Cons of a 2x12

[DeadSkinSlayer3]

Hey guys, how's it going?

Since I won't be playing live for quite a while, and won't be in any bands anytime soon, I'm considering ditching my 4x12 and getting a Mesa 2x12. I'd be using this for home (garage, can crank it ) and recording use.

I've read some reviews, and some people seem to say that 4x12's own all over 2x12's, while some say they're equal. I don't have enough experience with quality 2x12's, so Some advice would be appreciated. Thanks!

I'd use the search function, but I don't think this has been discussed besides for live tones, and I know a couple guys on here have gone down to a Mesa 2x12.

 

[TwilightOdyssey]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

Just my opinion:

The problem I have with 2x12s, in general, is that they don't have the point-specificity of a 1x12, or the balance & coverage of a 4x12. It's just too much of a compromise for me.

I've mic'd my 2x12, however, and got some nice results, like on this thrash clip:
http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3175622&q=hi
I mic'd each driver, seperately, to avoid any phase problems with mic'ing the whole cab, tho.

With the drivers being so close inside a 2x12, I also here some phase relationships that I don't particularily like, but that's just me.

When lifted off the ground (a milk crate is still the ultimate 2x12 stand, imo) you can get some nice tones from a 2x12. I use a full stack at home, however, not my 2x12.

 

[SlyFoxx]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

I've played with both and tell the truth I don't notice that much of a difference. The difference I do notice I think is mostly from the fact that my 4x12 is closed and the 2x12 is open. Both will sustain clean volume at insane levels. The 4 beams a bit more due to the closed back and the bottom is a wee bit tighter. The 2 sounds a bit more open but still has plenty of low end even if I'm playing my drop tuned carvin C G C F A D.

Might you consider only using 2 of the 4 in your 4x12 so you can push the amp a bit harder? If you have the room and are not going to move it much...

 

[DeadSkinSlayer3]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

Just my opinion:

The problem I have with 2x12s, in general, is that they don't have the point-specificity of a 1x12, or the balance & coverage of a 4x12. It's just too much of a compromise for me.

I've mic'd my 2x12, however, and got some nice results, like on this thrash clip:
http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3175622&q=hi
I mic'd each driver, seperately, to avoid any phase problems with mic'ing the whole cab, tho.

With the drivers being so close inside a 2x12, I also here some phase relationships that I don't particularily like, but that's just me.

When lifted off the ground (a milk crate is still the ultimate 2x12 stand, imo) you can get some nice tones from a 2x12. I use a full stack at home, however, not my 2x12.

I see what you mean. I'd have it elevated up about the height of a 4x12's top two speakers. I'd also only be micing one speaker, so no phase issues, especially when I'm only using a single 57.

Aside from the size and no need for it, I'm also thinking that I can get a better cab for cheaper. I love my Rivera, but the Mesa cabinets sound better, IMO.

 

[Funky P]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

How much are you willing to spend?

The Bogner oversized 2x12 has some big awesome sounds, without the need for milkcrates.

 

[DeadSkinSlayer3]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

I'm willing to possibly buy the Mesa new, depending on the price at the time, but I really don't want to spend more than 550 new, and the Bogners run that used.

 

[suislidE03]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

Heh, custom Splawn 2x12 loaded with celestions $550, but you will have to wait. Unloaded is $350. I should be getting mine this next week i hope.

 

[RGN]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

At this point in my life, I can't see EVER buying a 4X12 ever again. I still own a Genz-Benz 4X12 but won't for much longer. I actually bought a Mesa Recto 2X12 before I bought the Bogner OS 2X12. There is nothing wrong with the Mesa. But, I absolutely love the big Bogner 2X12. I feel comfortable saying it sounds just as big as many popular 4X12 cabs. It is big (size wise) for a 2X12 but reasonably portable. It will lay down in my car's trunk or easily fit in the back seat. The Mesa was too fat to lay down in my trunk. For recording, the Bogner 2X12 records like a 4X12 once you get the mic placement down. I'd doubt there is much of a difference tone wise but probably a little. I just don't miss my 4x12s one bit now that I have this badass Bogner. I fully understand the testosterone of having a raging 4X12 on stage but I guarantee my Bogner would never get overmatched by a 4X12 in a two guitar situation. I got my 2X12 new for $650 and you are right-- the go for around $550 used. I'd like to also try the Diezel 2X12. I hear it is a bit tighter than the Bogner but since I am not playing chug, chug death metal the Bogner works great for me. The Splawn is basically an exact duplicate of the Bogner (from what I can tell). I have heard NOTHING but great things about the Splawn 2X12.... that is what I would buy on your budget.

