New to the forum...

[Ozone]

....and desperately need some help with my tone!
So, basically I'm really not happy with the tones I'm getting from my gear and it's driving me insane

My main guitar is a MIJ Charvel w/ a JB + 59 combo. I absolutely love it to bits. Love the tone acoustically, love the sustain(thanks to FloydUpgrades' big block and tremstopper), love the feel and the comfortable neck. So I don't think that's the problem.

My amp's a Laney VH100R. It's loaded with Svetlana EL34's, I have no idea what the preamp tubes are, cause the previous owner had the amp retubed and I've never even checked to see what they are. But I do know that the tubes are about a year old. I've had mixed emotions about this amp.. Some days it sounds pretty good, but usually it doesn't... I feel like Im fighting the amp to get a decent tone.. I don't know if anybody's familiar with this amp but I usually crank the gain but I don't touch the drive except for solos and such(the Laney has a Gain control and a Drive control. Cranking the gain doesn't equal huge amounts of distortion. So I don't think too much gain is the problem here..). I boost the mids(I set it to anywhere from 6-8) and set the treble to about 5-6, the bass at 3 and the presence at 6. The biggest problem is the lack of sustain, the harshness and the overall muddiness... I've got the amp hooked up to a 2x12 cab w/ Vintage 30's. I think one thing that would help is to get a cab w/Greenbacks or something similar. What do you think? Also I might be overdoing the mids by having the mids up on the amp AND using V30's.

I've tried sticking a Graphic EQ in the loop, and using a clean boost to get some sustain. I just bought a TS9 from a guy on eBay, and it should be here soon.. Maybe that'll help? The only way I can get a decent tone is by cranking the volume, and I mean REALLY cranking it... And that's really not possible to do at club gigs etc without an attenuator. I've also been thinking about swapping the magnet in the JB for an RCA5. Would that help me?

I really dig the tones of players like DeMartini, Lynch, Gilbert, Timmons etc etc and i guess something like that is what I go for, tone-wise. And I know Gilbert used a GH100L(which is basically a single channel VH100R) for the GOOMY record and Timmons used a VH100R a while back.

I can't post any clips cause I don't have the equipment, and my amps at band reh. and that's about an hours drive away....

I know there are some serious tone beasts' in here, and I'd appreciate any help/tips.

[mwalluk]

Re: New to the forum...

It could be you need a different amp. There's a lot of idols of mine who use certain amps I wouldn't touch. You just need to find the amp that speaks to you.

[CTN]

Re: New to the forum...

Hi and welcome to the forum.

First off, you have an absolutely awesome rig. The Laney is no slouch at all, and it will be able to get you some seriously awesome tones, but it is one of those amps which needs quite a bit of tweaking. You're correct that the normal gain controls do not necessarily contribute a whole lot of gain to the sound. You really need to engage the boost on the amp though to get a good amount of saturation and sustain. Try setting the EQ controls to 5 for Bass Mid and Treble as well, and then tweak the presence. It's already a pretty middy-sounding amp, in the vein of marshalls, but not as pronounced. It can be thick and punchy but still clear and present - but putting your bass at 3 and your mids almost all the way up is not going to help you achieve that.

I think the problem is that you're overthinking it, and trying to add too many components into your signal chain to compensate for it, rather than figuring out your amp first and then tacking on things to tweak it to perfection.

The VH100R really has no problem getting great punchy shred tones if you know how to set the controls right.

That said, maybe it does need some fresh preamp or power tubes tuned to your tastes.

[GuitarDoc]

Re: New to the forum...

I would first start by turning the mids way back. Mids, especially low mids, are the main contributer to muddiness. Start with the bass at 5-6 (12 o'clock), mids at 2-3, treble at 5-7, play with the presence. Then tweak as needed. Remember, your tastes and your hearing changes throughout the day and from day to day, so be patient. Find something that sounds ok and live with it for a couple days before changing it.

I wouldn't go magnet or speaker swapping just yet. Work with what you've got first.

