changing values on traynor - help

drew_half_empty

Looking for Real Life
ok so apparently for yba-1's like mine, the mods people do are changing the tone stack to jtm45 values, changing the 4 meg pots to 1 meg, changing the feedback return resistor from 100k to 47k, and putting a 330uf cap across V2

so i know what changing the tone stack would do, and what changing the volume pots would do, but what about the other ones?

would a 47k resistor mean more or less neg feedback put back in the circuit?

and the cap on V2? no idea what that'd do
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

'across' V2...? How you mean exactly?

I'd say it's between the cathode or ground? I'm not familiar with the JTM/Marshall typical circuit at all.

Less resistance = more of the original voltage being put into the feedback loop and tapped to the speakers. Or something like that. So with a presence pot you may be able to get a bit brighter...?


*waits for someone to tell me I'm wrong*
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

What years is it? I would start with the volume cap on volume 2 ( your bottom right input is the brite hi gain input, like a Marshall is on the upper left). There is a 1000 pf cap on that channel which is just too bright. Roll it back to 100- 500 pf cap, get several to try. As well as swap that pot out for a 1 meg, really makes a difference. All of my Traynors were different beasts in terms of what tweaks help them, so you really gotta use your ear and do one thing at a time. Some of mine like a bypass cap, some don't. Don't just change to change. Can you crank that amp? You really don't get to the goods until 6 or 7 on the dial, knowing what the amp sounds like opened up will greatly affect what mods you want to do. Tweak it and play it for a day or so and then go from there.
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

1972

and yeah i noticed the bright channel is WAAAY brighter than the normal one, but it's also annoying cause the tone controls all have really subtle effects, so yeah the tone stacks getting changed

as far as the neg feedback, well, i want as little put back in the circuit as possible (well out of those 2), so i don't think i'll be changing the feedback resistor

anyone care to confirm about the feedback resistor? or do i have it backwards?
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

Hey man I've got a 1970 yba1 and I've tweaked the circuit many times in many different ways, I can give you a bit of advice. I've got mine set up as a hot rodded 2204 right now but with that said kevlar3000 gave you some sound advice, they really are wonderful sounding amps with just a few tweaks, I wouldn't go crazy right off the bat. Mine sounds like the most pissed off marshall you've ever heard right now but I'll probably eventually take it back to being pretty close to stock and get a weber mass or something to keep it from being too deafening. I would do a few things first and see how you like it, I just clipped the bright cap out of mine because it was damn near painful, I would try using the 1meg volumes with no bright cap first and if you need it add a much smaller value like kevlar3000 suggested. For the tonestack I would use a 33k slope and a 500pf treble, otherwise the tonestack should be good, if you want more lower mids the I would keep a 47k slope(that's what mine had stock anyway). The 100k negative feedback resistor can be great, it gives you more power amp muscle and crunch but it does kinda limit sustain compaired to lower values, you can solder another 100k resistor across it to get 50k, that will be quick and easy and it will give you an idea which you like better, lower values will sound cleaner in terms of gain. Mine had 1.5k with a 150uf for both of the input stages cathodes, it actually sounded ok but it's pretty easy to go to an 820ohm/330uf, 2.7k/.68uf like and old marshall. The yba1 went through alot of changes throughout the 70's though and if you're going after a marshall sound I would just compare it to some marshall circuits and see where you might want to change things. The forums at www.metroamp.com have some great, easy to understand circuit layout drawings of just about any marshall that you would want to reference, also I can't remember his web site right now but if you google "clay finley" it should be one of the first ones that pops up, his site is a huge help, it gives step by step rundowns of every part of the older marshall circuits and it can really help you understand what changes will do what, it's pretty easy to relate to a traynor too, the layout is a bit different but you can follow wires and such and figure it out. But I would start small, it's a killer amp that doesn't need to bastardized to sound good, the only reason I messed with mine so much is that it was already a bit hacked when I got it. Okay that post got long fast, I'll stop here but I'll be happy to go more in depth if you like, hope it helps.
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

please, go into much more depth

i have no problem lowering the crap out of the bright cap value assuming i can get the treble & presence knobs to do more, right now they don't seem to change the tone much at all

i don't need it to be high gain at all, in fact a '59 ri bassman dimed has more gain than i'll ever use, so i'll probably end up using a 12at7 in v2, or maybe just 12ax7 long bottles in v1 & v2
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

Alright, I'll see what I can do to help, actually if you can post some rather close up pics of the guts of the amp I could be more specific based on what I see, like I said they changed the circuit quite a bit over the years.

