12 string neck relief issue

[jrbowen81]

Hey guys, I have a question. I just got a Takamine EG523sc-12 (12 string acoustic/electric) yesterday that's in pretty darn good shape, except the previous owner had it sitting in a closet in its case for about a year with the strings still tuned close to pitch. With the strings being that old, they may also be stretched to their max. I know I need to restring it, just waiting on my next paycheck. The action was pretty high but not totally unplayable, so I checked the neck relief and sure enough, it was bowed quite a bit. Not sure how much bow it can have before it would be considered "warped". I went ahead and started gradually adjusting the truss rod, and it seemed like it was ALMOST where I wanted it (.010"-.020" at the 7th fret) when it started to feel like the rod was maxed out. Needless to say, I didn't want to push it any further. I'm wondering what I need to do, because I'm definitely not going to force anything and end up ruining the neck or wrecking the truss rod. I'm not in the financial situation to take it to anyone, so I'm just trying to carefully plan my next step. Thanks!

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[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

Actually, I just did some more research and I think the neck relief is now close enough that I could probably just add a couple of washers behind the truss rod nut.


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[treyhaislip]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

Hey guys, I have a question. I just got a Takamine EG523sc-12 (12 string acoustic/electric) yesterday that's in pretty darn good shape, except the previous owner had it sitting in a closet in its case for about a year with the strings still tuned close to pitch. With the strings being that old, they may also be stretched to their max. I know I need to restring it, just waiting on my next paycheck. The action was pretty high but not totally unplayable, so I checked the neck relief and sure enough, it was bowed quite a bit. Not sure how much bow it can have before it would be considered "warped". I went ahead and started gradually adjusting the truss rod, and it seemed like it was ALMOST where I wanted it (.010"-.020" at the 7th fret) when it started to feel like the rod was maxed out. Needless to say, I didn't want to push it any further. I'm wondering what I need to do, because I'm definitely not going to force anything and end up ruining the neck or wrecking the truss rod. I'm not in the financial situation to take it to anyone, so I'm just trying to carefully plan my next step. Thanks!

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Actually, I just did some more research and I think the neck relief is now close enough that I could probably just add a couple of washers behind the truss rod nut.


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Nice acquisition! I love 12 strings, have '79 Guild myself. Sorry, I wish I could be of help here but that is outside my knowledge–hopefully the research you did fixes the relief. Congrats on the awesome guitar!

 

[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

Thanks! It's a beauty for sure. Can't wait to get it playing like a champ again!


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[PFDarkside]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

I've been eyeing that guitar for the better part of 10 years. Hope it treats you well and you get it in top playing condition.

 

[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

I've been eyeing that guitar for the better part of 10 years. Hope it treats you well and you get it in top playing condition.

I think it will be great once I get the neck just a tiny bit straighter. Everything else about it seems awesome.


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[GuitarStv]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

I've tried about two dozen 30-60 year old acoustic 12 strings, and they all had neck problems. I think 12 string guitars just have a limited lifespan.

 

[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

I've tried about two dozen 30-60 year old acoustic 12 strings, and they all had neck problems. I think 12 string guitars just have a limited lifespan.

They do have to deal with a lot more string tension, so that could be true. I got to play on a '64 Gibson once that was very nice, but it definitely had some work done to it.


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[treyhaislip]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

I've tried about two dozen 30-60 year old acoustic 12 strings, and they all had neck problems. I think 12 string guitars just have a limited lifespan.

My '79 Guild suffered a headstock fractur/split but definitely worth the repair! I wonder if modern truss rods will extend the life of modern 12 strings?

 

[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

I "made" these today at work. Ok, I bought a spacer at Lowe's last night and just took it to work and cut it up into smaller sections. Lol. Should work though! We shall see.

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[jtougas]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

Also, see how it is tuned down to Eb or D...

 

[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

Also, see how it is tuned down to Eb or D...

I'll most likely put it in D.


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[jrbowen81]

12 string neck relief issue

Got the spacers in, got the neck relief where I want it (although the truss rod still felt very tight by the time I got it there), and now to set the action. It's very high right now in my opinion (a full 1/4" off the 12th fret). What is a comfortable action for most of you 12-stringers? I'll be using the light gauge set when I get new strings (.010-.047). I'll have to be pretty careful when sanding the saddles down, as this bridge has 2 of them instead of a single one going all the way across. I think I need to take at least 1/32" off both saddles.

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[jtougas]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

UM.

1) 1/4" at the 12th is still waaaay high, even for a 12...

2) IIRC, the pickups in those bridges are bonded to the bottoms of the saddles... meaning you can't sand from the bottom, and sanding from the top is likely to throw your intonation all sorts of out of whack. *I could be wrong on the first half of this, and the second half depends on the first, soooo...*

 

[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

UM.

1) 1/4" at the 12th is still waaaay high, even for a 12...

2) IIRC, the pickups in those bridges are bonded to the bottoms of the saddles... meaning you can't sand from the bottom, and sanding from the top is likely to throw your intonation all sorts of out of whack. *I could be wrong on the first half of this, and the second half depends on the first, soooo...*

I seriously hope you're wrong. LOL... Crap.


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[jtougas]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

Check if your bridge is bellying out...

 

[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

Check if your bridge is bellying out...

It really doesn't seem to be. However, this guitar has a 2-piece top, and the seam between the 2 pieces is bulging just the slightest bit. You can barely feel it, but it's like a tiny little crease going down the center. There's not a crack in it from what I can tell though.


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[jtougas]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

That sounds fine. No lifting (bridge separating from body - probably not, you'd've noticed that)?

 

[jrbowen81]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

That sounds fine. No lifting (bridge separating from body - probably not, you'd've noticed that)?

Well, I don't see the bridge lifting any time soon. This one is bolted on. Never seen that before! Lol


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[jtougas]

Re: 12 string neck relief issue

Well... 12 stringers tend to get special consideration... LOL

Check how much neck relief you have - http://www.premierguitar.com/articles/22046--string-setup-secrets?page=5. If that's set properly you may need a neck reset.