59's vs Jazz's.

[Artie]

Late night, couldn't sleep, ramblings.

I'm surprised by how different the 59 set sounds from the Jazz set. They're both A5 mags. The 59 neck is only slightly lower DCR than the Jazz neck, and the 59 bridge is only slightly higher DCR than the Jazz bridge, and yet the 59's are markedly "darker" than the Jazz's. I'm not sure what wire is used in both, but it is an interesting phenomenon that they are so close, yet so different.

I like both sets, but the Jazz's slightly edge out the 59's for my taste. Great pups both.

 

[EC Strat]

The Jazz set must be BRIGHT bc I found the 59’s to be the brightest HBs I’ve heard. I put A2’s in my set and now they’re perfect for me.

 

[Aceman]

Late night, couldn't sleep, ramblings.

I'm surprised by how different the 59 set sounds from the Jazz set. They're both A5 mags. The 59 neck is only slightly lower DCR than the Jazz neck, and the 59 bridge is only slightly higher DCR than the Jazz bridge, and yet the 59's are markedly "darker" than the Jazz's. I'm not sure what wire is used in both, but it is an interesting phenomenon that they are so close, yet so different.

I like both sets, but the Jazz's slightly edge out the 59's for my taste. Great pups both.

Pickups, like guitars, are more than the sum of their parts.

The magnet, the wire, the winds, it all goes to gather to create the tone.

 

[Blille]

The Jazz set must be BRIGHT bc I found the 59’s to be the brightest HBs I’ve heard. I put A2’s in my set and now they’re perfect for me.

Love the 59 with A2 in the neck. I’m surprised it’s not a thing.

 

[Artie]

Love the 59 with A2 in the neck. I’m surprised it’s not a thing.

Seems like that would virtually be an AII Pro. But as Aceman said, there's more to it than just the mags and wind.

 

[jeremy]

actually an a2 in a jazz IS the aph1. i believe the 59 uses #42pe, the jazz #42poly but im sure the wind is a big part of the difference

 

[Artie]

actually an a2 in a jazz IS the aph1.

Thanks. That's good to know. So I can swap A2's in here at any time, and have A2 Pro's. But right now, the Jazz's sound great.

 

[Blille]

Thanks. That's good to know. So I can swap A2's in here at any time, and have A2 Pro's. But right now, the Jazz's sound great.

actually an a2 in a jazz IS the aph1. i believe the 59 uses #42pe, the jazz #42poly but im sure the wind is a big part of the difference

Love the A2 Pro but the 59 A2 is different. Hard to describe the difference but it has worked well for me with ash bodies in particular.

 

[JamesPaul]

I can only vouch for the Jazz neck, but it was my preferred neck pickup for 20+ years. When I really wanted that PAF set in a Les Paul, I went with '59s. Right out of the gate, I thought the '59 neck was boomy/woofy. In retrospect, it was probably only on the scooped side, but yeah, just to dark in stock form for me.

Side thought. What happens if I take a Jazz and put all hex screw pole pieces in it?

 

[Demanic]

I think that the 59N with a polished A4 is the perfect neck pickup in a set neck mahogany guitar.
I just put a JazzN in my Jackson DXMG and it is quite bright, but that's what I was looking for. And I still haven't finished dialing it in yet. I think that one with hexes instead of Filister screws would be even brighter. I have some, but I don't plan on trying it.
Though I do have a JB in the bridge of that guitar and I'm curious as to what chopped hexes would sound like in it.

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[JamesPaul]

Love the A4 in my '59 neck!

I was leaning into a Jazz with hex poles is a Full Shred. When I look at the Duncan Designed's, I mostly see a limited number of coils, but lots of tonal variety with magnet, pole, etc. swaps. Also, the DD literature alludes to this - so SD is not trying to cheat us. As with other things, there are physical limitations constraining what one can do by changing coils, for example..

I do not have what it takes, and I do have a few undergraduate level courses in magnetic field theory, to come to terms with the guitar pickup.

But that is my thing. I will handle my day gig, and let Seymour handle my night gig.

 

[Artie]

Love the A4 in my '59 neck!

I wonder how the A4 would work in the Jazz neck? I may try it later.

