what is so good about point to point handwiring, what makes it better than just popping in a microchip. don't make fun of me for this stupid question, ive played mesas and they sound great! just pondering this stupid question about point to point wiring
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
Originally posted by cream123what is so good about point to point handwiring, what makes it better than just popping in a microchip. don't make fun of me for this stupid question, ive played mesas and they sound great! just pondering this stupid question about point to point wiring
PTP if not done right can create alot of antenna effect,stray noise,and oscillation problems...The pcb technology is cheaper to make,but could be a more consistent and stable overall circuit,but again it depends on what circuit and the thickness and quality of the board and the components used?
I love working on PTP amps,but I'm every bit ok playing through pcb as long as the amp has the tone...
PTP amps are very expensive as a rule compared to the pcb amp...Last edited by STRATDELUXER97; 12-25-2005, 04:12 PM.Amps: 66 Fender BF Pro Reverb Combo,1973 50 Watt Marshall Head,Marshall 4x12 A/V Cab,Vox ToneLab LE,Vox VTH Valvetronix 120 Head,Vox AD 2x12 Cab,Roland Cube 20X
Guitars: Several Stratocasters,2 Fender Telecasters,Gibson SG Standard,Tokai Love Rock Les Paul,Dean Acoustic.
Pickups: SD SSL2,SSL5,Twangbanger,Antiquity Surfers,59N,Seth Lover N/B,Dimarzio Fred,Dimarzio VPAF N,Fender Fat 50s,Fralin SP43 Bridge,Brobucker,Antiquity Texas Hot.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
As long as the amp's design is a great one, the differences are minimal. There's no disputing that P to P amps are built better, and can generally take more abuse. The biggest difference is the sonic detail and harmonic content.
P to P amps generally have a bigger and richer sound, which engulfs a room, whereas the PCB amp sounds a little narrower, but has the ability to cram more features into the same space.....they're done this way because large amp companies are concerned with mass production for the lowest dollars.
My two main amps are a PCB Bogner and P to P Matchless. They both have their own sound, but I find more focused gain in PCB amps, and a more 'wide open' and articulate sound out of P to P.Originally posted by Boogie BillI've got 60 guitars...but 49 trumpets is just...INSANITY! WTF!
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
the diff is mainly mechanical.
to mount a pcb you have to screw it to the box. as time goes by and you move the amp around, drive around the country in a beatup van the box gets loose eventually. then the box starts to twist the pcb and may cause problems. I have other electrical equipment that broke after moving too much. Never happened to my amp coz I don't move it often.
PTP wirings are soft wires so they don't have this problem.
Heating is another concern. hook-up wires are never over-heated because they are all hanging in the are. the copper tracing in a pcb can get overheated if the board is cheap
my 2cents.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
Originally posted by GearjoneserAs long as the amp's design is a great one, the differences are minimal. There's no disputing that P to P amps are built better, and can generally take more abuse. The biggest difference is the sonic detail and harmonic content.
P to P amps generally have a bigger and richer sound, which engulfs a room, whereas the PCB amp sounds a little narrower, but has the ability to cram more features into the same space.....they're done this way because large amp companies are concerned with mass production for the lowest dollars.
My two main amps are a PCB Bogner and P to P Matchless. They both have their own sound, but I find more focused gain in PCB amps, and a more 'wide open' and articulate sound out of P to P.
It's the crappy little Crate PCBs that I don't like,but given the circuit,the pcb amps are fine and I just don't buy into the mindset that PTP is better than PCB(It's alot of BS actually and I've played through both)and I do speak from experiences of working on both types of amps....Mainly Fender and Marshalls....
There has been several talks about this topic on several forums and it's always a very hot topic with each side having strong convictions of one being better than the other....I'll agree that it's solely the design and components that matters the most before I'd say PTP is better.....I really don't have a problem with PTP or PCB if the amp has tone!Last edited by STRATDELUXER97; 12-25-2005, 05:33 PM.Amps: 66 Fender BF Pro Reverb Combo,1973 50 Watt Marshall Head,Marshall 4x12 A/V Cab,Vox ToneLab LE,Vox VTH Valvetronix 120 Head,Vox AD 2x12 Cab,Roland Cube 20X
Guitars: Several Stratocasters,2 Fender Telecasters,Gibson SG Standard,Tokai Love Rock Les Paul,Dean Acoustic.
Pickups: SD SSL2,SSL5,Twangbanger,Antiquity Surfers,59N,Seth Lover N/B,Dimarzio Fred,Dimarzio VPAF N,Fender Fat 50s,Fralin SP43 Bridge,Brobucker,Antiquity Texas Hot.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
Originally posted by rguserthe diff is mainly mechanical.
to mount a pcb you have to screw it to the box. as time goes by and you move the amp around, drive around the country in a beatup van the box gets loose eventually. then the box starts to twist the pcb and may cause problems. I have other electrical equipment that broke after moving too much. Never happened to my amp coz I don't move it often.
