Bad Trader Alert

[J Moose]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

I really hate doing this but I gotta do this;

Yesterday I traded my green '62 Reissue Strat to a dude named Mike Mahr who lives in Huntington, LI for this Tele that he posted for sale a few weeks back. I'm mentioning this because I can't remember his posting name here & some of ya'll might remember this plank;

There were no problems getting him on the phone and we talked about the guitars for a while and had verbally agreed to an approval period of an undetermined amount of time. Mike said; "If you don't like it I'll take it back."

All seemed well & my Spidey sense hadn't gone off so we set up the time & place to do the deed. I met him in NYC on 5/7 around noon and by 2am (still same day IMO) I had decided that this Tele isn’t anything I’m really into, so I shot him an email saying as much and got this response;

-----Original Message-----
From: M7 [mailto:M7M@earthlink.net]
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 7:05 AM
To: J. Moose | Moose Audio
Subject: Re: Trade?

Hey Moose sorry to say the strat is gone. I can't really do anything about it at this point. And at the moment I'm not in a position to buy back the tele.
-Mike-

WTF?!?! Did he leave the Strat on the train or something?!? The Strat is gone...yet he can't buy back the Tele?!?!?!?

I’ll deal with this…and it's not that its a "bad" guitar but honestly, I'm just not diggin' this Tele and I did swap him so this Tele is most likely going to be sold as-is or parted out soon.

Mike, if you read this...I'd like to try & settle this somehow. At the VERY least I feel I'm owed an explanation.

 

[seafoamer]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

and had verbally agreed to an approval period of an undetermined amount of time.

I've never heard of something lyke this???

 

[J Moose]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

I've never heard of something lyke this???

We left it open but talked about a few days or weeks being a "resonable" period. I made up my mind in about 12 hours & it sounds like he made up his in even less...

 

[big_black]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

It doesn't sound like he had any intention of honoring the deal. Maybe he'll come back and explain himself.

Sucks man.

 

[J Moose]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

It doesn't sound like he had any intention of honoring the deal. Maybe he'll come back and explain himself.

Sucks man.

He did reply to the email I sent him asking WTF happened to the Strat...he said he traded it that afternoon.

Yeah. Ok. That's why he asked me to put a specific set of pickups in there & string it with "his" guages because 'that's what he prefers playing.'

Oh, and BTW...did I mention I have a bridge for sale in NY? :eek13:

Anyway...I DID hold that '68 mongral in my own hands & walked away with it...and I STILL feel that its a better Tele then that green Strat ever was a Strat, but I was counting on his word that we could trade back.

He also misrepresented the condition of the guitars body to me. Yeah, he did say it was cracked & had been repaired but never disclosed (verbally or in pictures) the REAL size of the crack or that the repair was mediocre at best...or that some of the rash & what looked like exposed wood from dings was actually wood putty!!!

Regardless, it's still not a bad guitar & actually kind of cool...but I'd have to sink a buttload of cash into the thing to make it something I'd use as a first string instrument.

It might all work out though...that Tele is worth more in parts then the Strat & I know a guy who wants to trade me the Tele for his '73 hardtail Strat mongral which was put together & refretted by an old friend who passed on recently. I saw that thing at his house last night & immediatly recognized the hardtail...hadn't seen it in about 10 years!

Everything happens for a reason...but I still wouldn't do business with Mike Mahr again.

 

[pedalinbob]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

I sold an Evolution to IBANEZRGONFIRE. He has received the pickup, and stated he does not like the sound on Jemsite.

He stated he sent payment on 6/6.
I have not received this payment, which was to be a postal money order.

Via E-mail, he denies any wrongdoing.

I am very suspicious. If payment arrives, I will formally apologize to him, and rescind this post.

We entered into a contract, I expect him to honor it.

To IBANEZRGONFIRE, if you read this, it is your duty, if you truly sent the payment, to ascertain whether there was a problem.
If necessary, you should cancel the money order, and issue another.