 

[JamesPaul]

I wonder how the A4 would work in the Jazz neck? I may try it later.

Only my guess, but the A4 usually induces a flatter EQ, I think it might be perceived as reducing the brightness of the Jazz. Whereas, I thought of it as brightening up my '59.

One more thanks again Bro! There are still those of us who know how that A4 got in my covered '59 neck.

 

[zionstrat]

Okay off topic and probably not going to happen..

I would absolutely love, even pay, for a chart that compares and contrasts pups and magnet changes.

Of course it's all subjective, but the way I make decisions now is reading thread after thread where someone like Artie compares a 59 to a jazz... I've actually got my own cheat sheet where I try to keep up with overall thinking recognizing that everyone is hearing things a little different and different guitars respond differently.

But to have that chart with magnet swap comparisons would be incredible... Obviously I would tweak depending on customers needs, wood, hardware etc, but in general it would give a leg up to SD when other pups are in the discussion.

Probably entirely unlikely but that's the way I feel

 

[Demanic]

I wonder how the A4 would work in the Jazz neck? I may try it later.

It would seem to be very bright, but very present. More mids than an A5 Jazz. But the same amount of bass and high end.

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[Mincer]

I do like the 59 neck a lot more than the Jazz, but I love the A2P better than both.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

Yep, different wire is a big factor. Poly wire is brighter and more modern sounding.
Of course the way the wire is laid down is a pretty significant element too.

59N is a great pickup, a personal favorite of mine for more than forty years now - in both Les Pauls and Strat types.
Not normally woofy IME, even in Les Pauls. Deeper lows than a typical PAF type, yes, but seldom problematic.

Still, if a particular LP has big low end or if you play with a ton of gain, there can be issues.
In that situation an A4 magnet will tighten it up very nicely without altering the overall voice too much.

A2 swap sweetens. smooths and enriches the 59N, and also gives it a looser feel.
I like it a lot that way, but high gain players probably wouldn't - it doesn't cut off as quickly when you stop.
To me, a swap to A2 was a much more noticeable change in character than the A4 swap.

I agree that an A2 59 really ought to be a stock model, just as an A2 JazzN is sold as the Alnico II Pro.
Of course it can be ordered that way as a shop floor custom, but IMO it deserves to be part of the regular line.
They could call them Vintage 59s, since the regular 59 isn't really very vintagey compared to PAF types from many other makers.

My favorite swap for the 59B has been UA5. Haven't tried UA5 in a 59N yet. But I love the old UA5 Gibson Shaw PAFs.

I'm actually thinking about trying a swap to UA5 for the Jazz neck in one of my PRSs.
I love its sparkle but I think a tad more midrange would help my neck leads sing a little better high up the neck.

 

[Ashurbanipal]

Don't forget the 59/J hybrid , which is, as you might imagine, between the two donors.

I built a pair years ago and continue to rock one in my Roadstar (basswood, 25.5 scale, you know the Ibz deal). I like it as it keeps the neck position warmth most of us like yet it's still clear (e.g. good with open chords), and single note stuff is fat. Have the stock, polished A5 in it.

 

[JamesPaul]

Okay off topic and probably not going to happen..

I would absolutely love, even pay, for a chart that compares and contrasts pups and magnet changes.

...

You need to lead the charge Bro!!! Put one together!

 

[orpheo]

Don't forget the 59/J hybrid , which is, as you might imagine, between the two donors.

I built a pair years ago and continue to rock one in my Roadstar (basswood, 25.5 scale, you know the Ibz deal). I like it as it keeps the neck position warmth most of us like yet it's still clear (e.g. good with open chords), and single note stuff is fat. Have the stock, polished A5 in it.

I agree, the 59Jazz hybrid (2x bridge) is an amazing, allround neck pickup. It has the woody character of the 59 and the fluid transparency of the Jazz.

Make a 59N/JazzN hybrid, though, add an alnico II and you get such a sweet, smooth, clear tone that sings and has an almost singlecoil like voice under high gain.

I have been advocating for these 2 pickups for years (with a pearly/custom hybrid, jb/fullshred hybrid amongst others). The guys at the factory of SD loved them, but SD moves slower than tectonic plates, so this will just never happen.