Clapton’s “The Fool” SG pickups

[Dave Locher]

I'm with you, Lew: I think Clapton never sounded as good again after he switched to Strats. (That must have been awesome to experience live!)
I don't even care for anything he did after that. Cream and Pete Townshend and Brian James of the early Damned are the reason I got an SG as my first Gibson. Part of my logic was "if Clapton sounded that great with one compared to now ["now" meaning at that time, 1980s] then I must get one! It did not disappoint.

 

[Lewguitar]

I'm with you, Lew: I think Clapton never sounded as good again after he switched to Strats. (That must have been awesome to experience live!)
I don't even care for anything he did after that. Cream and Pete Townshend and Brian James of the early Damned are the reason I got an SG as my first Gibson. Part of my logic was "if Clapton sounded that great with one compared to now ["now" meaning at that time, 1980s] then I must get one! It did not disappoint.

Clapton really admires Buddy Guy. I guess he just wanted to sound like that. And that means playing a Strat.

Clapton has described himself as being an egomaniac with an inferiority complex.

He threw away his personal sound that he had pioneered (Gibson through a Marshall turned all the way up), when he switched to a Fender Strat through a Fender Amp. But that's the sound of Buddy Guy.

Although I've seen Buddy playing through a Marshall.

Tore my ears off! Ice pick city. Didn't like it.

 

[GuitarStv]

Clapton really admires Buddy Guy. I guess he just wanted to sound like that. And that means playing a Strat.

Clapton has described himself as being an egomaniac with an inferiority complex.

He threw away his personal sound that he had pioneered (Gibson through a Marshall turned all the way up), when he switched to a Fender Strat through a Fender Amp. But that's the sound of Buddy Guy.

Although I've seen Buddy playing through a Marshall.

Tore my ears off! Ice pick city. Didn't like it.

Didn't Buddy Guy use Bassmans mostly? That's about as close to an early Marshall circuit as Fender amps get . . .

 

[Lewguitar]

Didn't Buddy Guy use Bassmans mostly? That's about as close to an early Marshall circuit as Fender amps get . . .

He did. Super Reverbs too. But neither sounds like a 100 watt, 4 EL34, plexi Marshall head through a 4 x 12 Marshall cab with Celestions.

I saw John Mayall back in the day with Mick Taylor playing a 50's Les Paul through a 4 x 10 Bassman.

He did get that British Blues sound for sure. Sounded great that night.

 

[Dave Locher]

Clapton really admires Buddy Guy. I guess he just wanted to sound like that. And that means playing a Strat.

Clapton has described himself as being an egomaniac with an inferiority complex.

He threw away his personal sound that he had pioneered (Gibson through a Marshall turned all the way up), when he switched to a Fender Strat through a Fender Amp. But that's the sound of Buddy Guy.

Although I've seen Buddy playing through a Marshall.

Tore my ears off! Ice pick city. Didn't like it.

I saw Buddy Guy in the late '80s, playing through a Marshall stack. It sounded huge - thick and full. Maybe he'd learned to turn down the treble by then? Or turn up the bass and mids? I know I can't make a strat sound that way!

 

[jeremy]

ive seen buddy a few times and his tone was always thin and really bright, usually playing through tweed bassmans

 

[beaubrummels]

Didn't Buddy Guy use Bassmans mostly? That's about as close to an early Marshall circuit as Fender amps get . . .

Also a tweed twin with the bass rolled off a touch and the treble not on 12 can be very Marshall-y. It's not the circuit at all, but it makes that sound with a mic on the cab. (Clapton even noticed the same in an interview I saw; after I happened across this in the studio.)

 

[Lewguitar]

ive seen buddy a few times and his tone was always thin and really bright, usually playing through tweed bassmans

Yes. That describes his tone.

I've seen him twice that I can remember.

First time it was around 1968. Buddy and Junior Wells, and Buddy played through a Super Reverb. I loved the show and loved his playing but I would never play with that super bright glassy tone he had. Too bright for my tastes.

The second time was in the 80's and that's when he played through the Marshall.. A JCM 800 1/2 stack I think. Ungodly thin and bright the way he had it set. And loud! Made my ears hurt.

I love his playing on albums though. Those Chess albums like I Was Walking Through the Woods. Vanguard albums like A Man and the Blues.

This is kind of similar to Clapton's Strat tone:

 

[SoPhx]

Also note that the Fool most likely used 300k pots, not the now-standard 500k. That makes a big difference, especially with the tone control all the way down.

Nahhh...the 300K pots came in 1973.

 

[Dave Locher]

Yes. That describes his tone.

I've seen him twice that I can remember.

First time it was around 1968. Buddy and Junior Wells, and Buddy played through a Super Reverb. I loved the show and loved his playing but I would never play with that super bright glassy tone he had. Too bright for my tastes.

The second time was in the 80's and that's when he played through the Marshall.. A JCM 800 1/2 stack I think. Ungodly thin and bright the way he had it set. And loud! Made my ears hurt.