UPDATE: mail came today, and no payment.

Bob

 

[Ibanezrgonfire]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

I sold an Evolution to IBANEZRGONFIRE. He has received the pickup, and stated he does not like the sound on Jemsite.

He stated he sent payment on 6/6.
I have not received this payment, which was to be a postal money order.

Via E-mail, he denies any wrongdoing.

I am very suspicious. If payment arrives, I will formally apologize to him, and rescind this post.

We entered into a contract, I expect him to honor it.

To IBANEZRGONFIRE, if you read this, it is your duty, if you truly sent the payment, to ascertain whether there was a problem.
If necessary, you should cancel the money order, and issue another.

UPDATE: mail came today, and no payment.

Bob

Bob i have been sending you emails about this situation to try to resolve it?
no one is trying to rip you off!

 

[Ibanezrgonfire]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

The evolution pup has been shipped back to pedalinbob
I reported the money order stolen/lost so it cannot be cashed now

 

[Hoss]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

He did reply to the email I sent him asking WTF happened to the Strat...he said he traded it that afternoon.

Yeah. Ok. That's why he asked me to put a specific set of pickups in there & string it with "his" guages because 'that's what he prefers playing.'

Oh, and BTW...did I mention I have a bridge for sale in NY? :eek13:

Anyway...I DID hold that '68 mongral in my own hands & walked away with it...and I STILL feel that its a better Tele then that green Strat ever was a Strat, but I was counting on his word that we could trade back.

He also misrepresented the condition of the guitars body to me. Yeah, he did say it was cracked & had been repaired but never disclosed (verbally or in pictures) the REAL size of the crack or that the repair was mediocre at best...or that some of the rash & what looked like exposed wood from dings was actually wood putty!!!

Regardless, it's still not a bad guitar & actually kind of cool...but I'd have to sink a buttload of cash into the thing to make it something I'd use as a first string instrument.

It might all work out though...that Tele is worth more in parts then the Strat & I know a guy who wants to trade me the Tele for his '73 hardtail Strat mongral which was put together & refretted by an old friend who passed on recently. I saw that thing at his house last night & immediatly recognized the hardtail...hadn't seen it in about 10 years!

Everything happens for a reason...but I still wouldn't do business with Mike Mahr again.

whoa man...i'm sorry this turned out like that...i remember him sending me an e-mail awhile back wanting to know if i wanted to trade him my p-bass for that tele....i felt it was a little suspect and never even considered it...?! :smack:

 

[Mike7]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

It has come to my attention that "Moose" has posted this "bad trader"

Originally Posted by J Moose
He did reply to the email I sent him asking WTF happened to the Strat he said he traded it that afternoon.
Yeah. Ok. That's why he asked me to put a specific set of pickups in there & string it with his guages because that's what he prefers playing.
Oh and BTW did I mention I have a bridge for sale in NY?
Anyway I DID hold that 68 mongral in my own hands & walked away with it and I STILL feel that its a better Tele then that green Strat
ever was a Strat, but I was counting on his word that we could trade back.
He also misrepresented the condition of the guitars body to me. Yeah he did say it was cracked & had been repaired but never disclosed
(verbally or in pictures) the REAL size of the crack or that the repair was mediocre at best or that some of the rash & what looked like
exposed wood from dings was actually wood putty


Now of course I see it a little bit different from the way he describes it, here is one of of his emails to me

-- Original Message --
From: J. Moose | Moose Audio
Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 3:30 AM
Subject: RE: Trade?
Hey there Mike,
Yeah...I think I could be down for that! Even swap? I remember seeing that thing in the Duncan classifieds a few weeks back and lovin’ it.

