A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

[Gearjoneser]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

I also think it was probably a smart business move on Reinhold's part to not make it an EL34 amp. In the grand scheme of his business, he probably wants people to gravitate to the CS, and an EL34 Chinese Bogner might take away from that.

That's probably the case. I'm wondering how Soldano still sells amps when they're advertising the Jet City amps as having an SLO circuit...or whatever.

So far, the Alchemist amps and Line 6 Bogners aren't stepping on Bogner's Custom Shop's toes. They're all specifically different.

Soldano didn't do that. They put out Chinese amps that are practically import versions of the Hot Rod 100, HR 50, and Astroverb.

[Mr 9finger]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

That's probably the case. I'm wondering how Soldano still sells amps when they're advertising the Jet City amps as having an SLO circuit...or whatever.

So far, the Alchemist amps and Line 6 Bogners aren't stepping on Bogner's Custom Shop's toes. They're all specifically different.

Soldano didn't do that. They put out Chinese amps that are practically import versions of the Hot Rod 100, HR 50, and Astroverb.

I got to wondering about the Soldano/Jet City imports to. The only logical conclusion I could come up with was maybe Soldano's business hasn't been doing so hot and needed a new revenue stream to keep him going. There's just not any big names out there flashing the Soldano name around anymore. Sure, old timers and forumites now about the legendary amps he's put out, but all the new comers out there don't. So in that situation, licensing his circuit designs was a win/win. He has another stream of revenue and a new form of advertising. Now he has his name on killer amps at beginner prices, and it's probably generating some interest in his high end amps drawing in new customers that way.

I'm betting it's kind of like the Rivera thing. 5 years ago, if you asked a younger guitar player about Rivera amps they would have looked at you like you're stupid. Now that Jim Root and Mick Thompson of Slipknot have custom Knuckleheads, a lot more young players know about Rivera amps and they made a bit of a comeback.

[Zerberus]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

Zerb, do you still use Seymour Duncan products? As far as I know, they're making their pedals in China. Where do you draw the line? Seriously, I'm intrigued.

I have not purchased a new Duncan product since the introduction of the Pickup Booster. Exclusively used.

*edit* Come to think of it, I DID purchase from the original Brobucker run.... oh well, pobody´s nerfect.

[Zerberus]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

Zerb, i bet half the stuff in your house and most of the things you use day-to-day were built in China.

Yes, there are many things in my life that I have zero influence on.

That said, ALL of my steel tools are hand forged in germany, France, Italy or the USA, all of my power tools are older than I am and of similar origin, my clothes including underwear are USA, mexican, thai, or Italian origin...

The only thing more or less guaranteed chinese in my life are electronic components, the finished products however are taiwanese, korean or japanese. When one however considers that the only electronics I own are a korean cell phone and the PC I´m typing this from (which I built myself using Taiwanese finished goods), I´d say that´s a pretty good track record.....

There's no point in avoiding it, ...

Are you trying to say it senseless to attempt changes you CAN make because of things you can´t change? Analogous to saying it´s senseless to work out because you´ll never be as big and strong as someone a foot taller so what´s the point? Or when your parachute fails there´s no point in even pulling the reserve because it was probably packed by the same person?

esspecially because we (the west) also have dodgy morals and politics. Before we point our fingers, let's make sure our hands are clean.

The morals of politicians and big business are not morals I share, and to be honest I find the insinuation of the contrary quite insulting. But I know what you´re getting at. The difference is that I actively strive for change instead of simply turning my brain off and assuming I can´t change anything, anyway, which is the easy copout for the sheeple who´s greed helped cause this problem in the first place. However, Not doing anything is guaranteed not to change anything. So while everybody else *****es and moans, then turns around and buys a new chinese noname cell phone that outright rips off the new Samsung galaxy and is illegal to sell in numerous countries, I *****, moan, and keep my money until I can afford a morally sounder alternative.

At least I can die tomorrow knowing I did what I could instead of only always seeing my own personal benefit in every move I make. If some godlike entity does actually exist and wants to eternally punish me for trying my best to do what will further our race and society more, then they can go **** themselves.

And if nothing else, when the entiore financial system collapses and the western world realizes they´ve been undergoing a hostile takeover fo r 50 years, I can at least wash my hands of most if not all fault and say "I ****ing told you so, multiple times."