I love his playing on albums though. Those Chess albums like I Was Walking Through the Woods. Vanguard albums like A Man and the Blues.

This is kind of similar to Clapton's Strat tone:

Oh, he was definitely loud when I saw him in the late 1980s, but I hate thin & bright guitar sounds and I thought his tone sounded good so I'm not sure what was up? I hate to much treble, always have. Maybe the sound guy killed a lot of treble? Polka dot Strat, Marshall. Don't know. I may have been wearing ear plugs?

 

[Ace Flibble]

Nahhh...the 300K pots came in 1973.

Not true. I've cleaned up a couple of 50s LPs that had 300k pots, one was a 1957 and the other was a 1958. In fact I first heard of 300k pots, period, when an ES-175D (IIRC 1953 or 54) came through the shop I was at at the time and that had... I forget which way around it was, but it was either a 500k volume and 300k tone or vice-versa. In any case, Gibson were using 300ks long before 1973. I'm not sure where you got that date other than that a quick Google search for it brings up another post on this forum where some random hazards a guess that 300ks came in around that time.

 

[beaubrummels]

Not true. I've cleaned up a couple of 50s LPs that had 300k pots, one was a 1957 and the other was a 1958. In fact I first heard of 300k pots, period, when an ES-175D (IIRC 1953 or 54) came through the shop I was at at the time and that had... I forget which way around it was, but it was either a 500k volume and 300k tone or vice-versa. In any case, Gibson were using 300ks long before 1973. I'm not sure where you got that date other than that a quick Google search for it brings up another post on this forum where some random hazards a guess that 300ks came in around that time.

It's not random hazard guesses. It's from reading the Gibson Kalamazoo drawings. There were a variety of pot values spec'd. The ES175CC drawing spec'd 300k volume 100k tone. The Melody Maker and Firebird I drawings spec'd 500k volume 250k tone. The Firebird VII / SG Custom drawing spec's "All controls 500k audio taper" then has a note in the corner saying "Models after 7-1-73 use 300k controls, Gibson part #70-028" What actually got used certainly could differ (Gibson is a bit famous for using parts on-hand back in the 50's/60's), or some guitars might have been repaired with different parts at least once before you got a hold of it - unless you have a definitive pedigree tracing the guitars you cleaned up to confirm what you saw was factory installed.

 

[BenPerkins]

Not true. I've cleaned up a couple of 50s LPs that had 300k pots, one was a 1957 and the other was a 1958. In fact I first heard of 300k pots, period, when an ES-175D (IIRC 1953 or 54) came through the shop I was at at the time and that had... I forget which way around it was, but it was either a 500k volume and 300k tone or vice-versa. In any case, Gibson were using 300ks long before 1973. I'm not sure where you got that date other than that a quick Google search for it brings up another post on this forum where some random hazards a guess that 300ks came in around that time.

FWIW - I received an email from Jon @ Gibson Customer Service. He indicated that 500k pots were used in all positions for ‘64 SGs and that the change to 300k occurred in the early 70’s.

Contact: customer.service@gibson.com



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Lewguitar]

FWIW - I received an email from Jon @ Gibson Customer Service. He indicated that 500k pots were used in all positions for ‘64 SGs and that the change to 300k occurred in the early 70’s.

Contact: customer.service@gibson.com



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Sounds about right.

People need to remember that Strats, Les Pauls, SG's, etc. were never created to make the sounds we make with them today. Marshall amps, wah wahs, fuzzes, overdrives, master volumes and high gain amps...none of that stuff existed. Surf guitar was about as aggressive as it got. It was mostly pop, jazz, country and maybe some rock a billy and blues. That's why it's fair to say that guys like Eric Clapton invented today's overdriven rock tones. Van Halen wanted Eric Clapton's Cream-era tone! No one had played like that before. Not BB King, not Freddie King, not James Burton, not the Ventures, not Dick Dale, not Duane Eddy, not Joe Maphis, not anyone. Clapton took all of those guys and then added himself and invented modern over driven rock guitar tone with bluesy finger vibrato and bluesy bent notes and bluesy phrasing. He was one of the rare guys who knew about using an unwound G string. George Harrison didn't. That's why on Beatles records you can hear George struggling to bend notes. It was Memphis guitarist Reggie Young who showed George the secret: an unwound G string. Clapton already knew it.

Clapton was the Eddie Van Halen of his day.

Then along came Jimi Hendrix.

 

[SoPhx]

Not true. I've cleaned up a couple of 50s LPs that had 300k pots, one was a 1957 and the other was a 1958. In fact I first heard of 300k pots, period, when an ES-175D (IIRC 1953 or 54) came through the shop I was at at the time and that had... I forget which way around it was, but it was either a 500k volume and 300k tone or vice-versa. In any case, Gibson were using 300ks long before 1973. I'm not sure where you got that date other than that a quick Google search for it brings up another post on this forum where some random hazards a guess that 300ks came in around that time.

Well, that's what the schematics say. Those 300/250 pots were mfg errors and not the stock compliment. But the 300K did become stock in '73---and no I didn't get that from some kids post on this forum.