And in his own words; "I DID hold that '68 mongral in my own hands & walked away with it...and I STILL feel that its a better Tele then that green Strat ever was a Strat" "It might all work out though...that Tele is worth more in parts then the Strat & I know a guy who wants to trade me the
Tele for his '73 hardtail Strat mongral"

My email to him after he decided he wasn't happy with the tele;

"Hey Moose, I can see we do seem to have some differences of what is happening. I'm sorry to hear you are not liking the tele, but unfortunately I am no longer in possession of the strat. I traded it the same afternoon I got it from you. I did send you detailed photos before we met and we did meet in person, you held the tele in your own hands and I asked you if it was a good guitar for you, you said
yes and added something about the "vibe" it had. I know at times trading can be unsettling if you decide you don't really want what you traded for. But you even commented on the tele when I posted it for sale the first time saying what a cool tele you thought it was. At this point as I said before there is really nothing I can do at my end, I no longer own the strat. I am sorry you are not happy with the tele.
Regards
-Mike-"

As far as asking for pickups and strings the only thing I said was I wanted pickups in the guitar and I would like to have strings on it, and by his own admission WE MET IN PERSON, HE HELD IT IN HIS OWN HANDS, AND WALKED AWAY WITH IT, further more I ASKED IF IT WAS A GOOD GUITAR FOR HIM, HE SAID YES, so at that point we traded. Now in all my previous trading and I'll admit I've only traded
maybe 6 or 7 times, once you trade the piece is yours. I didn't say I would hold it for any specific amount of time so Moose could decide if he liked the tele or not, and if I decided to trade it, sell it or give it as a gift to friend wasn't it my property to do with as I wanted at that time. Once we traded
the guitar was mine or is that not how it works with Moose?As far as taking the guitar back when Moose decided he didn't like it I would have liked to, but as I said I no longer had the strat, and Moose you should feel lucky, that strat was a dog, the tele was a better guitar anyday of the week, as you said yourself in your post. So the real question I would think is not why didn't I trade back, even though I answered that one, but why Moose never told me what a dog the strat was before we traded? Had he told the truth I never would have traded the tele, it may have been old, beat up, gluded back together
(all of which I told him in advance), but it was a tone machine.

 

[pedalinbob]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

The evolution pup has been shipped back to pedalinbob
I reported the money order stolen/lost so it cannot be cashed now

I am very tired, so please disregard any typos, improper tense, etc.

I posted an Evolution pickup here.
IBANEZRGONFIRE wanted it, stating he would send a USPS money order.
I agreed, and sent the pickup on 6/6/06. He stated he sent the money order on the same day.

By 6/12, I had not received the payment, and we were e-mailing and PM'ing each other.
He stated he sent me an e-mail at 10am, which I never received.
He showed the address that he had sent the payment to: all was correct, BUT, my street address was off by a single letter.
It is a common mistake, but I still get my mail.

On 6/12, He posted that he did not like the EVO in the Jemsite pickups forum. He also posted the Evolution for sale on Jemsite. I discovered the posts on 6/13, and countered them.
I also posted a "Bad Trader" alert on Seymour Duncan.

6/14: After my tactical responses on both Jemsite and SD, he replies to my post on SD, and e-mails me stating that usually if a MO is stolen or lost, they return to sender (this is blatantly incorrect). He stated he could not afford another $40 (YES, I sold the EVO for $40 shipped), and would return the pickup.
I agreed to this arrangement.

As an aside, he had posted another pickup for sale on the Duncan site on 6/9, which I discovered on 6/14...I replied to his post asking if he would accept a USPS money order.

He didn't like the comment. I discovered today that he posted item for sale on Jemsite as well.

I made clear in our various communications that I would clarify the issue when resolution occured: that happened today.

The pickup arrived in good cosmetic and working condition.
Thank you, IBANEZRGONFIRE.

However...I still have a few issues:
1. IBANEZRGONFIRE, you stated that the money order was lost or stolen. This is certainly a possibility.
Yet, the money order can be replaced for $3.15. You only need the receipt, which apparently you had, because you told me that you spoke with USPS, who determined the status of the MO...and you would certainly need the receipt to retrieve that info.

