DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

[TimmyPage]

Just a small question, as I really like the output of my cool rails and I don't want to lose how hard it pushes my amp when I switch it for a full sized humbucker. I notice that the single coil sized ones usually have a significantly higher DC resistance than the pickups they are modelling. The lil 59 is over 17k!

Now, I know that DC resistance isn't the only element that makes output, but are they just wound a little warmer to make up for the smaller area the pickup has to 'read' the string? The cool rails neck is sitting at about 9.2k, should I go for a full size in about that range, or will the standard 7.5-8k in a full sized bucker be just as hot?

[ArtieToo]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

The smaller coil relies on a smaller diameter wire. The smaller the diameter, (larger gauge), means higher resistance. A smaller coil might actually have a higher resistance, while having fewer actual "winds". So, it's hard to compare the output of a single-coil-sized HB to a full-sized HB based on DCR specs.

You kinda have to listen to 'em.

[idsnowdog]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

Single coil sized humbuckers tend to be brighter and weaker than full sized humbuckers. The polepieces are smaller, they use ceramic magnets and they have a small sensing window which effect the sound. None of the little series sound much like their full sized relatives. The three I like are the JB Jr neck, Duckbuck and Fastrack bridge. The Fastrack II sounds nearly identical to a full sized JB.

[TimmyPage]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

Single coil sized humbuckers tend to be brighter and weaker than full sized humbuckers. The polepieces are smaller, they use ceramic magnets and they have a small sensing window which effect the sound. None of the little series sound much like their full sized relatives. The three I like are the JB Jr neck, Duckbuck and Fastrack bridge. The Fastrack II sounds nearly identical to a full sized JB.

I'm actually going the other way around, I've used SC sized humbuckers for a long time, and now I'm moving up to full sized!

[idsnowdog]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

I'm actually going the other way around, I've used SC sized humbuckers for a long time, and now I'm moving up to full sized!

Either way it's an adjustment. Honestly I would have much preferred if SD had not used the names of their full sized pickups for their SC sized pickups , because they each have their own sound. By using the names of their full sized brethren it has built up expectations that are often unmet.

[Masta' C]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

To answer the question you posed in the title: No, they are not related. At least not in the sense that you're probably thinking about it.

...I know that DC resistance is not an element that makes output...

Corrected that for you


Artie and Idsnowdog were spot on with their explanations. I recommend you resist (pun intended) looking at resistance figures to determine a pickup's output/tone. It's hands-down the most inaccurate approach.

[darthphineas]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

^^^ this ^^^

[Brian Griffin]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

To answer the question you posed in the title: No, they are not related. At least not in the sense that you're probably thinking about it.



Corrected that for you


Artie and Idsnowdog were spot on with their explanations. I recommend you resist (pun intended) looking at resistance figures to determine a pickup's output/tone. It's hands-down the most inaccurate approach.

Well I know DC resistance is one key element in determining the output from SD catalog. So SD has been lying to its customers all this time?

[dominus]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

Well I know DC resistance is one key element in determining the output from SD catalog. So SD has been lying to its customers all this time?

Not lying, just.. misinforming.

[jeremy]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

its not mis-information really since it does tell you something but you need to know a fair amount of other things for it to mean much

[Rand-O-Monium]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

Single coil sized humbuckers tend to be brighter and weaker than full sized humbuckers. The polepieces are smaller, they use ceramic magnets and they have a small sensing window which effect the sound. The Fastrack II sounds nearly identical to a full sized JB.

Interesting,I've been using teh FT-2 for years!!!


I'll give you a "+" on most of the other points,as well!!!
I think the smaller window gives a little more clarity,personally.But I've been playing them so long that my ears are prolly kinda jaded...

Still,to me,they very much have a place!!!Practically all of my Strats have some kinda Rails design(mostly Dimz tho).I've got one w/a PAF Pro/TZ combo in the works,tho,"really" looking forward to that!!!

[Masta' C]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

Well I know DC resistance is one key element in determining the output from SD catalog. So SD has been lying to its customers all this time?

As Jeremy and Dominus pointed out, SD hasn't "lied" about anything...their high-level approach to explaining pickup design has worked well for them from a marketing standpoint. On top of that, nearly every other manufacturer has followed suit, advertising resistance figures and little else.

However, because of this lack of information and most players' unwillingness to get severely technical, 99% of the members of this forum automatically assume that a pickup registering 9K must be lower in output than a 12K pickup, but the reality is that you don't have enough information based on resistance alone to make that determination. I can wind you a 16K pickup that is brighter and lower in output than a 10K pickup if I know what I'm doing.


All I'm pointing out is that resistance is the smallest piece of a much larger puzzle that determines output and tone and the only reason players have gravitated toward using it is because it's easily measurable by the average joe and there is no other commonly advertised specification to use as a reference when comparing pickups. If the industry came together and agreed on a universal standard for measuring things like output and reporting tonal characteristics, we'd all be much better informed and the word "resistance" would hardly ever be mentioned.

[AlexR]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

It would be good if there was one of those frequency graphs like you get with speakers. That would give great info across the spectrum.

[darthphineas]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

or if they would just assign a # to the output the way that DiMarzio does.

there are pickups with lower DCR that are louder and have more output than expected when using the Duncan approach.

[Masta' C]

Re: DC Resistance: SC Sized Humbucker vs Full Size; Are they related?

I do appreciate DiMarzio giving us a very general idea of how their pickups rank relative to each other.

As long as you stay within the DiMarzio line, those mV readings will give you a mildly accurate interpretation of each pickups' output compared to the next.

The problem, however, is that the mV measurement of a pickup is very much frequency dependent. It has been suggested several times over the years that Dimarzio may take their measurement based on the signal of a single string (the "A", supposedly). Since each pickup model emphasizes frequencies differently, there is a large amount of built-in error to this mehod, if that's indeed what they use. Additionaly, other variables, such as pick attack, can make a night and day difference in the readings, so consistency and repeatability is certainly a concern.

Perhaps the biggest downside of the mV approach is that you can NOT take DiMarzio's output (mV) information and compare it with any other brand's because their specific method of measurement has not been confirmed and, therefore, can't be accurately applied by anyone else.

It should also be understood that a pickup's mV readings do not reveal its real-life tone, especially if you are looking at just a single mV number and/or a single frequency.