Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

[p4vl]

I really hate high-output neck pickups, it's one of the reasons that I'll never go back to Active pickups.

I have a custom wound PAF set by Jon Baxter, of which, I only use the neck humbucker (I love low-output neck hb). I got them from some guy on the Trading Post forum for a pedal, so the pickups weren't custom wound for my guitar (RG2550 B standard tuning).

The neck HB originally came with an Alnico 4 magnet, which was very bland. I put an Alnico 5 in but it still feels weak and too bright (I have the same problem with the TB6 in the bridge, the middle position of the toggle is just unusable).


Sorry if this is a dumb question, I just really hate undoing tremolo springs and removing pickguard screws just to switch a stupid magnet.

 

[CTN]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

not quite a paf... but I tried an A8 in a Dimarzio Humbucker from hell once, just for jokes. It was in the neck position.

It sounded terrible.

as far as the A5 sounding weak, have you tried raising the height of the pickup?

 

[GuitarDoc]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

The only magnet that will give you what you want (stronger, fuller, less highs) is an A8.

No need to remove springs to change a magnet.

You say you love low output pups in the neck, but you are complaining about it being too weak and bright. Generally speaking, those are the very characteristics of low output (PAF) pups. It's like saying..."I love small red cars but I don't like how small they are and I don't like the color red".

 

[CTN]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

^that's what I was thinking too....

 

[idsnowdog]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

You could try an A2, A6 or A8 in your existing pickup. The A2P is the darkest and fullest sounding neck pickup from SD that I can think of.

 

[p4vl]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

The only magnet that will give you what you want (stronger, fuller, less highs) is an A8.

No need to remove springs to change a magnet.

You say you love low output pups in the neck, but you are complaining about it being too weak and bright. Generally speaking, those are the very characteristics of low output (PAF) pups. It's like saying..."I love small red cars but I don't like how small they are and I don't like the color red".

I like low output neck pickups because when combined with high output bridge humbuckers it makes dual humbucker guitar much more flexible (and there's a difference between a neck pickup that can do sweet cleans and singing 'solos' and a pickup that is shrill and/or has no balls).

The Baxter Neck PAF w/A5 sounds increasingly shrill when I push it towards the strings and if I back it off there's just nothing there. I have an Agile LP copy that has a PAF-style BG Bucker that is at medium distance from the strings and the tone I get from that pickup in that guitar gives me wood, so I'm sure that I haven't found the right pickup yet.

I've got an Alnico 2 mag hanging around, would that be a better swap in an Ibby RG? Most descriptions refer to the lows as 'spongy' but better for taming bright pickups. Mind you, I'm tuned to B standard but when I use the neck pickup I tend to only use the upper 5 strings like a guitar tuned to E standard.

Oh, and I remove the Tremolo Springs so I can remove the bridge from the cavity and not bother with changing the strings. I've got one of those hooks from Stewmac that helps to pull the springs back into place but it's still a pain in the ass.

 

[orpheo]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

I used an alnico8 in a jazz n (or, alnico8pro neck if you will ).Sounded terrific. More power, more beef and a bit 'honky' in the highs which made the pup sound as if you've got a wah halfway open, just like Michael Schenker.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

Rather than use such an inappropriate magnet in the neck slot (warm and high output), why not just use a different magnet? That's what the rest of the world usually does.

 

[p4vl]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

Rather than use such an inappropriate magnet in the neck slot (warm and high output), why not just use a different magnet? That's what the rest of the world usually does.

Why not mention what magnet would be appropriate? That's what the rest of the world does when they appeal to the bandwagon.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

Why not mention what magnet would be appropriate? That's what the rest of the world does when they appeal to the bandwagon.

A5's are the most common alnico in neck HB's, because of the sharp high end and firm low end. Followed by A4 (balanced EQ), A3 (lots of mids and a rounded high end), and A2 (lots of mids and texture, and not much treble). All of these are infinitely better neck magnets than A8's. You have to be playing some really extreme music to use an A8 in the neck. Just too dark and powerful.

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

A5's are the most common alnico in neck HB's, because of the sharp high end and firm low end. Followed by A4 (balanced EQ), A3 (lots of mids and a rounded high end), and A2 (lots of mids and texture, and not much treble). All of these are infinitely better neck magnets than A8's. You have to be playing some really extreme music to use an A8 in the neck. Just too dark and powerful.

If your really going to do your band wagon appeal you should list A5, A2, Ceramic... then anything else. Outside of the handful of mag heads around here who swap there are few people who use A4 and A3 at all, further more there are very few production pickups that come with A3's and A4's, I can count the number of A3 pickups on half a hand I know of at least a half dozen with ceramic neck pickups.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

If your really going to do your band wagon appeal you should list A5, A2, Ceramic... then anything else. Outside of the handful of mag heads around here who swap there are few people who use A4 and A3 at all, further more there are very few production pickups that come with A3's and A4's, I can count the number of A3 pickups on half a hand I know of at least a half dozen with ceramic neck pickups.