2. You stated you could not "afford another $40..." Please see the statement above. You did not need another $40, a refund was $3.15 away.
Do you claim that you did not know that a money order could be re-issued?
Perhaps...but when I called USPS, they immediately told me that one could be replaced easily.

3. Though I had not received payment, you had already posted the pickup for sale...NOT on the SD website where you purchased it, but on Jemsite.
Why, I wonder?

Well...IBANEZRGONFIRE joined Jemsite AND SD on 5/25/2006.
I had not posted on Jemsite since 5/20/2006, and he had not posted in any threads of which I was party.

He didn't think I would see him on Jemsite!
Funny how he immediately posted his impressions of the pup on Jemsite (he dislikes the Evo), and only posted the EVO for sale on Jemsite...but posted a nickel covered Duncan for sale at BOTH Jemsite and at the SD site.

You were strangely quiet on the SD forum regarding your view of the pup, all the while you were complaining about the pickup only on Jemsite.
Hiding from me, perhaps?

To the Jemsite and SD communities: look at his posts on SD and Jemsite...compare and contrast. What do you see?

I believe IBANEZRGONFIRE was trying to pull a fast one on me, and if nothing else, he was able to test the EVO for about $4, the cost to ship it back to me.
I am out $4 for shipping to him.

I intentionally did not insist upon reimbursement, nor did I mention the money order discrepancy because I didn't want to spook him, and possibly have him simply keep the pickup.

I posted this for the benefit of all at Jemsite and SD.
I will leave it up to the individual to decide what to believe.

Bob

 

[Ibanezrgonfire]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

I believe IBANEZRGONFIRE was trying to pull a fast one on me, and if nothing else, he was able to test the EVO for about $4, the cost to ship it back to me.
I am out $4 for shipping to him.

I intentionally did not insist upon reimbursement, nor did I mention the money order discrepancy because I didn't want to spook him, and possibly have him simply keep the pickup.

I posted this for the benefit of all at Jemsite and SD.
I will leave it up to the individual to decide what to believe.

Bob

Bob you can certainly think whatever you want that is your right.
but i must say this i am very sorry you go through life thinking things like this
I dont know who actually ripped you off before in the past but man it made you paranoid or something?
this was a pup sale that had a lost M.O involved and major miscommunication and nothing else.
certainly not a conspiracy as you have made it to be!:smack:

 

[big_black]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

Lesson 1:

Never ship until payment has been received.

 

[pedalinbob]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

Lesson 1:

Never ship until payment has been received.

Yes...lesson learned!

IBANEZRGONFIRE: yes, I am aware that it might possibly have been a mix-up.

Does possible = probable? I am not sure. I merely documented the transaction, and gave my opinion of the issue. Others may see it differently, and that is up to them.

Again, I thank you for returning the pickup.

Bob

 

[Ibanezrgonfire]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

Yes...lesson learned!

IBANEZRGONFIRE: yes, I am aware that it might possibly have been a mix-up.

Does possible = probable? I am not sure. I merely documented the transaction, and gave my opinion of the issue. Others may see it differently, and that is up to them.

Again, I thank you for returning the pickup.

Bob

I got my money back and you got your pup back thats the main thing.
ironically the post office told me the odds of a lost or stolen M.O are very small so it was just both our unfortunate luck that the one i sent you was not delivered.
also i would like to say that even though i totally understand what you did with the posting here and jemsite i have to state it was quite a bit premature
ONLY 6 days passed and you already were very suspicious and doubting me.
I had sent a email to you that you said you never got(that just like the MO not showing up IT CAN and DOES happen)
stating that if we can give it a day or two more and the payment still does not show up i would be more than happy to send you another $40 or your pup back.
by the time i had reached you via duncan PM's and not the emails you ALREADY had me as a bad trader here and had also had the jemsite guys involved.
lets just say by then i was just plain PISSED OFF!
yeah i had put the evo up for sale because i did not like it and wanted to get something else. you would have been paid either way but when i saw how quickly and unpossitive you had me as a bad guy i did not take it very well so i figured at this point just send you back the pup and be done with it.
i also have learned some very valuable lessons i learned to make sure the seller has his payment FIRST then have he or she and ship the part that if i am not positive i will like a pup to buy a new one and use thier return/exchange policy
:smokin:

