SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

[Archer250]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

While I would prefer the JB, having read on Jemsite that you play in drop D, and that you want a metalcore sound, the Black Winter is the best way to go.

[Big D]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

My bad i meant Pegasus.

[Inflames626]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Darthphineas may have something to add to my comment since he's been so helpful on my threads in the past.

Of Duncan passive high gains, I've tried the JB, DD, Alt 8, and Full Shred. Most of my guitars are alder/maple/rosewood bolt ons--mid priced Japanese models. Licensed Floyds.

IMO, the main distinction among all of them is the amount of saturation you get, as well as slightly different EQ curves.

First, make sure your pickup matches your guitar and amp. If you have a high gain amp, try a lower output pickup so you have more clarity. Way too many metal bands now run a high output pickup through a high gain amp and their tone sounds like a nest of chainsaws or flub-a-flub scooped Recto. If you have a lower gain amp, a higher output pickup will offset that.

I prefer boosting the front end of my amp slightly as opposed to using a hot pickup since I can dial in or remove saturation at will. You're stuck with whatever a pickup gives. Lower output pickups have more clarity and dynamics generally, and it's very difficult to clean up a hot pickup. I dialed in a good metal sound with Gibson 57 Classics once, but I've had less success cleaning up a Distortion.

Second, in my experience, the JB is a hugely overrated pickup because it is loose in the bass and low mids. It is a fine pickup for chunky hard rock rhythm at moderate tempo, but when the speed gets faster it gets loose. It sounds fine in a mix but by itself it is butt ugly. You can work with it, but prepare to use a high pass filter to roll off some of that low end. The low mids and upper mid honk will need work depending upon your taste. I suspect the JB got its reputation because it is a good all rounder for rock and, back in the pre Internet days, it was easier to make a JB work than to compare so many types of pickups.

The DD has tighter bass, more saturation, and more high end cut than the JB, but it can be harsh. I'd start there. I haven't tried an Invader, but it sounds like its bass, mids, and saturation would overwhelm most guitars. The Alternative 8 is similar to a DD but with more bass and slightly less cutting highs.

Think about the difference in the JB and DD as being like a Marshall vs. a 5150. The Marshall has classic tone but the 5150 is more saturated and, some would say, harsh. But the DD suits extreme metal better than the JB does.

So far, my favorite set is the Full Shred. They're the most tonally neutral of the ones I have tried. Some people say they're bland, but I find them balanced. I haven't tried the BWs, but the Shreds are great for moderate rock all the way to death metal if you tweak your signal chain. I've seen several guys here say the Full Shred is fine for drop tuning because it has a really punchy, defined sound.

JB, DD, Alt 8, and Full Shreds will all give you great harmonics, but IMO the Full Shred has the most touch and sensitivity--ideal for articulate solos and those clean to distorted changes in metalcore.

Something you may want to think about is trying full sets first as opposed to individual pups in order to find a good neck pup. Normally the full sets work well. I'm used to an EMG 60, so even the Duncan Jazz is a bit warm to me.

Ultimately, I think the DD set is what you want. That said, I'm not sold on the Distortion neck pup. I've never tried it, but my experience with high gain ceramic pups in the neck is not good. If you want a bright clean sound in the neck like a lot of metal guys use (brighter than a Jazz), you may have trouble finding a Duncan that will do it.

Maybe one of the more experienced guys can help with a bright neck pup.

[TNTales]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

+1 for the Black Winters. They clean up nicely with the volume knob and handle all levels of gain cleanly.

[PwnageEngage]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Black Winter. Seriously.

JB is its own animal. In Metal, it is the preferred pickup of classic megadeth. It is a fairly bright pickup with an upper mid spike. A very classic sound. Pinch harmonics are cake with the JB and DD. Under extreme gain some complain it is flubby. I feel it can have a bit of a cocked wah sound, which can be friend or foe.
DD is like a boxier black winter. The black winter is similar, but IME superior in every respect. The DD is a very dark pickup with a piercing high end. Absolutely great in the right guitar. I would say it is definitely a classic pickup, but to my ears it seems somewhat lacking in the mids and has more lows than I like. I am being picky though, it is a great pickup
Invader. Loose, flubby, overly bassy, too dark to have much definition IMO. It ends up sounding dark and fat and flubby. It is the only SD pickup I tried which I do not like at all.
Black Winter is a remarkably balanced pickup. No spikes, no mud, string definition like nothing else, and I would say it sounds relatively open for a high output pickup. It preserves nuances well. Played clean, with light drive, or under gobs of distortion it sounds excellent.