PTP wirings are soft wires so they don't have this problem.
Heating is another concern. hook-up wires are never over-heated because they are all hanging in the are. the copper tracing in a pcb can get overheated if the board is cheap
my 2cents.
It's the whole boutique mentality over the years that has us all thinking this way....Do I Like PTP? Heck yeah....Is it better tonally? Hmmmmmmmm?Last edited by STRATDELUXER97; 12-25-2005, 05:33 PM.Amps: 66 Fender BF Pro Reverb Combo,1973 50 Watt Marshall Head,Marshall 4x12 A/V Cab,Vox ToneLab LE,Vox VTH Valvetronix 120 Head,Vox AD 2x12 Cab,Roland Cube 20X
Guitars: Several Stratocasters,2 Fender Telecasters,Gibson SG Standard,Tokai Love Rock Les Paul,Dean Acoustic.
Pickups: SD SSL2,SSL5,Twangbanger,Antiquity Surfers,59N,Seth Lover N/B,Dimarzio Fred,Dimarzio VPAF N,Fender Fat 50s,Fralin SP43 Bridge,Brobucker,Antiquity Texas Hot.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
Originally posted by Ridptp is easier to repair
While PCB normal is a pain to change components on, you have to watch if the pcb can take the heat from the desoldering and resoldering.
The sonic differences are non existant if the materials are good.
I've see some horrible PTP wired amps also...Just a non-organized rat trap of ramdom wiring all over the place....Very very non-Hiwatt like inside...Amps: 66 Fender BF Pro Reverb Combo,1973 50 Watt Marshall Head,Marshall 4x12 A/V Cab,Vox ToneLab LE,Vox VTH Valvetronix 120 Head,Vox AD 2x12 Cab,Roland Cube 20X
Guitars: Several Stratocasters,2 Fender Telecasters,Gibson SG Standard,Tokai Love Rock Les Paul,Dean Acoustic.
Pickups: SD SSL2,SSL5,Twangbanger,Antiquity Surfers,59N,Seth Lover N/B,Dimarzio Fred,Dimarzio VPAF N,Fender Fat 50s,Fralin SP43 Bridge,Brobucker,Antiquity Texas Hot.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
At the end ptp is ptp due to the convinient way to change dead components, my dad used to maintain old millionwatts tubenavigation amps, they used ptp due to heat and the easiness of changing components.
The glue in PCB will come apart in the end, that is about the only weakness.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
let's take a mesa nomad 100 amp head. it's wired ptp, no? but also hypethetically let's say this amp is wired pcb. would it sound better or worse for bluesy rock or wouldn't it really matterOriginally posted by kilphodyThere is no such thing as useless knowledge.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
Originally posted by cream123let's take a mesa nomad 100 amp head. it's wired ptp, no? but also hypethetically let's say this amp is wired pcb. would it sound better or worse for bluesy rock or wouldn't it really matterAmps: 66 Fender BF Pro Reverb Combo,1973 50 Watt Marshall Head,Marshall 4x12 A/V Cab,Vox ToneLab LE,Vox VTH Valvetronix 120 Head,Vox AD 2x12 Cab,Roland Cube 20X
Guitars: Several Stratocasters,2 Fender Telecasters,Gibson SG Standard,Tokai Love Rock Les Paul,Dean Acoustic.
Pickups: SD SSL2,SSL5,Twangbanger,Antiquity Surfers,59N,Seth Lover N/B,Dimarzio Fred,Dimarzio VPAF N,Fender Fat 50s,Fralin SP43 Bridge,Brobucker,Antiquity Texas Hot.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
Regardless of the effect on tone, it's more cost effective to hand wire circuits when building in small batches.
The term PTP is misused almost as much as Class A. Many handwired amps are not strictly PTP.Originally posted by LesStratmake sure that you own the gear, not vice versa.
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Re: whats so good about point to point handwired
Originally posted by RidNo matter what so ever!!!Amps: 66 Fender BF Pro Reverb Combo,1973 50 Watt Marshall Head,Marshall 4x12 A/V Cab,Vox ToneLab LE,Vox VTH Valvetronix 120 Head,Vox AD 2x12 Cab,Roland Cube 20X
Guitars: Several Stratocasters,2 Fender Telecasters,Gibson SG Standard,Tokai Love Rock Les Paul,Dean Acoustic.
Pickups: SD SSL2,SSL5,Twangbanger,Antiquity Surfers,59N,Seth Lover N/B,Dimarzio Fred,Dimarzio VPAF N,Fender Fat 50s,Fralin SP43 Bridge,Brobucker,Antiquity Texas Hot.
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