California 50s set compared to...

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

noiseless Strat pickups don’t quite Get that tone

Which ones have you tried and for how long did you try them?

I'm 45, hear quite well up to 17kHz, know how to dial even the most finicky amps at any reasonably loud volume and think noiseless pickups can sound magnificent.

Eric Johnson could make anything sound good. That he has a fetish for true single coils shouldn't get in the way of making rational decisions about what tone works best for you. Clapton used Lace Golds for a while. Would you hold that against him?

 

[Mincer]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

I have to admit to liking the Classic Strat Stacks the best. I don't like noise, and never cared if I was getting the 'classic' sound- it is a sound I like, so it was good enough for me.

 

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Too many players get too caught up on whether something sounds like X, Y or Z without noticing that X, Y and Z are all moving targets.

By best advice is to ignore all zealotry (including that which comes from me).

Pickups are just tools to get a job done. If you feel encumbered by tools that others are able to use without faltering then I have nothing to offer but my condolences.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Which ones have you tried and for how long did you try them?

I'm 45, hear quite well up to 17kHz, know how to dial even the most finicky amps at any reasonably loud volume and think noiseless pickups can sound magnificent.

Eric Johnson could make anything sound good. That he has a fetish for true single coils shouldn't get in the way of making rational decisions about what tone works best for you. Clapton used Lace Golds for a while. Would you hold that against him?

This is something that has been discussed to the point of being barf-worthy.

Those of us who grew up with the real thing and want 100% of the sound, response and feel of the real thing use the real thing.

Those who are satisfied with less than 100% of the real thing for the sake of noiseless performance use something else.

Neither side is right or wrong.

I think Vintage style Strat pickups (either Duncan Surfers or Fralin Vintage Hots - those are my faves) coupled with the Ilitch System is the way I’ll go in my next Strat.

 

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Then go that way, Lew, and get off your high "the rest of you must settle for less than 100%" horse about it, already.

While you're at it, don't pretend that you ever gave any noiseless pickup a fair chance. If you did, tell me what it was and how long you used it. Otherwise I see no reason why anyone should take your appeals to authority seriously.

 

[AlexR]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

^ Others agree with Lew....me included. I have had a few stacks in my time......none of them did what I wanted either (edit - which was true singlecoil tone) Lew has said many times that he likes what he likes. And chooses his option based on what tone he wants to hear. Nothing has been said about it being 'inferior', merely having less of something that is desired.

You also contradict your own arguments with every successive post. Then you argue different points to what has been presented. When countering the 'noiseless sound different to true singles' you argue 'I find noiseless ok to my ears' which is NOT the same thing. You then wander wholly off the point with vague anectodes about other players preferences.
Its really a rather poor inadequacy thing really......or are you drunk??

 

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

I'm whatever you want to make me out to be. If you can't appreciate the tone of a noiseless pickup then don't use one. I honestly believe it's a psychological hangup, not unlike guys who think they can tell what brand of battery someone else is using in their TS-808.

The point is in the first post. I had the tamarity to suggest a 14 year old who wants a hotter than vintage bridge pickup might not like hum and recommend a noiseless pickup and then stones started flying.

How on earth have I contradicted myself?

 

[AlexR]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Contradiction - in the way we say choose your option and tone for what you like but you say we are not doing this.....then sprouting the very same thing in the next post.

Lew merely pointed out that the tone is a bit different to a proper singlecoil - and then you went off the deepend as if this insulted your sense of masculinity or something.


Seriously - maybe you need to have a break from the forum for a few hours as you are adding nothing.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

I will find out if he records through a DAW or something. If so I will recommend a noiseless set. Otherwise my recommendation will be the California set, perhaps with a SSL5 in the bridge.

When it comes to single coils I lean towards Seymour, and Lew has never steered me wrong when it comes to strats.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Thanks to everyone who has contributed here.

 

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Contradiction - in the way we say choose your option and tone for what you like but you say we are not doing this.....then sprouting the very same thing in the next post.

