wiring advice requested

[vinnie1971]

Re: wiring advice requested

I'm taking everything apart. It's above my pay grade. I've spent a small fortune on this project, have more parts on order, and the more I work on it, the bigger mess I make and the worse things get. I'm giving up.
Thanks for all your help Vinnie.

Herby!!!!

I wish I did this from the start for you.

I’ve redrawn the diagram as if wiring up from under the pickguard and routed the wires and connections to be easier to wire up and easier to follow.
I’ve also used the CTS pots and got them the correct way up for wiring.

Part one:

Lay out the volume and tone controls to set up the PTB. Tone 1 can be 250k or 500k.
Your choice of audio or linear. I prefer 250k audio.
Volume can be 250k or 500k. Your choice for audio or linear. I prefer 500k linear.

Tone 2 - must be audio, either 500k or 1meg. I am switching to 1 meg.

Then wire up the super switch

Part 2:
Add the middle pickup function on tone 1
Add the series parallel function on tone 2
Connect the pickup wires

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[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

WOW!!!
You went to a lot of trouble for me... the least I can do is use your template and try one more time.
That's laid out beautifully. Thank you very much... I hope I don't screw this up again :thanks:

[edit]
Are there 4 RED wires going to the middle post on the bottom tone pot?
The top tone pot isn't case grounded. Is this correct?
I'm not sure about the tone pots. They look like they're wired backwards?

 

[vinnie1971]

wiring advice requested

WOW!!!
You went to a lot of trouble for me... the least I can do is use your template and try one more time.
That's laid out beautifully. Thank you very much... I hope I don't screw this up again :thanks:

[edit]
Are there 4 RED wires going to the middle post on the bottom tone pot?
The top tone pot isn't case grounded. Is this correct?
I'm not sure about the tone pots. They look like they're wired backwards?

4 connections to the middle lug of the tone 1 pot - this is a master tone pot.

The top tone pot ( tone 2) is not grounded - that’s the bass cut. When fully clockwise that’s maximum bass cut via the bass cut cap. The hot signal is going through that cap.

Basically the hot path goes through the volume pot as normal and takes a detour to the bass cut pot first. Then it goes to the middle lug of tone 1 which distributes the hot signal to the 5 way superswitch, the middle position push pull selector, and gives power to the series / parallel push pull, for the down position, so when down everything is just parallel.

The bass cut is wired backwards because it’s normal audio taper. If not wired backwards at 7 it’s an on off switch but if wire in reverse it’s nice smooth bass cut control that uses the full sweep.
If you want to cut bass counter clockwise need reverse audio taper.




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[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

The tone pots look like they're wired opposite of what I've been doing. In my drawings I've been running the cap to the opposite side terminal. (looking at your drawing, the cap would be wired to the lug on the other side of the pot). Does this matter?

 

[vinnie1971]

wiring advice requested

The tone pots look like they're wired opposite of what I've been doing. In my drawings I've been running the cap to the opposite side terminal. (looking at your drawing, the cap would be wired to the lug on the other side of the pot). Does this matter?

As long as these push pulls work the same as regular CTS pots then it I’ll work. If they are the other way round then you’ll need to swap.

I’ve done the diagram with the bottoms up, so it’s just like looking at the pickguard from underneath.

If these CTS push pulls are the reverse taper to standard CTS push pulls then you’ll need to switch them over.

If you are not sure, ( as I’m not sure because I’ve never used them - I just followed Stew - Mac instructions for the push pull connections, there’s no guidance on the pot wiper action) then just wire it up and see, it’ll be easy to switch the tone pots over.



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[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

OK. Would you please look this over and tell me if I have everything correct? I'm going to print out and do in stages like you have above. I just want to make sure I understand completely what's going on before I start messing everything up again. I figure if I can transpose it to paper correctly then I can transpose it to guitar.

I've put this to a link for download so you can have a bigger pic to look at:

http://www.mediafire.com/view/v1i7sq6a4t6jm3n/SC-Strat-Series-Paralel-super-switch.jpg/file

 

[vinnie1971]

wiring advice requested

OK. Would you please look this over and tell me if I have everything correct? I'm going to print out and do in stages like you have above. I just want to make sure I understand completely what's going on before I start messing everything up again. I figure if I can transpose it to paper correctly then I can transpose it to guitar.