1. I would change the tone stack to use a 33k slope resistor and a 500pf treble cap, the 33k should help to make the tone controls a bit more responsive as it will let some more signal through. My amp had a 1000pf treble cap stock, that is waaay too much imo, 500pf is just about right, anything close should work, I think I used a 510pf because it's what I had on hand. I would use a silver mica cap for the the treble cap, the ceramics can sound too gritty but that's all a matter of taste. If you have access to a carbon comp resistor for the slope resistor that can be a good place for one, if they're used in the right places in the circuit they have some nice vintage mojo, any resistor of the right value will be fine though, I wouldn't get too hung up on those details, you can always try different brands and types of resistors and caps later after you find the values you like.

2. The one meg pots for the volumes make a big difference, the 4meg pots that are stock are too spongy for my taste, you can change one at a time to see which you like better. I didn't play with bright caps because I didn't feel the need for them but kevlar3000's advice was good, that should get you where you want to go. Also if you decide that you want a master volume the simple "one wire" master worked great for me, it's really easy and all it takes is a 1meg pot and 1 piece of wire. The post phase inverter master that everyone hypes up didn't do too much for me on the traynor plus it will really screw with the way your presence works because of it's effect on the feedback loop.

3. For the negative feedback resistor I would just try piggy backing another 100k across the 100k thats in place, this will give you 50k and that will be just about the same as a 47k, resistors have a tolerance and there's plenty of 47k's out there that will measure 50k plus. Lowering the negative feedback resistor will make the presence much more responsive, there's simply more negative feedback for it to work with. With the nfb resistor change and the tonestack changes your controls should do alot more. Also if you increase the value of the cap on the presence pot it will make it effect more frequencies, increasing the value will make it start boosting upper mids along with the highs. I like using another .1 piggybacked across the stock one, this makes it boost a liitle more than just the very top end but still keeps it in the treble range, you can really fine tune your top end by using the right cap here.

I would try those things first, it wouldn't hurt to change the electrolitic caps in the amp, especially the ones in the bias supply they should be two 8uf caps, that value can be hard to find but 10uf is easier and they'll be just fine as long as they're high enough voltage. The two big filter caps sticking up from the chassis could probably use changing too(if your amp has them mounted there, they may be inside) if they're the big metal 40uf/40uf mallory cans they can be a major pain to change as they're soldered directly to the chassis, I couldn't get the 30+ year old solder holding them to melt, I had to cut them out. I used f&t 50/50uf to replace them and it really helped quiet alot of the background hum but if your amp doesn't hum much now I'd leave em in place, they're good caps and like I said alot of work to replace. I would change the bias caps for reliability though. Mine was identical on both channels aside from the bright cap but who knows what yours has, it's quite easy to change the cathode resistor and cathode bypass caps though, using the 820ohm/330uf and 2.7k/.68uf like an old marshall will give you a darker and meatier sound on one channel input and a brighter crunchier sound on the other, or you can jumper them and blend both to taste with the volume controls. I actually liked a 220uf or smaller cap for the 820ohm cathode though, 330uf is kinda overkill but it may suit you fine. You may just leave one channel as is and try the 2.7k/.68uf lead channel on the other, the stock would be closer sounding to the lower gain channel on a plexi.

See where that stuff gets you, I'll be happy to help you more if you need it, good luck and make sure you know how to drain those caps or you could get a shock that could kill you or make you wish it had. And pictures of the insides woud be great too, all I can do is kinda speculate as hardly any two from that era are the same.
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

well i don't find the treble knob too trebly, but i do find the bright channel too bright

anyone know the bright cap value on a jtm45?
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

just got done doin some mods

switched the bright cap to 300k, did the 1 meg pots, and the 33k slope resistor & it did exactly what i was wanting

thanks!
 
Re: changing values on traynor - help

The Tech section of THIS BOARD is a great resource for all things old-school Traynor. They go ape**** for 'em over there.
 
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