 

[XSSIVE]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

Go with a Splawn 2x12 or an EarCandy BuzzBomb and you wont have any of the typical lack of low end "problems" a typical 2x12 tends to have when compaired to a typical 4x12.

i see a 2x12 (Splawn or EarCandy) in my future to use alone and also with my 4x12 as a 6x12 setup!

-Mike

 

[TwilightOdyssey]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

RGN and XSSIVE both have a good point, tho it's not stated in so many words.

Both the Bogner and Earcandy cabs have the same internal volume as a 4x12, which is what lends itself to that massive tone. Dunno about the Splawn.

 

[DeadSkinSlayer3]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

I might look into an unloaded Splawn, in that case. Looking at Mesa 2x12 prices, they're running about 400 now, when they used to be 500 new. They're 559 new now, so about 600 after taxes. Not that bad.

I'm basically then, looking at:

Mesa w/V30's - 559 New - Pros: Matching, proven sound, no wait, available used, keeps resale value. Cons: not as 'big' sounding?

Bogner w/V30's - 550 Used - Big sounding, fills up space, keeps resale value. Expensive, heavier, might be hard to find.

Splawn w/V30's - 550 New - Big sounding, fills up space as well, no lack of low end. Heavier, wait time, shipping.

I'd also consider Avatar, but I'd imagine when we're discussing cabinets in this caliber, they fail in comparison.

For some reason I'm leaning towards the Mesa. I don't need to fill up space really, and it's not an issue of fitting it in a car or competing against other guitarists. I can't imagine a Mesa lacking low end though?

 

[Kac]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

I <3 my Mesa 2x12.

Rock On ~ Kac

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

Yeah, with 2-12's you really have to buy the best, or you're just wasting your money. The ones that tend to sound the best are the slightly taller ones with a panel above the speakers. The small and compact ones like the Marshall 1936 and Mesa, just seem a little lacking.

I have the Bogner 4-12 and large 2-12, just because I want to always have the appropriate setup. The 4-12 sounds so much richer that I almost always favor it, but if it's a gig where combo amps are the norm, I scale it down to the head/2-12.

 

[BigDreamer]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

My Mesa 2x12 with V-30s shakes the house, so IMO there is no worry of lack of bass. If your gut tells you Mesa, buy a Mesa. Though all of the above mentioned cabinets kick ass.

 

[kmcguitars]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

I have a old Randall 2x12 with the speakers in a diagonal pattern. To me it has all the thump and projection of a 4x12. At 24" in length I have no complaints getting it in and out of my trunk. But my Major pet peeve with it is finding a head that fits on it!.(A small box Marshall is 26") I hate when the head over hangs the cab.oed: A Fender Bassman fits as does my HRD. This is why I designed my 2204 Homebrew as small as possible.

 

[That90'sGuy]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

My closed back, smaller size Bogner Shiva 2x12'' packs a whole lot of sound from such a small package, so I wouldn't be surprised if the OS straddles the 4X12 type of sound.

 

[MVI]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

There are a ton of awesome 2X12's out there. The only one I've had was a Rivera Fandango ( EL34s ) that absolutely freaking ripped. I always felt that the 2X12 was the ultimate design. Big cabs and anything over 50 Watts just seems like an A-bomb in an arm wreslting match to me. My 2X12 weighed 75 plus pounds, and I own a sub-compact car. I don't tour with U2. Do the math.

Now I have a Rivera Clubster 45 Watt 1X12 at 38 lbs, and am much, much happier. Even so, I STILL use a power attenuator to get the full effect of playing max volume without hurting anyone. Maybe I'm getting too old.

 

[Marcel]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

They look ugly

 

[PUCKBOY99]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

I hear the G-Flex cabs are good ones.....ever try them?

I use a Marshall 1966A 2x12 & it sounds pretty huge. They look like a full size 4x12 but actually measure 24" x 24" & the speakers go in on a diagonal, not side by side.

And like someone mentioned, if you get them off the floor, it helps too.

 

[Scott_F]

Re: Cons of a 2x12

Someone mentioned this above, but just disconnect the two bottom speakers on your 4x12 until your GAS subsides. Rewiring it will change the impedance, but you're set for a while.

I'm pretty impressed with the 2x12 I had mojo make for me. They sell a bluesbreaker style 2x12 that is closed back. I had them make it an open back. It has two panels on the back, one at the top, one at the bottom that cover up about 40%-50% of the opening. It's oversized so you get a really large sound out of it. I'm betting it would be less expensive to buy than a new brand name cab. Plus you can put in your own speakers and choose your tolex/cloth. Just my two cents if you HAVE to buy a 2x12.

Otherwise re-wire that 4x12. An interesting way to rewire it would be to wire up the top left speaker and the bottom right one only. I like that diagonal type layout.