I've put this to a link for download so you can have a bigger pic to look at:

http://www.mediafire.com/view/v1i7sq6a4t6jm3n/SC-Strat-Series-Paralel-super-switch.jpg/file

Good job you made me recheck
I missed a ground wire and routed one incorrectly- fried my brain transposing it for CTS pots. Apart from that it looks good

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[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

The .0015 caps came in yesterday. My 500K push/pull pot gets here Friday.

[edit]
I found a missing wire and also a misplaced wire on my diagram. This stuff makes me nervous. If I can't get it right in Photoshop then I probably can't get it right in the guitar. Why is it so easy to screw up? Shesh...
Push/pull switch on bass cut pot: 2 moved to 3. Wire added from 2 to A4 on super switch.

 

[vinnie1971]

wiring advice requested

The .0015 caps came in yesterday. My 500K push/pull pot gets here Friday.

[edit]
I found a missing wire and also a misplaced wire on my diagram. This stuff makes me nervous. If I can't get it right in Photoshop then I probably can't get it right in the guitar. Why is it so easy to screw up? Shesh...
Push/pull switch on bass cut pot: 2 moved to 3. Wire added from 2 to A4 on super switch.

I redid mine with fresh components- new push push pots, switch and 1 meg with tiny poly-Mylar film 0.0022uF cap for bass cut, which works much better than 250k pot.

The bass cut cap is so small you can’t see it in the photo! It’s the type I use for baritones.

But as I did it, I still managed to get 2 wires mixed up!!!

Plus I had a dry joint. This push back vintage wire is hard going on a superswitch! On the yellow bank in my diagram I had to use single core insulated wire. There’s no way 3 wires were going in one terminal.

Plus I moved 2 wires from middle lug of tone 2 for ease of soldering.

All works great though.

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[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

Heh. I've also been using bare wire for grounds between pots. The CTS pots are full size and the switch case is plastic. To wire to the pot you have to solder caps and grounds to the side of the pot. Too big a solder joint the pot won't clear the cavity sides... any way, I've desoldered everything except the small bare jumpers between the two adjacent tabs on the super switch. I'm color coding everything this time to make it easier to trace wires. Not much room in here at all. You've got a lot more room in yours. I may rethink my choice of pots next time...

 

[vinnie1971]

Re: wiring advice requested

Heh. I've also been using bare wire for grounds between pots. The CTS pots are full size and the switch case is plastic. To wire to the pot you have to solder caps and grounds to the side of the pot. Too big a solder joint the pot won't clear the cavity sides... any way, I've desoldered everything except the small bare jumpers between the two adjacent tabs on the super switch. I'm color coding everything this time to make it easier to trace wires. Not much room in here at all. You've got a lot more room in yours. I may rethink my choice of pots next time...

Those CTS pots look like they’re going to be really tight for soldering - I struggled with this!


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[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

The first was awful because I wired all the switches first and then wired the pots. It was a real struggle. The second time was even tighter because I was moving wires from one place to another. That's why this time I'm starting over. I just hope I don't make any mistakes. You're absolutely sure the last template you made is accurate? Sorry but I'm paranoid.

 

[vinnie1971]

wiring advice requested

The first was awful because I wired all the switches first and then wired the pots. It was a real struggle. The second time was even tighter because I was moving wires from one place to another. That's why this time I'm starting over. I just hope I don't make any mistakes. You're absolutely sure the last template you made is accurate? Sorry but I'm paranoid.

Rechecked and this is what I used


EDIT.....

No that diagram had 2 wires mixed up. In the end it was this that I used:

Just be careful in that tight space. Dry joints are hard to spot - the joint can look good but the multi meter says no continuity.

I re-fluxed, that didn’t work so de-soldered And resoldered and it was fine.

I check things look right on the multi meter, then put the pickguard back but don’t screw anything down while I do the the screwdriver check ( even to check volume and tone controls ) and only when it all passes do I reassemble.

Edit;:

But sometimes a dry joint can pass the above tests, and when you put it all back and screw it down it’s enough to disturb the dry joint and cause it to fail [emoji20]


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[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

My 500K push/pull pot showed up today. I hope it works OK. I couldn't find a CTS push/pull in a 1meg. Anyway, I'm starting the rewire tomorrow

 

[Mincer]

Re: wiring advice requested

My 500K push/pull pot showed up today. I hope it works OK. I couldn't find a CTS push/pull in a 1meg. Anyway, I'm starting the rewire tomorrow

Let us know how this turns out!

 

[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

Vinnie. I see a small discrepancy in the last 2 templates you posted.

