Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
- Thread starter BloodRose
- Start date
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
There are two types of Orange Drop caps as well, polyester (PS series) and polypropylene (715 and 716 series). They are different and may sound different as tone caps. Some people like the polyester type better, others like the polypropylene. So just referring to them as Orange Drops doesn't really tell what you are talking about.
Al
There are two types of Orange Drop caps as well, polyester (PS series) and polypropylene (715 and 716 series). They are different and may sound different as tone caps. Some people like the polyester type better, others like the polypropylene. So just referring to them as Orange Drops doesn't really tell what you are talking about.
Al
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
"Orange Drop" 715P and 716P are polypropylene film + foil caps. 716 have copper leads. 225P are polyester film + foil. Different construction than standard "metalized" PS or PP film caps. Do they sound any different? I can't hear a difference between the same values in a guitar.
I have a supply of the now discontinued axial 192P "Pacer" caps (PS film + foil) in 3 different values. Also, Mallory (PS film) and some "vintage" (probably 1960's) film and foils. All bought over the years for cheap. All lower voltage so they are relatively small and I don't have to wrestle fitting them into the cavities.
"Orange Drop" 715P and 716P are polypropylene film + foil caps. 716 have copper leads. 225P are polyester film + foil. Different construction than standard "metalized" PS or PP film caps. Do they sound any different? I can't hear a difference between the same values in a guitar.
I have a supply of the now discontinued axial 192P "Pacer" caps (PS film + foil) in 3 different values. Also, Mallory (PS film) and some "vintage" (probably 1960's) film and foils. All bought over the years for cheap. All lower voltage so they are relatively small and I don't have to wrestle fitting them into the cavities.
Last edited:
PFDarkside
of the Forum
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
If you are messing with cap type, I hope you have everything else dialed in. Pot values (measured to the value), cap value (with precision), wiring style (50’s vs modern), pickup height, even strings and picks. There’s a ton of variability there, not to mention having your pedals and amps dialed in as well before you get to capacitor construction.
If you are messing with cap type, I hope you have everything else dialed in. Pot values (measured to the value), cap value (with precision), wiring style (50’s vs modern), pickup height, even strings and picks. There’s a ton of variability there, not to mention having your pedals and amps dialed in as well before you get to capacitor construction.
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
Well, the other side of the filtered signal is going to the amp.....so you should be able to hear something done to that. A filtering affects both signals remember
Well, the other side of the filtered signal is going to the amp.....so you should be able to hear something done to that. A filtering affects both signals remember
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
In a guitars tone circuit the signal passing through the cap goes to ground. The lower the tone control is turned down, the more treble travels through the cap to ground. Signal to the output jack doesn't pass through the cap. Despite that, some claim to be able to hear a difference between different cap types of the same value. Those folks should buy whatever cap that they believe sounds the best.
In a guitars tone circuit the signal passing through the cap goes to ground. The lower the tone control is turned down, the more treble travels through the cap to ground. Signal to the output jack doesn't pass through the cap. Despite that, some claim to be able to hear a difference between different cap types of the same value. Those folks should buy whatever cap that they believe sounds the best.
ItsaBass
New member
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
Yes. But it should be mentioned that not all onboard passive tone controls are the typical type, which is a treble reduction control. Passive bass controls are becoming more common. In those, the extra low end that is filtered out is dissipated as heat, while the part that is not filtered out passes through the cap.
This is not to say that cap type matters in these circuits. It's just to say that all passive toe controls don't work the same way. Only the standard type works the way you described.
Yes. But it should be mentioned that not all onboard passive tone controls are the typical type, which is a treble reduction control. Passive bass controls are becoming more common. In those, the extra low end that is filtered out is dissipated as heat, while the part that is not filtered out passes through the cap.
This is not to say that cap type matters in these circuits. It's just to say that all passive toe controls don't work the same way. Only the standard type works the way you described.
Clint 55
OH THE DOUBLE THICK GLAZE!
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
Yes, very true. Thanks. I'm only referring to the most common tone circuit.
Yes, very true. Thanks. I'm only referring to the most common tone circuit.
ItsaBass
New member
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
Both types are passive.
The cap does the same job in each type (separates lower frequencies from higher ones), but it is placed in a different spot for each control, so the resulting effect on tone is different. In a passive treble control, it is placed on the way to the garbage can, i.e. ground. Therefore that high end that gets past it is what you *don't* hear in the end. In a passive bass control, it is placed on the way to the jack. Therefore the high end that gets past it is what you *do* hear in the end.
