How to record with reverb?

[dr.barlo]

Hi guys,

I was sorta trying to get some reverb onto the following track:

http://barlo.gitarpedal.net/GP-Cem/GPJTCem/GPJTCem-22-Dr.Barlo.mp3

The amp is a clone of a Dumble clone... Specifically, it's a clone of Brown Note's D'Lite 44 (with a Bassman tranny). We changed some of the parts, I really like it. It has tube driven reverb, hence, I call it Rev. Bumble. Anyways, when I was recording this, the reverb was huge. I felt like playing in an empty tank... I know that using 1 cab mic is not good enough for capturing genuine reverb, so I've used 2 mics (one on axis, the other around cone edge), panned them to hard right and left.

But still the track was too dry. So in order to get what I wanted I've added reverb with VST's, Antress' Modern Spacer. That's what you are hearing in the track...

Hence, I have a queston... Do I have to use a room mic? Condenser? They are expensive, I don't wanna go that route unless it is absolutely necessary.

Thanks in advance.

B

[ehdwuld]

Re: How to record with reverb?

I would think a sm57 about 2 foot away could suffice for ambience

But if the amp has a reverb tank
And you can't hear it on the track

I would place a mike up around where my ears are

And see if I could capture what I'm hearing

*(Sent from my durned phone!)*

[DankStar]

Re: How to record with reverb?

I'd say how you did that was perfect. Meow is that guitar ever clear. (Autocorrected wow to meow, gotta leave it like that hehe)

[dr.barlo]

Re: How to record with reverb?



Thanks!

B

[dr.barlo]

Re: How to record with reverb?

I would think a sm57 about 2 foot away could suffice for ambience

But if the amp has a reverb tank
And you can't hear it on the track

I would place a mike up around where my ears are

And see if I could capture what I'm hearing

*(Sent from my durned phone!)*

I am micing somewhat close... 2 inches at most... But I am placing 2 mics... 2 feet seemed kinda quite far for me.



B

[Myaccount876]

Re: How to record with reverb?

Try running the amp dry, with an SM57 set up close like normal, and a condenser mic in the room, setting it as far away as what it needs to sound best with the right amount of ambiance. I much prefer that to an amp's reverb. If not, I'd have a dry track and place reverb on the track itself, maybe putting a few milliseconds of delay on the track to make it seem farther away. In general, I'm a believer of having a solid dry track that you can work with and add effects to later. It's much easier to mix that way IMO.

[dr.barlo]

Re: How to record with reverb?

Try running the amp dry, with an SM57 set up close like normal, and a condenser mic in the room, setting it as far away as what it needs to sound best with the right amount of ambiance. I much prefer that to an amp's reverb. If not, I'd have a dry track and place reverb on the track itself, maybe putting a few milliseconds of delay on the track to make it seem farther away. In general, I'm a believer of having a solid dry track that you can work with and add effects to later. It's much easier to mix that way IMO.

That is generally what I am doing. I mean, working with dry tracks... In fact, I am recording with 2 dynamic mics, shure sm57 and beta57a, both placed at most 2 inches away from the cab. One generally is on axis (sm57) and beta57a is just a bit outside of the dust cap towards the cone edge. Then I pan them two tracks to hard left and right and listen to the recorded white noise (at the beginning of the track) while setting one of the tracks to out of phase with the other. I move one of the tracks between 0 - 10ms and continue to listen through headphones. The spot with the least hiss kinda sounds the best to me, of course setting that track back in phase with the other.

Now when I hit the reverb from a VST, it sounds really good.

But this time I tried to capture the real reverb from the amp, without a condenser... I couldn't do it, so had to go back to the dry track tricks... It kinda worked, but still I wanna learn how to record the reverb directly from the amp with no VST help (apart from comp and minor eq of course)...

B

[Kamanda~SD]

Re: How to record with reverb?

First off, sounds really good.

Well here's the thing. What your hearing in the room (and when you test it by stopping to listen to the tail) is not what the mic is picking up 2" away. Personally I find adding reverb later (whether through VST or hardware, or room mic) is always a better choice to find the right blend.

With that said, in your case, if you want what your hearing from the amp, your only real choice is a room mic (squashed to all hell may I add!) and blended in. Micing an amp thats pumping out reverb will never get the reverb to sound the way it does in the room IMO. So really hard to say (or do) unless you can get it modded for a reverb out, or have a send/return on the reverb tank itself (I've seen some like this, usually rca type connectors)...hmm.

[dr.barlo]

Re: How to record with reverb?