Hey thanks for the in depth explanation.

I read or heard somewhere that Black Winter is more for death metal and isn't very melodic? I'm not sure, i might be confusing myself.

To be clear, which would you personally recommend: The SH-6 or the Black Winter? And why?

[PwnageEngage]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

If you can wait i would get a Sentient 6 string

What is this?

[PwnageEngage]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

While I would prefer the JB, having read on Jemsite that you play in drop D, and that you want a metalcore sound, the Black Winter is the best way to go.

Awesome

The top 2 contenders for me atm would be the SH-6 and the Black Winter. Would you go into a bit more detail as to which you think is 'better' and why? I would appreciate it so much.

[PwnageEngage]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Darthphineas may have something to add to my comment since he's been so helpful on my threads in the past.

Of Duncan passive high gains, I've tried the JB, DD, Alt 8, and Full Shred. Most of my guitars are alder/maple/rosewood bolt ons--mid priced Japanese models. Licensed Floyds.

IMO, the main distinction among all of them is the amount of saturation you get, as well as slightly different EQ curves.

First, make sure your pickup matches your guitar and amp. If you have a high gain amp, try a lower output pickup so you have more clarity. Way too many metal bands now run a high output pickup through a high gain amp and their tone sounds like a nest of chainsaws or flub-a-flub scooped Recto. If you have a lower gain amp, a higher output pickup will offset that.

I prefer boosting the front end of my amp slightly as opposed to using a hot pickup since I can dial in or remove saturation at will. You're stuck with whatever a pickup gives. Lower output pickups have more clarity and dynamics generally, and it's very difficult to clean up a hot pickup. I dialed in a good metal sound with Gibson 57 Classics once, but I've had less success cleaning up a Distortion.

Second, in my experience, the JB is a hugely overrated pickup because it is loose in the bass and low mids. It is a fine pickup for chunky hard rock rhythm at moderate tempo, but when the speed gets faster it gets loose. It sounds fine in a mix but by itself it is butt ugly. You can work with it, but prepare to use a high pass filter to roll off some of that low end. The low mids and upper mid honk will need work depending upon your taste. I suspect the JB got its reputation because it is a good all rounder for rock and, back in the pre Internet days, it was easier to make a JB work than to compare so many types of pickups.

The DD has tighter bass, more saturation, and more high end cut than the JB, but it can be harsh. I'd start there. I haven't tried an Invader, but it sounds like its bass, mids, and saturation would overwhelm most guitars. The Alternative 8 is similar to a DD but with more bass and slightly less cutting highs.

Think about the difference in the JB and DD as being like a Marshall vs. a 5150. The Marshall has classic tone but the 5150 is more saturated and, some would say, harsh. But the DD suits extreme metal better than the JB does.

So far, my favorite set is the Full Shred. They're the most tonally neutral of the ones I have tried. Some people say they're bland, but I find them balanced. I haven't tried the BWs, but the Shreds are great for moderate rock all the way to death metal if you tweak your signal chain. I've seen several guys here say the Full Shred is fine for drop tuning because it has a really punchy, defined sound.

JB, DD, Alt 8, and Full Shreds will all give you great harmonics, but IMO the Full Shred has the most touch and sensitivity--ideal for articulate solos and those clean to distorted changes in metalcore.

Something you may want to think about is trying full sets first as opposed to individual pups in order to find a good neck pup. Normally the full sets work well. I'm used to an EMG 60, so even the Duncan Jazz is a bit warm to me.

Ultimately, I think the DD set is what you want. That said, I'm not sold on the Distortion neck pup. I've never tried it, but my experience with high gain ceramic pups in the neck is not good. If you want a bright clean sound in the neck like a lot of metal guys use (brighter than a Jazz), you may have trouble finding a Duncan that will do it.

Maybe one of the more experienced guys can help with a bright neck pup.

Hey, thanks for taking the time to explain.

I should've clarified: I am looking for a bridge PU. I've been hearing great things about the Black Winter on this thread. Haven't heard much on the Full Shred but i'm gonna find some comparisons on Youtube now.

Thanks again

[PwnageEngage]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Can I get some more info on the Black Winters?

[PwnageEngage]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

+1 for the Black Winters. They clean up nicely with the volume knob and handle all levels of gain cleanly.

Can you expand on the Black Winters?

[PwnageEngage]

Re: SH-4 JB vs SH-6 Distortion vs SH-8 Invader - Which would be best for me?

Why can't I post..