G&L's standard "Strat" wiring has, for years, consisted of master volume, master passive treble, and master passive bass. Reverend uses a similar control on some models; they call it bass contour. The relatively common "de-mud" mod is the same thing, but without the adjustability of a pot (though some people do it with internal mini "trim" pots, which gives you adjustability by opening up the control cavity and adjusting the mini pot).
Both types are passive.
The cap does the same job in each type (separates lower frequencies from higher ones), but it is placed in a different spot for each control, so the resulting effect on tone is different. In a passive treble control, it is placed on the way to the garbage can, i.e. ground. Therefore that high end that gets past it is what you *don't* hear in the end. In a passive bass control, it is placed on the way to the jack. Therefore the high end that gets past it is what you *do* hear in the end.
G&L's standard "Strat" wiring has, for years, consisted of master volume, master passive treble, and master passive bass. Reverend uses a similar control on some models; they call it bass contour. The relatively common "de-mud" mod is the same thing, but without the adjustability of a pot (though some people do it with internal mini "trim" pots, which gives you adjustability by opening up the control cavity and adjusting the mini pot).
Silence Kid
New member
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
Here's a pic of it happening.
(Coincidentally also demonstrates more caps = more tone, btw
The only rule.)
Here's a pic of it happening.
(Coincidentally also demonstrates more caps = more tone, btw
The only rule.)
Jeff_H
Dean Hardtail Fanologist
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
I just happen to prefer the Russian PIO caps personally, as long as they can be had for a couple of bucks. I'll pay a tad more to make sure they test to spec. I have just grown to like more vintage type parts and stuff. Personal preference totally. Orange drops, whichever variety, are perfectly fine any reliable. The only ones I refuse to use are the cheap ceramics. However, if that was all I could afford, I'm sure they would be ok.
I'm not paying $100 for any caps, unless they come from that guy with those magic beanstock beans.
I just happen to prefer the Russian PIO caps personally, as long as they can be had for a couple of bucks. I'll pay a tad more to make sure they test to spec. I have just grown to like more vintage type parts and stuff. Personal preference totally. Orange drops, whichever variety, are perfectly fine any reliable. The only ones I refuse to use are the cheap ceramics. However, if that was all I could afford, I'm sure they would be ok.
I'm not paying $100 for any caps, unless they come from that guy with those magic beanstock beans.
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
Always enjoy this conversation!
Interesting study that backs up "a capacitor is just a capacitor" with data...
http://zerocapcable.com/?page_id=224
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
Always enjoy this conversation!
Interesting study that backs up "a capacitor is just a capacitor" with data...
http://zerocapcable.com/?page_id=224
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
^ That one shows lines in subtly different places....when they are superimposed. So actually its saying there are differences (if the graphs are accurately drawn). But such differences are minor ones that may well not be at all observable in all/any case.
^ That one shows lines in subtly different places....when they are superimposed. So actually its saying there are differences (if the graphs are accurately drawn). But such differences are minor ones that may well not be at all observable in all/any case.
devastone
Well-known member
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
Those lines are closer than I would expect tolerances to be, so for a passive electronic component, they are essentially the same, you would not hear those differences. The more important thing to take away is that the shape is pretty much exactly the same for all of them.
If you like one type better than the other, by all means use them.
@Itsabass, I think I got confused with wording earlier since the passive high pass filters in guitars is normally called the "tone" control. If I read your description correctly, you mean passive "tone" controls consisting of treble (high pass) and bass (low pass) controls.
Those lines are closer than I would expect tolerances to be, so for a passive electronic component, they are essentially the same, you would not hear those differences. The more important thing to take away is that the shape is pretty much exactly the same for all of them.
If you like one type better than the other, by all means use them.
@Itsabass, I think I got confused with wording earlier since the passive high pass filters in guitars is normally called the "tone" control. If I read your description correctly, you mean passive "tone" controls consisting of treble (high pass) and bass (low pass) controls.
Last edited:
Jacew
New member
Re: Caps.. Orange drops vs oil?
Check the legend. Those lines follow exactly the real value of the capacitors. Lower the value, higher the level upper frequencies
Check the legend. Those lines follow exactly the real value of the capacitors. Lower the value, higher the level upper frequencies