Cool!

Thanks.

B

[Myaccount876]

Re: How to record with reverb?

You'll be amazed once you have a condenser haha. Or you could get a third dynamic mic, EQ it so that it has mostly highs, put it in the hallway/next room over/etc, and use that for you reverb. That's similar to what was done of the drums for When The Levee Breaks, just it was obviously EQ'd much differently, being drums and all. Directly from the amp though, I can't be of much help there. I don't really utilize that technique.

[Chickenwings]

Re: How to record with reverb?

If you can set the speaker cabinet on an angle so its pointing to a corner of the roof rather than at a wall. Try two ribbon mics about 3 feet back from the speakers. Have the ribbon mics set up end to end so the two mics look like one long tube, one mic above, one mic below. Ribbons will record both the side facing the amps and the side facing away so you will get all of the room. Then when you get the two tracks done (add a third close mic'ed 57 if you like) pan them hard left and hard right. If you decide to use the 57 track you can blend it in for presence.

[LLL]

Re: How to record with reverb?

9 times out of 10, I record bone-dry. Because then I can add any FX I want, fiddle with them, etc... and if I don't like something, revert back to dry and try a different FX.

When it comes to reverb, I "bus" things -

1) I will add a bus to the track with the dry guitar on it
2) The bus will get a reverb VST put on it
3) I can then either:
3a) Adjust the reverb bus fader to set the amount of reverb I want on the dry guitar
3b) Adjust the dry guitar track's bus level out (to reverb bus) to set the amount of reverb I want on the dry guitar

With a reverb bus, I can also:

- pan the dry guitar L or R separate from the reverb
- pan the reverb (if stereo) L or R separate from the guitar

[TwilightOdyssey]

Re: How to record with reverb?

The more options the better, but just beware phase issues when bringing in room mics.
Depending on how reverberent you want the sound, when using plugins, it's not just about reverb level but also predelay. How you set up your predelay is vital to how natural it will sound.
I agree w the idea of busing reverbs.

If you really want to go no nuts, you should have at least 4 reverbs going, just for the room verb -- hard left and right with a predelay of x, and another set with a predelay of y. Do not use a single stereo reverb. And each reverb instance should have its own EQ -- the drier reverb being a little brighter and more present than the wetter one.

I like using 6 reverbs: room a left, room a right, room b left, room b right, chamber left, chamber right. But I run everything through them.

[dr.barlo]

Re: How to record with reverb?

If you can set the speaker cabinet on an angle so its pointing to a corner of the roof rather than at a wall. Try two ribbon mics about 3 feet back from the speakers. Have the ribbon mics set up end to end so the two mics look like one long tube, one mic above, one mic below. Ribbons will record both the side facing the amps and the side facing away so you will get all of the room. Then when you get the two tracks done (add a third close mic'ed 57 if you like) pan them hard left and hard right. If you decide to use the 57 track you can blend it in for presence.

Cool...

Thanks. I dunno when I'll be able to try this out, but it's definitely something I'd like to give it a try.

B

[dr.barlo]

Re: How to record with reverb?

9 times out of 10, I record bone-dry. Because then I can add any FX I want, fiddle with them, etc... and if I don't like something, revert back to dry and try a different FX.

When it comes to reverb, I "bus" things -

1) I will add a bus to the track with the dry guitar on it
2) The bus will get a reverb VST put on it
3) I can then either:
3a) Adjust the reverb bus fader to set the amount of reverb I want on the dry guitar
3b) Adjust the dry guitar track's bus level out (to reverb bus) to set the amount of reverb I want on the dry guitar

With a reverb bus, I can also:

- pan the dry guitar L or R separate from the reverb
- pan the reverb (if stereo) L or R separate from the guitar

The more options the better, but just beware phase issues when bringing in room mics.
Depending on how reverberent you want the sound, when using plugins, it's not just about reverb level but also predelay. How you set up your predelay is vital to how natural it will sound.
I agree w the idea of busing reverbs.

If you really want to go no nuts, you should have at least 4 reverbs going, just for the room verb -- hard left and right with a predelay of x, and another set with a predelay of y. Do not use a single stereo reverb. And each reverb instance should have its own EQ -- the drier reverb being a little brighter and more present than the wetter one.

I like using 6 reverbs: room a left, room a right, room b left, room b right, chamber left, chamber right. But I run everything through them.

Thanks for the input. I am not sure if I understand this all... Lemme check this out in detail.

I appreciate the help guys, thanks!

B