First template (CTS push/pull): Tone 2

pot C2 going to 5 way yellow pin 5.
Yellow C going to ground.

Last template (standard push/pull): Tone 2

pot C2 going to 5 way yellow C.
Yellow pin 5 going to ground.

Which template is correct?

 

[vinnie1971]

wiring advice requested

Vinnie. I see a small discrepancy in the last 2 templates you posted.

First template (CTS push/pull): Tone 2

pot C2 going to 5 way yellow pin 5.
Yellow C going to ground.

Last template (standard push/pull): Tone 2

pot C2 going to 5 way yellow C.
Yellow pin 5 going to ground.

Which template is correct?

Good spot

This one I got the ground wire wrong when transposing earlier.

It messes with my mind transposing for CTS pots that I made a schoolboy error on the other one.

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[Herby]

Re: wiring advice requested

Vinnie. I don't mean to sound ungrateful because I am extremely grateful for all your help but every template you put up is different from any other and I'm getting so confused I can't move. There's more than 2 wires difference between the below diagram and the transposed diagram above. The pickup black wires for neck and bridge are going to different locations and I'm not sure if it makes a difference. I've tried tracing all the connections to understand what's happening but it's complex and confusing. I think it's the same thing but I'm not sure. Was this done to relieve the crowded terminal at C2 on tone 2 switch? There are other differences also but I can't tell if they have the same end result. I'm a noob at anything but basic guitar wiring.

I'm used to the pot switches and how they work. I'm even understanding the super switch a little better now. It's the different workable routings of 'all' the switches and pickups that still gives me fits. I've had 2 failed attempts. This one has to work.

Is this 'below' the correct final version? The above version and the below version are quite a bit different but they may give the same results. I'm not sure.

 

[vinnie1971]

Re: wiring advice requested

Vinnie. I don't mean to sound ungrateful because I am extremely grateful for all your help but every template you put up is different from any other and I'm getting so confused I can't move. There's more than 2 wires difference between the below diagram and the transposed diagram above. The pickup black wires for neck and bridge are going to different locations and I'm not sure if it makes a difference. I've tried tracing all the connections to understand what's happening but it's complex and confusing. I think it's the same thing but I'm not sure. Was this done to relieve the crowded terminal at C2 on tone 2 switch? There are other differences also but I can't tell if they have the same end result. I'm a noob at anything but basic guitar wiring.

I'm used to the pot switches and how they work. I'm even understanding the super switch a little better now. It's the different workable routings of 'all' the switches and pickups that still gives me fits. I've had 2 failed attempts. This one has to work.

Is this 'below' the correct final version? The above version and the below version are quite a bit different but they may give the same results. I'm not sure.

Hi Herby

Yes,it’s electrically identical - I revised the diagram because as I looked at it, things were getting very crowded indeed, and the push push pots I’m using are very unforgiving of push back wire.

Apart from the one wire mistake where I get 2 wires confused, the diagrams are all electrically the same. It’s gone through a few minor revisions to avoid cramming too many wires into one terminal. So my tone 1 middle lug could not support 4 wires and the 3 wires going into the tone 1 push push middle terminal I split out so the bridge and middle ground wires go to the yellow (4th) bank terminals 1 and 2 instead but the last diagram has them on the middle lug still.

If I’d had the foresight,I’d have taken photos of each stage of the wiring so you could follow it.


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[vinnie1971]

wiring advice requested

So this diagram here will work but if, like me, you’re finding it’s crowded you may need to revise the 4 wires going into the middle lug of tone 1.

This diagram does split out trying to cram 3 wires into the tone 2 push pull common terminal. That was the most significant problem I faced when wiring it and gave me headaches re-planning it. But the diagram below cures that.

But the diagram below also assumes nice big lugs on the pot just like regular CTS pots, if they do the 4 wires in the middle lug of tone 1 won’t give you the same problem I had with my Alpha push push pots. It can take 2 easily but 3 with push back cloth - i couldn’t get a decent join so I moved the wires to pickup hot without cramming.... and 4 ? No chance ! I know CTS regular pots can take it as previously I’ve hooked all my ground leads to the ground lug of a volume pot before which gives a really good connection over the back of the pot.

So this is the diagram to follow. It’s got the mixed up wires corrected from the yellow bank.

It shows all the grounds going to the volume pot as I didn’t know if you can safely ground to the body of the pot on the CTS push pulls with all that plastic.

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