightly more inductance than a Jazz or a '59. It has a brass baseplate. It has a slightly oversized Alnico magnet, even. Everything would point at it being beefy-ish for a neck pickup.

Except it isn't. Going off memory, it has got to be one of the brightest humbuckers I've experienced.

The only clip I made of it is in the bridge position, but I found this clip where it even makes the Jazz sound warm by comparison.

I wonder if there's a techincal reason I'm not seeing as to why it's like that?

 

[Mincer]

Well, actual PAFs are really kinda bright...so...

 

[Bowtomecha]

There are some crossovers of members here with the more nerdy of the sites so I figure one of them might chime in but until then…

https://guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/10938/why-dimarzio-paf-brighter-jazz

It actually is about the paf pro

 

[Rex_Rocker]

There are some crossovers of members here with the more nerdy of the sites so I figure one of them might chime in but until then…

https://guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/10938/why-dimarzio-paf-brighter-jazz

It actually is about the paf pro

So what I gather from that thread is that it was actually only brighter on that particular clip. That it's not really brighter than the Jazz.

Won't argue with that, since someone actually posted clips. I suppose I need to try the 'Pro again at some point. I've never AB'd with a Jazz directly.

But I still feel that it's really bright for what it is? I don't mean to say the point of this thread is that it's brighter than the Jazz, but rather, that it's pretty bright without being compared to anything specific. I just happened to have found that clip.

 

[Bowtomecha]

I remember it being fairly bright but not as bright as say a pearly gates bridge. It has a bit of heft to it to my ears so it’s more like how a presence control brightens.

 

[freefrog]

So what I gather from that thread is that it was actually only brighter on that particular clip. That it's not really brighter than the Jazz.

Won't argue with that, since someone actually posted clips. I suppose I need to try the 'Pro again at some point. I've never AB'd with a Jazz directly.

But I still feel that it's really bright for what it is? I don't mean to say the point of this thread is that it's brighter than the Jazz, but rather, that it's pretty bright without being compared to anything specific. I just happened to have found that clip.

I've no experience with the PAF Pro. I don't know how DiMarzio builds it.

What the experimental results in my archives suggest is that a difference of resonant peaks between coils in a humbucker makes it behave like a double tuned filter, with a comb filtering effect on harmonics.

I've shared a 5spice sim recently about that. I think it was in one of your topics.

There's a "reminiscence" of different resonant peaks for both coils in the screenshots shared by MS on guitarnutz2. See the post 14, "response of a pickup PAF Pro", red curve named "amplitude": there's a subtle stairstep beyond the main resonant peak.

In my understanding, the reason why this stairstep is subtle in this post 14 is how the resonance has been measured: with an air coil perpendicular to coils and between them. If one measures the resonance of each coil with the air coil just above and parallel to the surface of the pickup (as are strings), obvious differences can appear, translating how each coil deals with high frequencies, at a different place under strings...

I consider as impossible to predict how this comb filtering due to electrical specs works with the other harmonic comb filtering due to the location of pickups and that Tillman has modelized.

I'm pretty sure that guitarnutz2 would discard what I'm trying to explain by saying that secondary peaks are tonally negligible.

But I've concretely dealt with unpleasing harmonics due to secondary resonant peaks : I had once to correct a design of humbucker because its specific double tuned response was causing an ear piercing drone effect around 11khz. I don't see why such a thing couldn't happen with a PAF Pro.

FWIW.

 

[Anficht]

You know what, I don't like the PAF Pro.
In the neck it is too hot and has a muddy bass, especially the wound strings.
In the bridge it is bright and kinda uninspiringly neutral sounding plus a tad underpowered with other pickups doing much better than the PRO, e.g. the Norton, Mo Joe or even the FRED

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I consider as impossible to predict how this comb filtering due to electrical specs works with the other harmonic comb filtering due to the location of pickups and that Tillman has modelized.

I'm pretty sure that guitarnutz2 would discard what I'm trying to explain by saying that secondary peaks are tonally negligible.

But I've concretely dealt with unpleasing harmonics due to secondary resonant peaks : I had once to correct a design of humbucker because its specific double tuned response was causing an ear piercing drone effect around 11khz. I don't see why such a thing couldn't happen with a PAF Pro.

FWIW.

So it could be that secondary resonant peak, then?

I mean, in their clips they posted in that thread, it sounded fine... but the clip was very straightforward and simple. I wonder if overdrive would bring that harshness I think of out a bit more..

 

[Juanhanglo]

PAF Joe > PAF PRO

 

[Chistopher]

PAF Joe is the PAF Pro / Mojoe hybrid right?

 

[Rex_Rocker]

PAF Joe is the PAF Pro / Mojoe hybrid right?

Nah, PAF Joe is an underwound PAF Pro with the Virtual Vintage thing.

 

[Aceman]

Mids, son. It's the mids.

And I've used it in the bridge and the neck.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I've used in in the bridge and neck too. I don't find it too bright in the bridge, but I suppose it's because I expect (and like) my bridge pickup to be bright and attacky. I do find it too bright and attacky in the neck, tho. I'm even starting to suspect that I may have wired it in parallel by accident or something because everyone says it's hot and has muddy bass, and that was not my experience at all?