[Red_Label]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

And if nothing else, when the entiore financial system collapses and the western world realizes they´ve been undergoing a hostile takeover fo r 50 years, I can at least wash my hands of most if not all fault and say "I ****ing told you so, multiple times."

LOL... "this is GOLD Jerry! Gold!"

Enjoy running around telling people "I told you so" after the apocalypse. I'm sure it'll be fun for all.

As to the fact that you were thinking about saving for an XTC but had never heard about the Spider Valve and Alchemist lines that Reinhold has been involved in for years...

[Zerberus]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

^^ not everybody spends 24 /7 on the internet informing themselves about products that generally have no bearing on them, especially during prolonged hard times when we knew we couldn´t afford them anyway

Conversely, you probably couldn´t tell me what the going rate for guitar repairs and custom build work in my area is.

[JeffB]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

That's probably the case. I'm wondering how Soldano still sells amps when they're advertising the Jet City amps as having an SLO circuit...or whatever..

Because there is so little competition in that price range (for the type of amp JC is building), and nowadays WAYYYY too much competition in the Soldano price range.

After Clapton "broke" Soldano in the late 80s, he sold the high end amps like nobodies business. And then of course the vintage retro and booteek market started to really take off. Nowadays, you can choose from hundreds of amps in that price range from dozens of manufacturers.

With the world economy the way it is, he probably makes more money selling 10 JC amps than he does one SLO. And he likely sells hundreds of JC amps for every SLO. His lower priced USA stuff like the Astro and whatnot just did not seem to go over that well, and I suspect his profit margin was very low, and some of those amps were sold at a loss.

[devastone]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

I´m not bent out of shape in any way. I don´t react adversely to acquiring previously unheld knowledge, beleive it or not I actually STRIVE for it because it makes me more versatile and a better rounded person in general.

Sorry dude, my post was kinda tongue in cheek, I totally respect your views and opinions. No worries.

[Zerberus]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

...
The line 'but before you start pointing fingers... make sure you hands are clean' is a quote i heard, and i just mean that i think it's absurd to make judgements about the Chinese government when you're own government and the governments you are willing to buy from are also evil and corrupt.

Interesting point but unfortunately the wrong media for the discussion, as delving deeper into it would practically necessitate the opening of Le Can dú Wörm that is Politics... but you´re definitely on to something. Essentially the question changes from "Where do you draw the line " to "Is it even realistically possible to draw a line without effectively betraying one´s own values of justice and equality in the process". Definitely food for thought, as I hadn´t really looked at it from that perspective...

I buy from anywhere because i know this whole world is full of **** and all people from all races are just as evil as one another.

VEERY good point....

[devastone]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

[sarcasm]My car uses petroleum products, what does anything else matter[/sarcasm]

[misterwhizzy]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

I buy from anywhere because i know this whole world is full of **** and all people from all races are just as evil as one another.

I couldn't disagree with you more here. This is a TOTAL cop-out. Have you ever come across a company that treated you well? Maybe Seymour Duncan? You buy from people like that.

Your explanation smacks of rationalization. "I want cheap stuff, and here's a reason I can use to make myself feel okay about it." I'm not saying I necessarily disagree with you, but I think you're diverting.

[Zerberus]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

^^ I think he meant it pertaining to the question of locale of manufacture, not necessarily company ethics... At least that´s how I took it....

But on that note, I don´t purchase Nike or Sony products (among others) either

[GuitarDoc]

Re: A couple 50watt Bogners I'd like to see!

I buy whatever I want/can afford. Because it's all about me. That's the American way.

(We certainly want to support the American way, right?!).

Actually, Zerb, I know what you're saying and admire your ethics. I also agree that there is perhaps more corruption in our own government than what exists in the majority of the rest of the world. Our current "leadership" (if you can call it that) makes the mafia of the 20's look like the Vienna boys choir.

I have an Alchemist which I absolutely love. Great tone, versatility, wonderful warm reverb, great echo effects, perfect power range (40 watts), and a very reasonable price (got mine new for less than $700). It overheats, but a couple $15 fans cured that problem (and looks very cool since they have blue LEDs lighting them up).

Another way to look at it........every time you buy Chinese products, you're sticking it to them and benefitting us. We get the benefit of their technology for less than we'd have to pay for American products (allowing us to save more of our money for even more purchasing power), and we're making those little ******** work for peanuts.

(just kidding).