I imagine you meant, "That he has a fetish for true single coils shouldn't get in the way of making rational decisions about what tone works best for you." I'll be careful not to use "you" in the general sense next time.

Seriously - maybe you need to have a break from the forum for a few hours as you are adding nothing.

If you think I shouldn't post then don't engage me, especially in such a way as to bait me into a reply.
"Its really a rather poor inadequacy thing really......or are you drunk??" Give it a rest already.

If neither you, AlexR, nor Lew believe you can distinguish an authentic single from a stack as recorded by someone else then I owe either or each of you an apology. On its face 100% authentic tone is pretty meaningless. Psychology plays a significant role.

 

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

I will find out if he records through a DAW or something. If so I will recommend a noiseless set. Otherwise my recommendation will be the California set, perhaps with a SSL5 in the bridge.

When it comes to single coils I lean towards Seymour, and Lew has never steered me wrong when it comes to strats.

I apologize for being so defensive about the use of a noiseless pickup. I have had an SSL-6T and an SSL-2 for a long long time. They weren't terribly expensive and, to me, sound excellent.

 

[Discharged]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Gregory, real single coils and noise-less p'ups DO sound AND behave differently. In fact, the difference is so apparent, that you don't even need to make an A/B comparison. Just about anybody can tell the difference just by playing a couple of minutes.

I won't consider myself a strat player, but I quite often play'em both live and in studio due to the project leader's specific equirement, so I do need to be able to get "that strat sound" as requested, or I won't be called back for the next job. That's why I can share mine and many others' experience on the subject.

I've mostly used EMG SAs for the studio, but live I've used several noise-less p'ups, including Kinman Woodstocks, Lace Holy Grails, Duncan Classic Stacks, but you just can't beat the liveliness and dynamics a true single coil brings to the table. My all-time favorite set is the Zhangbucker Refin set, modded with three different polepiece spreads, custom stagger for maximum string output evenness, and a 5/2 bridge p'up. The final outcome was so great that for the first time I didn't need to use any form of compression, not live, not even in the studio!

Highly recommended!

/Peter

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

I’ll “see” you guys another day.

Gonna take another long break from the forum.

Life’s too short for this kind of stuff.

Thanks to all!

 

[Chistopher]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

I’ll “see” you guys another day.

Gonna take another long break from the forum.

Life’s too short for this kind of stuff.

Thanks to all!

I've been trying to make that same decision myself.

 

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Respectfully, there is more to tone than just a pickup. The specific guitar will have an influence, as will what is on the other end of the cable. The person doing the driving plays the ultimate role in the final outcome.

Yes noiseless, or any unique formulation of single coil (traditional or non-traditional), for that matter, will sound different if everything else is held constant, but there is no requirement that everything else be held constant. So now the argument is over what is the best shade of gray, which is a completely subjective matter.

To argue right or wrong or less than 100% (of what exactly?) as if the issue is black and white is zealotry, plain and simple, which I find closed-minded and reprehensible.

 

[beaubrummels]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

DreX? Thanaton? Is that you?

 

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

DreX? Thanaton? Is that you?

Now you're just being a troll. Are you now going to chase me around in other discussions in which you didn't previously contribute, again?!?

I hate zealotry to the point that I'm a zealot about it. So in that sense I admit to being a hypocrite.

 

[beaubrummels]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Now you're just being a troll. Are you now going to chase me around in other discussions in which you didn't previously contribute, again?!?

I hate zealotry to the point that I'm a zealot about it. So in that sense I admit to being a hypocrite.

I don't chase anybody, certainly not you. I don't recall having much of any discussion with you prior. I just post when I see something. And I didn't call you out or quote you, so how do you know who I'm talking about? (Unless you have a guilty conscience.)

 

[gregory]

Re: California 50s set compared to...

Sigh.

Thanaton?

Yeah but they all did it by ear instead of a controlled laboratory test, mob logic at best, so maybe we should discount all those learned recommendations.

What's the matter? Don't like the mirror?