Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

[suislidE03]

Wow guys, today i finally dimed my Laney and I must say it was a different sound than what i was used to. Of course without my minimass it wouldnt have been possible in my friends apartment. I finally had to turn the gain knobs DOWN to keep it under control, usually i keep them maxed out most of the time. After a few minutes of unbelief, i started packing up my things to leave and i unplugged one of the cables and stuck it into the cab, and reseated my attenuator. I wasnt expecting to get a burn on my fingers from it. It was a bit hotter than tubes usually get. I was wowed for a while after this whole experience.. do attenuators usually get this hot when dealing with that much power? I hope nothing inside was damaged... :laugh2:

 

[Sune]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Why is it that Laney's are so damn loud? Everytime I read a review of a Laney amp, the person who has it says that it's damn loud, and louder than most of his/her other amps??? Imagine when I order my 100 watter Laney tomorrow :laugh2:

 

[Davey]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

yep. laneys are fukkin LOUD!

 

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

You can end up frying your output transformer.....I don't like attenuators very much.

 

[Sune]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

yep. laneys are fukkin LOUD!

BTW. what happened yesterday?? The amp you were looking at??

 

[Davey]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

BTW. what happened yesterday?? The amp you were looking at??

guy is making excuses not to sell.. he's got to go on a business trip all of a sudden and will be absent for 6 weeks :bsflag:


what i think was the problem.. he listed it as $275 instead of $325 as it was before (it's easy to mix them up in slovene currency cos 325 makes 65k and 275 makes 56k) i held him for it and he said call tomorrow i got some one looking at it in the morning. i call him and he said he's going on a business trip and when he comes back he will trade it for some ibeenhad guitar.. i mean.. how stupid can you get??

 

[Sune]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Well, sorry to hear that. It's always dissapointing when you've fallen in love with an amp and then realize you can't get it, but the worst thing is when the seller lies to you in such an obvious way that you can sense it easily.

 

[TheArchitect]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Thats how they work. The volume they absorb gets turned into other types of evergy including heat.

As for damaging transformers, there are arguments on both sides of the fence. The old Scholz stuff could cause problems but I haven't seen/heard any issues with the current generation of stuff. Amps blow transformers on occasion when you run them flat out. Its just more common cause people ARE running them flat out now where they never could before w/o an attenuator because it was too damn loud

 

[That90'sGuy]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

This is why I play low wattage EL-84 equipped amps. You get that wonderful tube breakup sound at lower levels instead of having to fork out tons of cash for an attenuator and worry about damaging an expensive high wattage amp as well.

I don't trust attenuators. If they're used mildly, I think they can be a useful tool, but if they're abused I think they will really take a toll on your transformer and your tubes.

 

[some_dude]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

I don't trust attenuators. If they're used mildly, I think they can be a useful tool, but if they're abused I think they will really take a toll on your transformer and your tubes.

The problem isn't the attenuator, the problem is that you can crank an amp to unreasonable levels and maintain reasonable volumes.

If you were to dime the gain and master volume on an unattenuated amp the OT would quit just as soon as it would on an attenuated amp......the only difference is that in the first case you're ears would be bleeding.

There's nothing wrong or unsafe about using attenuation.....as long as you don't use your amp in an normally unsafe manner.....for instance, like the way the threadstarter was using it.

 

[kevlar3000]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

What attenuator, what power is is rated for? It is definately normal for an attenuator to get warm or hot, you just don't want to be putting too much power through them. As I said on a recent thread, I don't believe an attenuator, if used in its proper application, is gonna harm any amp. I would have expected to see at least one of my amps fry in the past three years if this was the case. If this was indeed a trend, I don't Weber or THD ( as an example) would put their name on the product. It would be far too damaging to other aspects of their biz.

 

[suislidE03]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Ok guys, seems like people are indirectly calling me an idiot for doing this. I had NO idea this could potentially damage an OT because of using an attenuator.

Care to explain a little more? I would be very pissed if i killed the OT in this amp.. i probly wouldnt have the cash to fix it for a while.