Still counts when there are production PU's with those other magnets, and they're gaining in popularity. Gibson's using A3's in some PAF's now, and Fralin's used A4's for years in his. I've yet to hear of any production neck HB with an A8. Seeing how popular A8's have become on this forum for the bridge slot, they would also seem to be the most unpopular neck magnet. They have qualities a number of players like for bridge PU's, but apparently precious few want those in their neck PU's. That's why I don't understand trying to make an A8 work in the neck slot, especially for someone who 'hates high-output neck PU's.'

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

Still counts when there are production PU's with those other magnets, and they're gaining in popularity. Gibson's using A3's in some PAF's now, and Fralin's used A4's for years in his. I've yet to hear of any production neck HB with an A8. Seeing how popular A8's have become on this forum for the bridge slot, they would also seem to be the most unpopular neck magnet. They have qualities a number of players like for bridge PU's, but apparently precious few want those in their neck PU's. That's why I don't understand trying to make an A8 work in the neck slot, especially for someone who 'hates high-output neck PU's.'

Thats not how an "argumentum ad populum" works. This sure wasnt the crux of your post that I replied to. My post as well as your 2nd post had nothing to do with the suitability of A8. My issue was you suggesting that A3 and A4 were more popular than A2 or even ceramic, Which is just plain not true.

As far as the OP goes I think people didnt read his post so well. He plays tuned to B and he thinks the SH6 is too bright... Simply put the guitar seems that it itself is very bright. The dude needs a BBQ in the neck.

 

[p4vl]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

As far as the OP goes I think people didnt read his post so well. He plays tuned to B and he thinks the SH6 is too bright... Simply put the guitar seems that it itself is very bright. The dude needs a BBQ in the neck.

I had a BBQ in the bridge of a LP copy once. I'm not extremely well versed on the nature of 'compression' but that thing was highly compressed.

In case I've not made it clear, this PAF was not a production model pickup; it's a custom wind for the previous owner's custom made guitar that may have had darker tonewoods, one that needed highs and had enough natural low end, which is why the A5 is so shrill. The A8 is kind of a last stop before I look into buying another PAF.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

Thats not how an "argumentum ad populum" works. This sure wasnt the crux of your post that I replied to. My post as well as your 2nd post had nothing to do with the suitability of A8. My issue was you suggesting that A3 and A4 were more popular than A2 or even ceramic, Which is just plain not true.

I was speaking in terms of alnicos, which is why ceramics weren't mentioned, and my listing of alnicos was numerical, not in popularity. I thought all of that was obvious, must not have been. Being a big PAF fan (as you know), I'm well aware that there's far more A2's in current production PAF's than A4's and A3's. Seemed like that would be overstating the obvious. If you weren't arguing with me, you'd probably have a lot of time on your hands to kill. It's a good thing I'm here to fill up your day.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

I had a BBQ in the bridge of a LP copy once. I'm not extremely well versed on the nature of 'compression' but that thing was highly compressed.

In case I've not made it clear, this PAF was not a production model pickup; it's a custom wind for the previous owner's custom made guitar that may have had darker tonewoods, one that needed highs and had enough natural low end, which is why the A5 is so shrill. The A8 is kind of a last stop before I look into buying another PAF.

I'd be looking at other PAF's. There's a lot of good ones made these days, in a variety of 'flavors.' .

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

I had a BBQ in the bridge of a LP copy once. I'm not extremely well versed on the nature of 'compression' but that thing was highly compressed.

In case I've not made it clear, this PAF was not a production model pickup; it's a custom wind for the previous owner's custom made guitar that may have had darker tonewoods, one that needed highs and had enough natural low end, which is why the A5 is so shrill. The A8 is kind of a last stop before I look into buying another PAF.

The A8 doesnt really lack highs... A2 is more likely to work but from what you have said it sounds like you got the wrong wind... Basically you have a knife and you need a file so your trying to force it into a job it wasnt designed to do.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

Generally speaking, A8s seldom match well with a low wind like a PAF. Powerful magnets like A8 or ceramic seem to be better suited to pickups with more wire. That being said, there's no rule that says you can't try it. Until you mentioned your concern about spongy tone, I would've suggested A2 too. So, A3 maybe? Still warmer than A8s, which I think sound like an A5 with more mids. I tend not to like too midrangey a neck tone myself, but that's just my personal taste.

Since you have an A2 on hand, why not drop it in to see- the bright nature of both pickup and guitar could firm up the A2's natural chewiness. It sounds as if this particular humbucker probably has some coil offset, so compression shouldn't be much of an issue for you. It's worth a couple of minutes hassle with the trem springs. And you might like it. If you don't, I'd say go with an A3 next. Definitely a bit tighter in the low end, though slightly more nasal also, I think.

PS: If you eventually do wind up trying an A8, please report back and let us know how you like it.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

So, A3 maybe? Still warmer than A8s

A8's are warmer than A3's. A3's are the next brightest alnico after A5's.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: Anyone ever tried an Alnico 8 in a PAF Neck HB backed away from the strings?

I have a Jon Baxter custom wound set .

The only Jon Baxter set with A4 mags Is the Diablo Grande, which has almost the same specs as the Duncan Distortion set.

Assuming that's the one you have, I'd like to suggest an A3 in the neck and an A2 in the bridge. IME, that'll get you closer to the tone you're after.

Having said that, I think you'll be better off with a new set of p'ups of another brand.

HTH,