A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

[GuitarGuy503]

Just curious if any of you guys A/B amps as I keep coming back to replacing my Mesa Roadster. The Roadster is a great amp, although, there is much more to be desired in the clean department not to mention I find myself trying to replicate pushed mode on my Roadster. Having said that, I am looking at getting a Mini Rectifier 25 Head to run through my Mesa Horizontal 2x12 Cab for dirt and a Deluxe Reverb for cleans. I desperately wanted to find the perfect amp (or something close) but am being reminded more and more that it's not going to happen as there seems to always be a compromise somewhere (in regards to clean and dirt. Any A/Bers on the SD Forum?..... pcorn:

 

[James Rock]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

If I had the money I would cos I love vox cleans and nothing else can come close to that sound but would like more versatility (maybe a fender deluxe reverb).

 

[Bludave]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

Just curious if any of you guys A/B amps as I keep coming back to replacing my Mesa Roadster. The Roadster is a great amp, although, there is much more to be desired in the clean department not to mention I find myself trying to replicate pushed mode on my Roadster. Having said that, I am looking at getting a Mini Rectifier 25 Head to run through my Mesa Horizontal 2x12 Cab for dirt and a Deluxe Reverb for cleans. I desperately wanted to find the perfect amp (or something close) but am being reminded more and more that it's not going to happen as there seems to always be a compromise somewhere (in regards to clean and dirt. Any A/Bers on the SD Forum?..... pcorn:

I have been A/Bing amps for quite some time. My first run at this was a Marshall 900 combo A/B'd with a Fender Super Reverb. I had a CE2, DD3, TS9 running into the Super Reverb and the Marshall had a DODTR3 running through the loop. The TR3 had delay & Chorus as well as OD. I never really used the OD. I also had a Blues breaker pedal pushing the Marshall. The Marshall is channel switching and the Fender wasn't so this gave me many tonal options. All of this came together to a Morley A/B/Y box (which really sucked). I had issues with one side bleeding to the other. The type of A/B box is important. Probably the best one out there is a Lehle A/B/Y. It has ground loop transformers built into it & virtually eliminates any bleeding from one side to the other. I wish I had known about this earlier and I would have gotten one. I eventually replaced the Morley with a Loopmaster A/B/Y and I added a HumX on each amp to eliminate as much hum as possible. NOw I am A/Bing a Bogner Shiva & a Komet 60. It is tonal Bliss! Some of the effects have changed as well but what this allows me to do is for example I can have the Bogner in the clean channel playing all my Rhythm work & setup the komet for how I want to solo or the other way around. Works awesome.

The idea of using a Deluxe Reverb for cleans may or may not work for you. It depends on how loud you play. The Deluxe Reverb is NOT a very clean amp. At 22Watts it tends to overdrive early & can get pretty raunchy. I use a Deluxe Reverb when rehearsing with the band because I am deliberately trying to keep my volume down. I usually set the volume at 2.5 and use an OD pedal to boost it a bit. You may want to consider the Super Reverb. The Super is a much cleaner sounding amp. At 40Watts and 4 10" speakers it works beautiful with cleans and it takes pedals very well. The drawback is it is heavy to move from one location to another. The different frequency that different brands of amps works at can cause some significant hum regardless of what you do. Using the right A/B or A/B/Y is really the way to go. There are a lot of options today but when I did this initially there weren't too many options. Ground loop hum was/is a major concern and you really need to address it when A/Bing amps. The Lehle would be my choice today. Its pricey at about $300 dollars but it works really well and totally isolates one side from the other. As I said earlier this option was not available whe I initially set my amp system up. I am using a loopmaster A/B/Y as well as the Humx to minimize a lot of noise!

 

[jeremy]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

i used to use a fender twin for cleans and a jcm 800 half stack for dirty tones. sounded awesome but hauling that around was too much of a pita on a regular basis.

like bludave said, your choice of a/b box is very important, especially if you want the Y option of running them both at the same time

 

[briggleman]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

OK, the only amp that has made me want to switch from my Mesa obsession has been the Blackstar HD club 40. Take that and smoke it, see what it does for you!

Just for spit and giggles, get in front of that amp and really hear what it can do.... A/B the hell out of it. That thing goes from ultra clean to down and dirty with a flick of the switch. The best part, you can control that clean and dirt progression. The Clean can go to just the edge of breakup and your playing can really be heard at the clean edge. Yes, I am talking about an amp that can do both well, forget two amps and find one that does it all.

OK, just my little "ol" opinion, and just that!:wall:

Brad

 

[GuitarGuy503]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

The idea of using a Deluxe Reverb for cleans may or may not work for you. It depends on how loud you play. The Deluxe Reverb is NOT a very clean amp. At 22Watts it tends to overdrive early & can get pretty raunchy. I use a Deluxe Reverb when rehearsing with the band because I am deliberately trying to keep my volume down. I usually set the volume at 2.5 and use an OD pedal to boost it a bit. You may want to consider the Super Reverb. The Super is a much cleaner sounding amp. At 40Watts and 4 10" speakers it works beautiful with cleans and it takes pedals very well. The drawback is it is heavy to move from one location to another. The different frequency that different brands of amps works at can cause some significant hum regardless of what you do. Using the right A/B or A/B/Y is really the way to go. There are a lot of options today but when I did this initially there weren't too many options. Ground loop hum was/is a major concern and you really need to address it when A/Bing amps. The Lehle would be my choice today. Its pricey at about $300 dollars but it works really well and totally isolates one side from the other. As I said earlier this option was not available whe I initially set my amp system up. I am using a loopmaster A/B/Y as well as the Humx to minimize a lot of noise!