 

[some_dude]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Ok guys, seems like people are indirectly calling me an idiot for doing this. I had NO idea this could potentially damage an OT because of using an attenuator.

Care to explain a little more? I would be very pissed if i killed the OT in this amp.. i probly wouldnt have the cash to fix it for a while.

Most modern master volume amps aren't designed to have their master cranked and their preamp gain cranked....it's just too much power for the OT to handle, and will potentially burn it out.

Using an attenuator is fine....just don't use it with both the master and pregain dimed. If you can, try running it upto the setting you want with the amp unattenuated, and if it sounds good it'll be safe to run that same setting attenuated. If your bottom end is all f*cked up because the power tubes are being driven so hard they've over-compressed/squished, then you probably shouldn't run that hot while attenuated.

 

[Davey]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

only indirectly


you are running your amp harder. something you just cant do without an attenuator, thus you MIGHT damage the OT.

 

[suislidE03]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Im not saying that davey, i know it will run fine without the attenuator. it was because of the VOLUME and the fact i was in my friends APARTMENT. Originally in my post i said i had to drop the preamp gain because the power tube distortion when cranked added too much and made it flubby sounding. So instead of diming it like usual, i had to drop it to 7. Im pretty sure the attenuator was hot just because it is rated for 50 watts, and so is my laney. Though everyone says laneys are extremely loud for their rating, im sure it could crank out more than 50 watts. I will admit that running it at 7-8 did sound better than at 9 or 10 because of that last sentence daisy

 

[TheArchitect]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Im not saying that davey, i know it will run fine without the attenuator. it was because of the VOLUME and the fact i was in my friends APARTMENT. Originally in my post i said i had to drop the preamp gain because the power tube distortion when cranked added too much and made it flubby sounding. So instead of diming it like usual, i had to drop it to 7. Im pretty sure the attenuator was hot just because it is rated for 50 watts, and so is my laney. Though everyone says laneys are extremely loud for their rating, im sure it could crank out more than 50 watts. I will admit that running it at 7-8 did sound better than at 9 or 10 because of that last sentence daisy

But turning down the preamp isn't the point. If I am understanding you correctly you turned down the preamp a little and left the master on 10. Driving the output(read master volume) at max is what puts transformers at risk. There is no need to run it flat out. If you are getting your sound at 5 w/o attenuation there is no need to go higher with one. You are just wearing things out faster.

 

[Quencho092]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Would upgrading the OT and installing a fan help?

I typically run my DRRI with the volume at 7 or 8, and that sucker got REALLY REALLY hot. After an 8 hour practice yesterday (8 hours!), the pilot light started to dim a bit when i would play chords, so i shut it down right away. The power tranny was HOT! I put a 12V computer fan right behind where the rectifier used to be (now running the SS mini copper cap in its place) The amp has been on for a few hours and is running cool now

 

[Scott_F]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

some style attentuators get rather toasty. I had one of those little weber things before they were called a mini-mass. Got so freaking hot I never used it again. I was worried about melting the tolex on the back of my amp or burning my carpet. And, I didn't play it all that long.

I'm done with those toys. If I ever decided to go that route again, I'd probably get a THD hot Plate or a Weber Mass. Wonder why they call that a Hot Plate....

 

[greendy123]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Do you guys know if cranking the master volume up, but leaving the pre amp low drives power tubes hard or not cause the volume heard is just average.

 

[suislidE03]

Re: Cranked amp to 10.. thought attenuator was about to melt

Scott, every time i have used mine it never got above room temp even with the volume at 5-6. This was the only time its ever been hot, but thats with the amp cranked. Im sure if i got a 100 watt version it wouldnt even break a sweat, but then again i would have to sell this one and fork out over $200. It does its job very well, so I dont think i will ever sell it unless it fails.

Anyway, you guys act as if my amp will explode if i crank it again, when amps such as Marshalls need to be cranked to the same volume levels to get their tone. Are Laneys not supposed to take this handling? I mean come on guys, speak realistically. Dont say that i am risking my amp by turning the volume to 8 or 9, thats obvious. But if you are saying it will blow my OT the next time i do it then OK, i will listen.