 

[Mr 9finger]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

I got my money back and you got your pup back thats the main thing.
ironically the post office told me the odds of a lost or stolen M.O are very small so it was just both our unfortunate luck that the one i sent you was not delivered.
also i would like to say that even though i totally understand what you did with the posting here and jemsite i have to state it was quite a bit premature
ONLY 6 days passed and you already were very suspicious and doubting me.
I had sent a email to you that you said you never got(that just like the MO not showing up IT CAN and DOES happen)
stating that if we can give it a day or two more and the payment still does not show up i would be more than happy to send you another $40 or your pup back.
by the time i had reached you via duncan PM's and not the emails you ALREADY had me as a bad trader here and had also had the jemsite guys involved.
lets just say by then i was just plain PISSED OFF!
yeah i had put the evo up for sale because i did not like it and wanted to get something else. you would have been paid either way but when i saw how quickly and unpossitive you had me as a bad guy i did not take it very well so i figured at this point just send you back the pup and be done with it.
i also have learned some very valuable lessons i learned to make sure the seller has his payment FIRST then have he or she and ship the part that if i am not positive i will like a pup to buy a new one and use thier return/exchange policy
:smokin:

WOW! I find something ironic here. You say you got your money back after less than 2 weeks. I find that a little odd. I have 3 different money orders receipts from postal money orders here and they have this little script on the back of them. You wanna know what they say? I quote

"This receipt is your guantee for a refund of your money order if it is lost or stolen, provided you fill in the Pay To and From information on the order in the space provided. No claim for improper payment permitted 2 years after payment. If your money order is lost or stolen, present this receipt and file a claim for a refund at your post office.

An inquiry for 6401 Form may be filed at any time for a fee. A replacement will not be issued until 60 days AFTER the money order purchase date, provided the money order has not been paid."

I'm calling bull pucky dude. You're just trying to talk yourself out of looking bad. There's no way you got your money back from the M/O so soon.

1. It hasn't even been 3 weeks since you purchased it. 21 days does not equal the 60 day requirement for a refund/replacement. Furthermore, even conveinance store money orders have at least a 30 day waiting period, that is if you can even get them to do anything for you.

2. You can not put a stop payment order on ANY KIND of money order. It's not like a personal check. All they can and will do is run a trace on the money order...BTW, a trace usually takes at least 3 days.

3. If you were so sure of yourself, why wouldn't you provide Bob w/ the # off the Money Order? I don't want to hear you lost the receipt either. You have to have either the section from the money order that you keep, or the original purchase receipt to get any kind of help from the P.O., they don't keep record of that stuff and you're basically screwed if you don't have it.

I think you were trying to take advantage of someone elses integrity and got nailed for it. Now you're back pedaling. Your comments don't add up and are impossible according to procedures of the post office or any other issuer of money orders.


BTW, I'm "The Furious One" on the Jemsite and many other forums. I'm the one that spoke up in Bobs defense on the Jemsite.

 

[pedalinbob]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

That's gonna leave a mark! :smokin:

Edit to add: I think we scared him away...no new posts here or on Jemsite.
How quaint.

Bob

 

[casblah]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

Just wanted to subscribe to this topic, so I'm typing some random words here. No problems with anybody, so far...

 

[MartinSixStringCustoms]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

If it were me, I'd be a little more than pissed.

 

[JeffB]

Re: Bad Trader Alert

I agree...I'd be pissed too...at the same time, how are we supposed to be warned?I'm not saying you need to divulge who it is, but it's kinda pointless to "warn" us when we've no idea who are talking about.

And why february?

At any rate, I hope things work out for ya. Raw deal ya got