Thanks for the info. We will see what happens as I have yet to get my hands on one of the MIni Rectifiers (seen some good clips of it though). I think I just need to get my hands on one and see how the clean sounds with my touch and go from there. I may be jumping the gun a bit.... I guess I'm just trying to plan ahead a bit if by chance the Minis clean doesn't cut it for me. At the very least I can totally see buying a reverb unit for it to go with it. Having said that, do you guys know of any GOOD reverb units? Is there anything that does a good job of modeling tube driven reverb? If not what are some of the best reverb units?

 

[GuitarGuy503]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

i used to use a fender twin for cleans and a jcm 800 half stack for dirty tones. sounded awesome but hauling that around was too much of a pita on a regular basis.

Yeah that is why I was hesitant to a/b amps before settling on the Roadster. What a drag If I ever jammed with anyone outside my house. :blackeye: This is another reason I like the idea downsizing my rig though.... Portability....

 

[GuitarGuy503]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

OK, the only amp that has made me want to switch from my Mesa obsession has been the Blackstar HD club 40. Take that and smoke it, see what it does for you!

Just for spit and giggles, get in front of that amp and really hear what it can do.... A/B the hell out of it. That thing goes from ultra clean to down and dirty with a flick of the switch. The best part, you can control that clean and dirt progression. The Clean can go to just the edge of breakup and your playing can really be heard at the clean edge. Yes, I am talking about an amp that can do both well, forget two amps and find one that does it all.

OK, just my little "ol" opinion, and just that!:wall:

Brad

Being a Rectifier lover since the early 2000s I have been doing everything in my power to stick with them. Having said that, I don't think I could leave them. I'll admit that I left briefly to give a Marshall DSL50 a chance (looking for decent cleans) and came back back to the Rectifer line hoping that the Roadster would satisy my desire for good cleans upon the realization that the Marshall dirt wasn't "me". In all the years I've played I've gotten attached and comfortable with the rectos that they have always been my go to amps even when at the music store.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

I left briefly to give a Marshall DSL50 a chance (looking for decent cleans)

...thats a new one!


to the OP - no amp does all things to perfection. Just work out whats your most important tonal priority and work from there.

Bludave is right about the deluxe reverb of course - its not super clean. Its defintiely sexy, but maybe not what you after. And Jeremy has outlined the problems of A/B amp set ups for gigs. I have a couple of nice fender amps and a nice marshall -which is great for recording, but carrying two powerful amps to a gig? not for me thanks. While pedals are a compromise, i can get plenty of great sounds with them thru one amp.

What is it you dont like about your boogie cleans? Have you tried experimenting with the tubes - or possibly even the speakers?

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

I grew tired of multi amp setups a long time ago, mostly because of ground loop problems and moving all of it. For example, you may have no grounding problems in one place, then a loud hum somewhere else....depending on their electricity.

I just prefer multi channel amps where each channel is good on it's own merit.....not a compromise compared to single channel amps. Amps like the Shiva, Fender Supersonic, Alchemist, Egnater Tweaker 40 & 80, Mesa Stiletto etc.

 

[Bludave]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

Thanks for the info. We will see what happens as I have yet to get my hands on one of the MIni Rectifiers (seen some good clips of it though). I think I just need to get my hands on one and see how the clean sounds with my touch and go from there. I may be jumping the gun a bit.... I guess I'm just trying to plan ahead a bit if by chance the Minis clean doesn't cut it for me. At the very least I can totally see buying a reverb unit for it to go with it. Having said that, do you guys know of any GOOD reverb units? Is there anything that does a good job of modeling tube driven reverb? If not what are some of the best reverb units?

I use a Verbzilla with my Komet and it as good(well almost) as my fenders. Its a very good simulation of rel spring. I have not used many others other then the reverb tanks in my Fender & Bogner, but the olf Fender Reverb units were pretty awesome..

 

[Bludave]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

Well if you consider hauling a Super reverb vrs a head and cab, which would you prefer to haul? I agree it is a lot of stuff to carry & quite honestly most of the places I play my Deluxe Reverb is sufficient volume wise its just not getting the tone I am after.

 

[CapoFirstFret]

Re: A new direction..... A/Bing amps........

to the OP - no amp does all things to perfection. Just work out whats your most important tonal priority and work from there.

Here's where I'll disagree but only slightly. I've never heard an amp, vintage or modern, boutique or mass produced, ptp or pcb, cheap or expensive, do the things that a Bogner Shiva does with such perfection. I'm still a bit mind-boggled as to why I don't own one but I guess I've been pretty content with my Super Reverb + TS9/Fulldrive 2.