A good EQ pedal can work wonders (esp in the amps loop). If you want to give yours another try, I would suggest starting with all you amp's tone controls at 5 and adjust your EQ pedal to the best you can get. Then go back to your amp's tone section and adj as needed.

I think it's just a matter of spending a lot of time working with what you have (some good equipment) and dialing it in. Again, be patient.

[karpathion]

Re: New to the forum...

I'm with these other guys.
I know you hear a lot of, "don't scoop your mids," on the internet, but you have to look at what you are playing with. That Laney is already a mid heavy amp. Throw in the fact that have a 2x12 loaded with V-30's, and you have mid madness right from the start. Turn your mids to about 3-4, lows up to 5-6, and do the same with the highs. Play with the presence to hit the sweet spot, just like the other guys said.

[misterwhizzy]

Re: New to the forum...

There are two schools of thought here (at least for me). The first is to turn off your mind and turn knobs with your ears. I've put knobs in positions that should not have worked, but they did. Just listen to the adjustments you're making and keep going until it sounds good.

If you just can't get along with the feel of the amp, though, no amount of knob tweaking will fix it. If that's the case and you're convinced the amp is the problem, it may be time to figure out which way to go. That being said, though, I think your amp is a high-quality amplifier, and you should be able to dial it in well. But no amp brand is for everyone, and that model may not work for you.

If the second option is the case, I'm sure there are plenty of guys here who can help you find a model you like, although I won't claim to be one of them necessarily.

[Khriss Bliss]

Re: New to the forum...

If u turn the mids ( or all eqS) almost all the way down, maybe u can boost the master volume much higher to get a sweeter spot, gain wise, then use the preamp knobs for actual decibel volume. When your power tubes are gettin cranked or hit with a hot signal, the mids get boosted anyways.

My friend had your issues w his VoxAC100, but putting the Master vol on 8 made it lovable for him.(SHWEET! was the term he used.)

[Chickenwings]

Re: New to the forum...

LAck of sustain, lack of gain, dying volume, muddiness? It sounds absolutely like a tube issue.
High gain amps wear out preamp tubes pretty quickly. A year for power tubes under heavy usage is plenty long also. Who knows if its even biased correctly?
That, and the likely fact that the original owner pulled out his best preamp tubes and but in his oldest ones when he sold it is most likely where your problem lies.
Its always worth having a spare set of tubes for a gig, so spending money on a full new set and a rebias is money well spent either way.
Try it and get back to us.
Try EH for the pres (they are great high gain/low noise preamp tubes) and some JJs in the power section for big bottom end.
The rig you have should be screaming without any help from pedals etc. They should just be icing on the cake.

Nice guitar, nice pickups, nice amp and nice speakers should equal killer sounds. I reckon its your tubes and your bias.

[Ozone]

Re: New to the forum...

Just got back from band reh. Got there a couple hours earlier than the other guys to tweak my amp, and after 2 hours of nonstop adjusting the EQ etc I finally found a sound I was about 90% satisfied with! It was still a bit lacking in the bite department, but I guess I'll just have to tweak the settings a bit.
Yeah, It was basically a low-mid/bass thing... I found that by cutting the low mids, boosting the upper-mids a bit w/ and EQ in the loop, and setting the mids and bass on the amp at about 5ish I got some killers tones for once. Finally found that articulate, yet punchy sound I was after. And I didn't even have to crank the sh*t out of it .
Anyways thanks a ton for the tips and help, now I've just gotta figure out what to do with this TS9 that just arrived

[CTN]

Re: New to the forum...

Awesome! that's what I like to hear! you dun good fella!

[GuitarDoc]

Re: New to the forum...

Great to hear your success. But it sounds like you're only 90% there. Like I said play it for a while and see if you get used to it or get weary of it. Then go through the tweaking some more. Your ears and your tastes DO change with time.

In any case, glad to hear that you're on the right track and making your equipment work for you without having to put out big $$ on a new amp just yet.