You know what I'd like to see

[beandip]

Companies and independent luthiers alike going back to the zero fret. I know a few out there do it (gretsch, john mayes) but still it just makes so much sense to me to have it, and not at the same time.

Pros:
Theoretically your open string tone would the be same as fretted
Nut is now merely a string guide, no need to worry about binding
It looks ****in' cool

Cons:
Much more skilled tech needed to adjust action (not everyone can properly crown a fret ya know)
If you go too low, you're screwed
No ability to experiment with different material for different tones
Isn't "vintage correct"

If I had my way, ALL guitars would have a zero fret. This would eliminate bad nutwork entirely, and most guys I know are too chicken**** to try and mess with frets, zero or not.

Discuss.



OT: My spell check underlined ****in' with correct punctuation but not chicken****. Guess he's telling me I need to enunciate.

 

[projectx1106]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

How about the intonation?

 

[beandip]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

How about the intonation?

Same as a standard nut.

 

[Empty Pockets]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

Zero fret sounds like a modern way to say 'no worries'.

 

[jhale667]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

Not a fan of zero frets...none for me, thanks...

 

[Peter Crossley]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

Hi Bean,
I used to see the zero fret a lot about 30 years ago. Then it all dissapeared.

I used to see it a lot on European guitars, such as Framus and Eston. I think Hofner had a zero fret on one or more of their guitars as well.

Intonation should be fine, a lot of guys like to use the compensated nuts.
these are great for open chords up to the 3rd fret. they do make a C chord sound very lush. of course as soon as you play barre chords then all bets are off for the value or otherwise of a compensated nut. You wouldnt be able to compensate a fret very well!! but I use straight cut nuts anyway. same deal.

I actually like cutting nuts, weird huh? I like the way I can micro adjust the action of the first seven frets by nut slot depth.

 

[scottish]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

I like the way open strings ring out, especially as a drone note, so id say no to zero frets.

 

[beandip]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

I've seen plenty of 'em due to my affinity for cheap vintage ladder braced guitars. Old Stellas, Harmonies, Silvertones and others. All had models with zero frets. I have two guitars with zero frets right now, one a 40's Harmony ladder braced parlor, and the other is my 70's Sekova.

I guess I should say that while I don't want to see every single guitar out there with a zero fret, I would like to see them used more often. I think they have a genuine purpose, and can do the job much better than cheap ass injection molded plastic that comes on almost everything these days.

 

[DazH]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

frets wear too quickly, a zero fret would be too much maintenance for most people - the open strings would buzz before all the others got pits/dents in them because it's taking all the force.

 

[beandip]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

frets wear too quickly, a zero fret would be too much maintenance for most people - the open strings would buzz before all the others got pits/dents in them because it's taking all the force.

I've owned guitars from the 30s and 40's with zero frets and HEAVY wear, I've never noticed any wear on the zero fret. In theory, I guess it could happen but I've never seen it. Like I said, I see it posing a problem in a lot of areas, but I'd still like to see it used more often. I'm not saying everyone should have one, but it'd be nice to spot one here and there.

 

[KeeperOS]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

^ Stainless Steel Zero Fret

Oh, and IIRC Vigier uses it

 

[beandip]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

^ Stainless Steel Zero Fret

Oh, and IIRC Vigier uses it

That'd kill fears of zero fret wear, but it would also alter the tone from the open string and a fretted string. That's one of the main reasons I like 'em....then again it's all in theory cause I can't hear the difference.

 

[Ashurbanipal]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

Yea, Vigier use a hardened zero fret to make it more durable. Didn't Burns put the zero fret on some of their guitars too?

Perhaps the most famous guitar with a zero fret is the Red Special. It had its zero fret replaced about 4-5 years ago because it was worn out - do the math: this guitar was played non stop (studio and gig) for over 40 years, that's not a bad run! Mind you, the original frets are still on the guitar, and they're pretty worn by now!

The interesting thing about the zero fret on it was that BM and his father shaped it a bit differently when they made the guitar so it played in better tune with itself, making it a bit like the Buzz Feiten system. They discovered this when they replaced the original fret - the new one wasn't quite right as the guitar's intonation was off, so they took it out, made another with a different leading edge and it solved the problem.

 

[beandip]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

I knew I wasn't blowing smoke out of my ass. Brian May has a zero fret. BRIAN ****ING MAY. The guy has a PhD or masters or some **** in astrophysics. He's got some genius going on, and he using a zero fret.

 

[mrturtle_91]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

My acoustic and my Gretsch BST have zero frets. I'm pretty indifferent, doesn't matter if I have one or not.

 

[JerL91]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

It seems like I remember seeing a company that sold a flat fret that you slid in front of the nut and glued down for the same effect. I can't remember who it was though or where I saw it, anyone else ever seen this?

 

[beandip]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

It seems like I remember seeing a company that sold a flat fret that you slid in front of the nut and glued down for the same effect. I can't remember who it was though or where I saw it, anyone else ever seen this?

No, and I don't see this working very well either. Seems as though it would cause serious intonation issues.

 

[Ashurbanipal]

Re: You know what I'd like to see

I knew I wasn't blowing smoke out of my ass. Brian May has a zero fret. BRIAN ****ING MAY. The guy has a PhD or masters or some **** in astrophysics. He's got some genius going on, and he using a zero fret.

Haha! Yes, he got his PhD in astrophysics quite recently - he was working on it in the 70s but when the band took off he shelved it.

Of course, the RS was built in 1963-64, but BM and father definitely had some genius going on: knife edge trem, roller bridge, humbucking/single coil switching, resonance chambers, oh yea, and the zero fret. Clearly, BM and father made it so that it made the guitar intonate better and add slinkiness to the action, so it seems they were in the know.

One other effect of the zero fret is that when you bend the strings, you can sometimes get some scraping across it. Doesn't come through the amp though. This is a characteristic of the RS because of the light strings (9s) and 24" scale. I imagine it was more noticeable in the old days when BM used 8s. Fwiw, a BMG standard I played some time ago in the shop that didn't exhibit any scraping. I suppose it depends on setup and guitar type.

Can verify that the Elite Custom and Custom series Burns use a zero fret - replicas of the axes played by Hank Marvin and Bruce Welch.